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Thread: One simple fix that costs nothing

  1. #121
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    It's being asserted here that grouping them will have a net positive effect...I'm not sure that's true.
    Only one real way to know. Do it for a few weeks.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

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  3. #122
    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    I'd be willing to give it a try...just to get him going. He needs a change just to alter his routine and mindset IMO. But outside of Phillips, I really don't see a good choice to hit second. And outside of Phillips, I don't see a really good choice to hit cleanup either. Not if we DO want to break up the lefties. And that IS a good idea if possible.
    Phillips is an okay choice for second. Votto might be better.

    To me it is roaringly obvious that Bruce should be hitting cleanup. His splits against lefty pitchers are -- to use Kc61 and Brutus' word of the day -- "negligibly" different from his stats against RHP. The L-R-L lineup construction only matters if your lefty batters struggle against LHP. Bruce has the most homers vs. lefties of any LH batter in baseball since 2010.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  4. #123
    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    Only one real way to know. Do it for a few weeks.
    More like a few months, if not a whoke season. We're talking a handful of runs over the course if a season.
    "Iíll kind of have a foot on the back of my own butt. Thatís just how I do things.Ē -- Bryan Price, 10/22/2013

  5. #124
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    This is not something that is too hard to see happening.
    We see it on a nightly basis.

    They can move the deck chairs, but the ship is sinking. They need another hitter.
    "Even a bad day at the ballpark beats the snot out of most other good days. I'll take my scorecard and pencil and beer and hot dog and rage at the dips and cheer at the highs, but I'm not ever going to stop loving this game and this team and nobody will ever take that away from me." Roy Tucker October 2010

  6. #125
    EMAW
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by malcontent View Post
    Howzabout Alex Gordon?
    Royals would want Bailey, Hamilton and something else
    Gordon is a really good player , not great, he is one of the two face of the franchise guys in KC, he will be in KC forever

  7. #126
    Member BungleBengals's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    I like the idea of setting the lineup like this:

    Choo
    Votto
    Phillips
    Bruce
    Frazier
    LF
    Cozart
    C
    P

    Yes the bottom of the order is terrible and will likely get the pitcher rhythm thing going too. But too many times this season do we already see that happening. How many times have we seen it where our C and P come up to bat and get the 1st and 2nd outs? Then see Choo get a walk or a base hit only to see "Pop Up" Cozart get the third out. I see this as bitter sweet because even though we didn't produce anything and we wasted Choo getting on base, we will at least start the next inning with Votto, Phillips, and Bruce which gives us a high chance producing something.

    The goal of the lineup should be to produce runs. Our current lineup has been on a downward spiral since the beginning of the season. Last month and this month (minus the 13 run anomaly) we are scoring around 3.5 runs a game. By placing all of our better hitters near the top of the lineup we are giving our team the best chance to produce runs. They are getting more ABs and our RBI machines are batting 2nd, 3rd, and 4th with Frazier likely to add to his RBI by batting 5th.

    The only thing I would tell the bottom of the lineup with whoever is in LF, C, and P along with Cozart is to work the count. Get the opposing pitcher's PC up so the top of the lineup can reap the benefits of facing a tired SP or a bullpen arm.
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  8. #127
    GO XAVIER! toledodan's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by EMAW View Post
    Royals would want Bailey, Hamilton and something else
    Gordon is a really good player , not great, he is one of the two face of the franchise guys in KC, he will be in KC forever
    alex gordon is a nice player for KC but is highly overrated by the fans here. he does play gold glove defense.
    there's nothing like bowling a 300 game! 13 now and retired.


    Ricky henderson has a higher OBP than C. patterson and he's retired. C. Trent 6-14-2008

  9. #128
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Isn't it a little silly that to avoid what might happen in one inning - a LOOGY faces Bruce and Votto in a close/late situation and gets them both out - that Dusty's solution is to guarantee a bad hitter hits between our best hitters all game long?

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  11. #129
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    Choo has .418 OBP.
    Votto has .431 OBP

    Phillips and Bruce lead the team in RBIs largely from driving in Choo and Votto.

    So why do you need a middle man. Just go Choo, Votto, Phillips, Bruce, Frazier, LF, C, Cozart.

    To Sir Charles' point, the 6-9 of the order would be really, really bad (and that's almost half the lineup).

    Moving Cozart out of the two hole would help, but it's not going to fix every problem the team has.
    This.

    The problem is the apparent magical thinking that spreading crap around will make it smell better.

    Nothing you can do with the batting order fixes the problems of people not hitting. The best you can do is maximizing your chances to take advantage of the successes. These things we know:

    - Runs are scored when good outcomes are strung together
    - You only have 3 outs to string together good outcomes
    - Even the very best players make outs more often than not
    - Players have relatively little control over when they have their successes and failures

    The conclusion is obvious. Maximizing the odds of good things happening involves two basic things: 1) Giving the most opportunities to the best hitters and 2) Creating an order where the good events you get are mostly likely to happen in the same inning.

    Putting bad hitters between the good ones does two things: It takes marginal (9th inning) plate appearances away from better hitters and it decreases the likelihood of there being good things happening at the same time among your best hitters. It's making it less likely that something good Votto does matter in order to make it more likely that something Ryan Hanigan does matter. Well, Votto does more good staff than Hanigan, so you're hurting more than than you're helping.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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  13. #130
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    I would go

    Choo
    Heisey
    Votto
    Phillips
    Bruce
    Frazier
    Mesoraco
    Cozart

    or

    Choo
    Votto
    Phillips
    Bruce
    Frazier
    Mesoraco
    Heisey
    Cozart

    This team absolutely needs another RH bat, power and average. Either way, Cozart should bat 8th. We have a flawed lineup and our manager exposes it further and that is insane.

  14. #131
    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    This team needs a new manager more than they need another RH bat. His absolutely inability to adjust to what he has rather than what he wants is killing this lineup.

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  16. #132
    High five! nate's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    Very possible. And while those numbers are pretty convincing...they're still based upon what guys have been doing in different situations. Moving Votto to the 2 hole might make him produce LESS. Same with the other guys. I just think that you can't just plug and play with PEOPLE. Numbers, yes. People, no.
    Given enough PAs, I think it's likely a hitter performs to his career number regardless of lineup spot.

    I find it fascinating how close the lineup estimator came to the runs scored so far this season based on OBP and SLG.
    "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

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  18. #133
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    This team needs a new manager more than they need another RH bat. His absolutely inability to adjust to what he has rather than what he wants is killing this lineup.
    He's like a grandpa. Love the guy, but damn if he won't think of doing anything differently than his way of doing it.
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

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  20. #134
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    This team needs a new manager more than they need another RH bat. His absolutely inability to adjust to what he has rather than what he wants is killing this lineup.
    Reds have one position player hitting over .275. Reds have three position players hitting over .750 OPS.

    I wouldn't mind a new manager, I believe in term limits for managers. I think a fresh eye is good every few years.

    But the team's hitting is limited to very few players. Don't agree it's managerial more than personnel.

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    Always Red (07-09-2013), dfs (07-08-2013), mth123 (07-08-2013)

  22. #135
    5.3 Posts Abv Replacement BluegrassRedleg's Avatar
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    Re: One simple fix that costs nothing

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