Turn Off Ads?
Page 6 of 9 FirstFirst ... 23456789 LastLast
Results 76 to 90 of 125

Thread: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

  1. #76
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Atlanta, Ga.
    Posts
    10,904

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by gilpdawg View Post
    Rany Jazayerli and Joe Sheehan were talking about this on their podcast this week. Sheehan thinks a player should have more of a track record before being considered an All Star. Jazayerli thinks the opposite. I'm in the Sheehan camp. It's the All Star game. Not "guys with a hot streak in a small sample" game. Jack Armstrong started the 1990 game for the NL and didn't even make the postseason rotation. He wasn't good. He had one half of a good season. A system that rewards those type of seasons is flawed, IMO.
    So is a system that gives spots to 30-something guys with bum knees and batting .220 but are voted in because they're still popular from when they were good five years prior.

    I'd rather get some new blood in once in a while and have it merit-based rather than popularity-based.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda


  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #77
    Stat geek...and proud
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    New Paris, OH
    Posts
    3,183

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    So is a system that gives spots to 30-something guys with bum knees and batting .220 but are voted in because they're still popular from when they were good five years prior.

    I'd rather get some new blood in once in a while and have it merit-based rather than popularity-based.
    That is true as well. It should be somewhere in between. When I pick my All Stars I tend to look at the past 3 seasons. That takes out the Ryan Howards of the world and the Bryan LaHairs of the world.

  4. #78
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    16,358

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by gilpdawg View Post
    Rany Jazayerli and Joe Sheehan were talking about this on their podcast this week. Sheehan thinks a player should have more of a track record before being considered an All Star. Jazayerli thinks the opposite. I'm in the Sheehan camp. It's the All Star game. Not "guys with a hot streak in a small sample" game. Jack Armstrong started the 1990 game for the NL and didn't even make the postseason rotation. He wasn't good. He had one half of a good season. A system that rewards those type of seasons is flawed, IMO.
    But what system is that? I'm not aware of a true system in place which determines between small sample stars or aging vets.

    For example, the players voted Lahair in. How should that be rectified?

  5. #79
    Member reds44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    29,517

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Frazier is 4th in the NL in OPS among third basemen (granted it's a distant 4th), and everything says he's been a great defender this year. I've been one of his harshest critics this year, but the NL 3rd baseman suck. It's not as crazy of a thought as it seems.
    Last edited by reds44; 07-05-2013 at 08:55 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Scooter View Post
    A little bit off topic, but do you guys think that Jesse Winker profiles more like Pete Rose or is he just the next Hal Morris??

  6. Likes:

    Edd Roush (07-05-2013),LoganBuck (07-05-2013),RedEye (07-05-2013)

  7. #80
    High five!
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Irvine, CA
    Posts
    6,976

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by powersackers View Post
    Run Prevention Unit?

    "Hey, can I get a new Run Prevention Unit over to GABP? Our existing one is on the fritz. Oh and while you're at it, bring over a new run creation unit -we could use an upgrade".
    Mock if you must but that's what ERA is measuring.

  8. #81
    nothing more than a fan Always Red's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Cincy West and WNC
    Posts
    5,558

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by nate View Post
    Mock if you must but that's what ERA is measuring.
    Run Prevention Unit

    Love it, that's exactly what it is.
    sorry we're boring

  9. #82
    Bullpen or whatever RedEye's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    9,295

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Law & Order: Run Prevention Unit
    “Every level he goes to, he is going to compete. They will know who he is at every level he goes to.” -- ED on EDLC

  10. Likes:

    Always Red (07-05-2013),Big Klu (07-06-2013),Joseph (07-05-2013),powersackers (07-05-2013),remdog (07-05-2013),Wonderful Monds (07-05-2013)

  11. #83
    I rig polls REDREAD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    ohio
    Posts
    29,254

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by mth123 View Post
    If there was room for one Red's pitcher, would it be Bailey, Latos or Leake?
    Great question.

    I'd pick Latos over Bailey.

    As of today, they are within 1 IP of each other.
    Latos has been more consistently dominatating.
    Latos ERA 3.03 Homer 3.57

    A half a run per game is a big difference.

    Homer has the edge on WHIP though (1.06 vs 1.20)

    Both are having good years, I just think Latos has made a bigger contribution, and I know people hate the W-L record, but it is also reflected in that. Latos has an edge overall, IMO.
    [Phil ] Castellini celebrated the team's farm system and noted the team had promising prospects who would one day be great Reds -- and then joke then they'd be ex-Reds, saying "of course we're going to lose them". #SellTheTeamBob

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  12. Likes:

    remdog (07-05-2013)

  13. #84
    Stat geek...and proud
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    New Paris, OH
    Posts
    3,183

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    But what system is that? I'm not aware of a true system in place which determines between small sample stars or aging vets.

    For example, the players voted Lahair in. How should that be rectified?
    By letting me pick the teams.

  14. #85
    Box of Frogs edabbs44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    NJ
    Posts
    16,358

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    Frazier is 4th in the NL in OPS among third basemen (granted it's a distant 4th), and everything says he's been a great defender this year. I've been one of his harshest critics this year, but the NL 3rd baseman suck. It's not as crazy of a thought as it seems.
    Between Valbuena, Chris Johnson and Freese, they are a collective 25ish PAs from pushing him to 7th. Freese and Valbuena are only 3 and change PAs under the requirement and Johnson is 17.5, but way ahead of Frazier in OPS.

  15. #86
    breath westofyou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    PDX
    Posts
    57,002

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by gilpdawg View Post
    Rany Jazayerli and Joe Sheehan were talking about this on their podcast this week. Sheehan thinks a player should have more of a track record before being considered an All Star. Jazayerli thinks the opposite. I'm in the Sheehan camp. It's the All Star game. Not "guys with a hot streak in a small sample" game. Jack Armstrong started the 1990 game for the NL and didn't even make the postseason rotation. He wasn't good. He had one half of a good season. A system that rewards those type of seasons is flawed, IMO.
    A famous Bill James article in this scenario used the hot Toby Harrah as an example of someone who was getting shouts of he belongs in!! All while in reality he was just having a few good months and would regress and wasn't a big enough star to ride that streak to a starting slot

    He did regress, he didn't start

  16. #87
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    21,390

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    Between Valbuena, Chris Johnson and Freese, they are a collective 25ish PAs from pushing him to 7th. Freese and Valbuena are only 3 and change PAs under the requirement and Johnson is 17.5, but way ahead of Frazier in OPS.
    Some years just aren't good years for a position concerning the AS game. Behind David Wright, one could argue that there isn't a deserving back up for the NL-especially if in season performance is heavily weighted. Certainly the AL holds a big advantage over the NL at third. But then again both Fraizier are on pace for 4 WAR seasons despite their relatively unspectacular ways of doing it. That's legit all-star territory IMHO.

    Despite the AL getting an indisputable check for thirdbase concerning advantages, the NL backup will probably win the game for the NL. maybe Frazier will get selected and get a walk off hit?
    "This isn’t stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  17. #88
    High five!
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Irvine, CA
    Posts
    6,976

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    A famous Bill James article in this scenario used the hot Toby Harrah as an example of someone who was getting shouts of he belongs in!! All while in reality he was just having a few good months and would regress and wasn't a big enough star to ride that streak to a starting slot

    He did regress, he didn't start
    Toby Harrah, that's a blast from the past. It seems he was in every pack of cards I bought as a kid.

  18. #89
    High five!
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Irvine, CA
    Posts
    6,976

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    Law & Order: Run Prevention Unit
    Solid.

  19. #90
    Member 757690's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Venice
    Posts
    33,295

    Re: Beyond the Box Score All-Stars: Interesting Reds choices and non-choices

    In football, they call all the offensive players on the field during a field goal attempt, "the field goal unit." Every player plays an important part, but the kicker is the one who gets credit for the points, and rightfully so.

    Just because others are involved in preventing runs on defense, doesn't mean that the pitcher shouldn't be the guy held most responsible for prevention or lack of prevention of runs.

    Yes, the entire defense is the run prevention unit, but the person who is repsonsible for most of it is the guy who starts each pitch holding the ball on the mound. Claiming that because others are involved in run prevention, we should ignore ERA, or diminish its importance, is a classic over reaction that many amateur saber guys make.
    Hoping to change my username to 75769024


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | Gallen5862 | Plus Plus | Powel Crosley | RedlegJake | The Operator