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Thread: The lack of plate discipline and patience for Reds hitters

  1. #16
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    Re: The lack of plate discipline and patience for Reds hitters

    Lau and Hriniak are outliers. There just aren't any guys like that in the game today. These aren't 21 year old kids in A-ball. These are major league hitters, they are what they are.

    Look at what happened to Stubbs when he changed his approach. When he was all grip and rip he was very good. Had a 4 win season. Then they tried to make him a "leadoff hitter" which is a stupid concept in and of itself (just put a high OBP guy there and leave him be) and he got all jacked up. That's a guy you didn't want to take pitches. Swing at the first fastball strike. Instead they had him taking pitches and boom, down 0-2 before you knew it. Statistically it was a very slight difference, but when you watched him you knew he was letting hittable pitches go by.
    Last edited by gilpdawg; 07-09-2013 at 10:27 AM.

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  3. #17
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    Re: The lack of plate discipline and patience for Reds hitters

    Quote Originally Posted by BASEBALL FAN View Post
    Again, a hitting coach can impart a philosophy on the hitters, much like a pitching coach can. I know Lau did, Hriniak did, and if you read Williams' book The Science of Hitting, he did as well--when he took over the Washington Senators in 1969.

    It is not about taking walks, but rather it is about managing the hitters mechanical and mental approaches to hitting, and most importantly to help them realize their potential and maximize their confidence--whether that is hitting early in the count, late in the count... taking pitches... what have you.

    With the Reds hitters, you are dealing with --four veteran starters, and then four marginal/average baseball players who are still trying to find their way in this game.

    Generally, the younger and/or inexperience players have trouble laying off or identifying breaking pitches--thus, Baker and/or Jacoby, are instructing them to attack in the early count when they are more likely to get a fastball, then to set themselves up for pitcher's pitches.
    Pitchers are so much better today than in 1969 it isn't funny. They throw harder (meaning there is less reaction time) and they throw better pitches (how many guys do you see throwing those big looping slow curves anymore? Guys are throwing power curves in the 80's and sliders in the mid 80's to 90 MPH. I am sure it was a lot easier to teach guys how to adjust to things when everything was slower than it is when everything is faster. Homer Bailey's slider is faster than the average Major League fastball was when Greg Maddux was a rookie. Hitting is harder today than ever before.

    As for the youth part of it, Devin Mesoraco and Derrick Robinson are the two youngest players on the team (position wise) and they are 25. If you can't figure out a breaking ball by now, you probably aren't going to. By the time you are 25, you have seen thousands of professional breaking balls. If you still can't figure them out, you aren't going to.

  4. #18
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    Re: The lack of plate discipline and patience for Reds hitters

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post

    As for the youth part of it, Devin Mesoraco and Derrick Robinson are the two youngest players on the team (position wise) and they are 25. If you can't figure out a breaking ball by now, you probably aren't going to. By the time you are 25, you have seen thousands of professional breaking balls. If you still can't figure them out, you aren't going to.
    Which is why Baker/Jacoby has incorporated an approach to swing early and often in the count, so that they are hitting in fastball counts, and not leaving themselves to pitcher's counts and breaking balls.

    Williams' book was about hitting what you're capable of, as well as practicing and focusing on your weaknesses. It's a good read--pick it up.

    In fact, Votto himself is a Williams disciple. http://www.courier-journal.com/artic...eds%20baseball
    Last edited by BASEBALL FAN; 07-09-2013 at 07:47 PM. Reason: added link

  5. #19
    Moderator RedlegJake's Avatar
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    Re: The lack of plate discipline and patience for Reds hitters

    Every hitter should be a Williams disciple. Votto is remiscent of Williams in his studious approach added to natural ability. Of course no one was as good as Teddy imo. The greatest hitter ever with only Ruth and Cobb being comparable.

    The offense is struggling because the cogs are all slumping. BP is ice cold, Joey can be avoided, Choo is cold, Bruce is not in a helpless streak but he's not hot, when these guys don't hit the Reds are going to struggle. HiC comes back...posts beastly numbers in LF and it hasn't helped. Replace C, Cozie, Frazier, if the big dogs don't hunt it will not matter. I can't imagine anyone hitting better than Chris the past week but it hasn't helped. BP and Choo need to get going again...that will make Joey effective again and make Bruce's power more dangerous. Then a trade for a RH bat might help. As long as the key cogs are cold or can be contained this offense is going to flounder. Good thing is all the key guys will hit again...just when?


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