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Thread: Reds Grades so far...

  1. #1
    Member Ironman92's Avatar
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    Reds Grades so far...

    Based on what you expected from them

    Votto B+
    Phillips A-
    Cozart C-
    Frazier B
    Bruce B+
    Choo A-
    Paul B
    Heisey C (injury)
    Robinson B+
    Hanigan C
    Mesoraco C
    Hannahan C
    Itzturis B

    Arroyo B+
    Leake A
    Latos A-
    Cueto C (injury)
    Bailey B+

    Chapman B+
    Parra A-
    Broxton C (injury)
    Hoover B
    Simon B
    Cingrani B+
    LeCure B

    Price A-
    Dusty B-
    Jacoby C
    Speier C

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  3. #2
    Member RedsfaninMT's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    Grade inflation!

    A= Leake, Parra
    A- = Choo
    B = Phillips, Bruce, Chapman, Parch, Arroyo, Hoover, Simon, Cingrani, Ondrusek
    B- = Paul, Robinson,
    C+ = Izturis, Votto, Lecure
    C- = Bailey, Mesoraco, Hannahan, Latos
    D+=Frazier
    D= Cozart, Heisey, Cueto, Marshall, Broxton
    F= Hannigan

    As I look at it, the only players who deserve above a "C" are those performing better than expected. Votto is performing as I expected. Many (too many) are doing far worse than I expected. Perhaps unfairly, I graded on an expectation of a healthy season.
    I had high hopes and expectations of a 100 win season, obviously naively so, but not many are dong better than I thought they would.

    I will give Ludwick an incomplete.
    Last edited by RedsfaninMT; 07-17-2013 at 07:15 PM.

  4. #3
    I don't want to grow up Red Raindog's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    A= Leake, Parra, Choo

    B = Phillips, Bruce, Arroyo, Hoover, Simon, Cingrani, Latos (Reds have won 12 of his 18 starts)

    B- = Paul, LeCure

    C+ = Izturis, Robinson, Bailey

    C = Votto (defense really bothers me), Hannrahan, Chapman

    D+=Frazier, Mesoraco (defense & pitch framing & catching the ball bother me), Cozart (his extra base hits and defense save him some here)

    D= Heisey, Cueto, Marshall, Broxton-- granted injuries are the cause of these

    F= Hannigan - I know he's beat up but dang he's been far worse than I expected
    The older I get - the better I was

    and yes - I hate the Cardinals (Reds fan since 1958)

  5. #4
    Member NebraskaRed's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    Votto B
    Phillips A-
    Cozart C (had him at D, but his defense has been pretty sharp, Plus, I never expected much from him offensively anyway.)
    Frazier D (he's struggling...bad)
    Bruce B+
    Choo A (he's done even more than I'd hoped for from him)
    Paul B-
    Heisey C (injury, but I like what he's done since coming back from the DL)
    Robinson B-
    Hanigan C
    Mesoraco C
    Hannahan B-
    Itzturis B

    Arroyo B+
    Leake A (way, way better than I thought he'd be this year)
    Latos A-
    Cueto C (injury)
    Bailey B+ (a bump up for getting the no-hitter. That's some impressive extra credit)

    Chapman B+
    Parra A (started rough, but he's really improved)
    Broxton C
    Hoover B
    Simon B+
    Cingrani B+
    LeCure B
    Partch B (don't forget about Partch!)
    Ondrusek B

  6. #5
    I don't want to grow up Red Raindog's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    Quote Originally Posted by NebraskaRed View Post
    Votto B
    Phillips A-
    Cozart C (had him at D, but his defense has been pretty sharp, Plus, I never expected much from him offensively anyway.)
    Frazier D (he's struggling...bad)
    Bruce B+
    Choo A (he's done even more than I'd hoped for from him)
    Paul B-
    Heisey C (injury, but I like what he's done since coming back from the DL)
    Robinson B-
    Hanigan C
    Mesoraco C
    Hannahan B-
    Itzturis B

    Arroyo B+
    Leake A (way, way better than I thought he'd be this year)
    Latos A-
    Cueto C (injury)
    Bailey B+ (a bump up for getting the no-hitter. That's some impressive extra credit)

    Chapman B+
    Parra A (started rough, but he's really improved)
    Broxton C
    Hoover B
    Simon B+
    Cingrani B+
    LeCure B
    Partch B (don't forget about Partch!)
    Ondrusek B
    Heh -- I did forget your last two!
    The older I get - the better I was

    and yes - I hate the Cardinals (Reds fan since 1958)

  7. #6
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    A= Leake, Latos, Cueto (when healthy), Chapman

    B+= Bruce, Parra, Choo, Cingrani

    B= Votto, Phillips, Simon, Hoover (despite a rough start), Paul, LeCure, Robinson, Arroyo

    B-= Hannahan, Izturis, Mesoraco

    C+= Dusty and coaching staff

    C= Bailey, Frazier

    D= Cozart, Hanigan


    Overall I would give the team a B. A decent grade, but I have a lot more concerns about the team now than when the year started. Marshall, Cueto and especially Ludwick coming back and playing like it was 2012 would cure almost all my concerns.
    Last edited by NeilHamburger; 07-17-2013 at 07:25 PM.

  8. #7
    Member SirFelixCat's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    Votto C
    Phillips B+
    Cozart C- Only his defense keeps him this high
    Frazier D Oof. Might we have overestimated his ability?
    Bruce B+
    Choo A Can't really ask for more than he's done
    Paul B
    Heisey C (injury, but I like what he's done since coming back from the DL)
    Robinson B-
    Hanigan D
    Mesoraco D He simply isn't progressing like I had hoped
    Hannahan D I knew he was mostly a glove, but oof, NO power at the plate at all
    Itzturis C I didn't have hopes for him, so he hasn't disappointed

    Arroyo B+
    Leake A
    Latos B+
    Cueto INC (No grade due to injuries)
    Bailey B+

    Chapman B+
    Parra A Seeing as most saw him as fodder, hard to argue with what he's done
    Broxton C
    Hoover B
    Simon B+
    Cingrani B+
    LeCure C- I fully expected him to be the predominant 8th inning guy. Not yet....
    Partch B
    Ondrusek B

  9. #8
    No half measures, Walter RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    As a teacher, I have to say that I think some of you are grading these players with different curves based on their individual talent. If Votto were any other player, he'd have a MUCH easier time on this thread, obviously, but that doesn't work when you are giving out class grades for a group project. IMO each student has to be rated relative to his/her peers and to the league.

    So, if we are judging each of them in relation to their contribution to this team's winning, I would rate them thus:

    Votto = A
    Choo = A
    Phillips = A
    Leake = A
    Latos = A-
    Bailey = A-
    Cingrani = A-
    Simon = B+
    Arroyo = B+
    Bruce = B+
    Chapman = B+
    Robinson = B+
    LeCure = B+
    Paul = B
    Hoover = B
    Hannahan = C+
    Broxton = C
    Mesoraco = C-
    Hanigan = C-
    Parra = C-
    Ondrusek = C-
    Lutz = C-
    Heisey = D
    Cozart = D
    Izturis = D

    Ludwick = I
    Marshall = I

  10. #9
    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    Going strictly with those that play often, starting at first base:

    1B - Votto - B+ - Joey seems to get down 2 strikes every at bat.
    2B - Brandon - B+ - Streaky. As usual
    SS- Cozart - D - No hit, adventitious fielder.
    3B - Frazier - D - Dissapointment on all levels
    LF - Bad. Nothing to see here. Move on - F
    CF - Choo - Such improvement - A
    RF - Bruce - Better, but not to his potential - B
    C. - Horrible - F
    SP - Cueto - C, Latos - B-, Arroyo - B-, Homer - C (so inconsistent), Leake - A
    RP - All - B
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  11. #10
    Knowledge Is Good Big Klu's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    Mr. Kroger, two C's, two D's and an F. That's a 1.2 grade point average. Congratulations, Kroger. You're at the top of the Delta pledge class.

    Mr. Dorfman. 0.2--Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life, son.

    Mr. Hoover, president of Delta House. 1.6--four C's and an F. A fine example you set.

    Daniel Simpson Day--has no grade point average. All courses incomplete.

    Mr. Blu--Mr. Blutarsky. Zero. Point. Zero.
    Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.

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  13. #11
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    The premise of this thread was based on our expectations. If you expected this team to be a 95 win power, your expectations about some individual performances were probably pretty high. Wouldn't that mean fulfilling them would just be a C? So with that in mind the overall team grade would be about a C-/D+:

    Votto C- (He's great but I expected a higher slugging percentage)
    Phillips C- (97 OPS+ is below my expectations, his amazing defense is only as expected)
    Cozart D+ (Expected a .300 OBP and a .700 OPS. He's below that)
    Frazier C+ (He's about as expected offensively, his defense is a nice surprise)
    Luwick F (Not his fault but I expected a clean-up hitter)
    Choo B+ (I expected an .850 or so OPS and now he's at .893, He's not been as terrible in CF as many feared he would be)
    Bruce C (expected a tad more offense, but his defense is better than I expected)
    Hanigan F (injured and ineffective)
    Mesoraco F (He's about .100 OPS points below my expectations)
    Paul B (Expected him to turn into a pumpkin, he still may)
    Heisey F (Injury and poor hitting)
    Robinson A (Expected a crummy AAA OF, he's been an acceptable 25th man)
    Izturis C (Expected a back-up IF that can play SS and not hit much. He's been exactly that)
    Hannahan D (Expected a lefty bat who would do well against RHP in a limited role. He hasn't hit much at all)

    Latos C (Expected a strong number 2 starter and he's been that)
    Bailey C- (Expected a step up to borderline Ace, He's a cut below that)
    Cueto D (Expected a step back and some missed time, but not this much missed time, he's been better than I expected when he's been out there which staved off the F grade)
    Arroyo B (Expected a solid inning eater with 4th starter effectiveness. He's been more effective than that)
    Leake A+ (Expected the same as Arroyo, he's been a stud so far)
    Cingrani B+ (Expected a minor leaguer, he's been a savior with Cueto out but he's showing kinks in the armor lately preventing an A)
    Chapman C- (Expected same as last year, he's stepped back a bit)
    Broxton F (Missed a ton of time and has been pretty iffy when out there)
    Marshall F (Expected the best lefty set-up man in the league, he's pitched 7 innings)
    Hoover C (I was hoping for more, but he's OK I guess)
    Simon B+ (Expected a 12th man with poor stats, he's been pretty good)
    Lecure A- (Expected a step forward, but he's been the team's best reliever IMO)
    Parra C (I actually expected a competent LOOGY, he's been better and more than that after a rough start and injury)
    Ondrusek C (Expected 12th man who struggls and he's been that)
    Partch B (Didn't expect him to be ready to even appear in a major league game until 2014. He's been a 12th man type who has shown some flashes for the future)
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  14. #12
    Member cumberlandreds's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    I'll just go down the lineup for my grades: An I will be for injured.

    Choo A
    Cozart D
    Votto B+
    Phillips A
    Bruce A
    Frazier C
    Mesoraco C
    Hanigan I (Injured mostly)
    Heisey I
    Paul B+
    Robinson B
    Hannahan D
    Izturis F

    Latos B+
    Leake A
    Bailey B-
    Arroyo B
    Cueto I
    Cingrani B+

    Chapman A
    LeCure A
    Marshall I
    Broxton I
    Ondrusek D
    Simon B+
    Hoover C
    Parra C
    Reds Fan Since 1971

  15. #13
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    Very surprised you guys are so down on Cozart. I would have gone around B+. He has been an average shortstop offensively and exceptional in the field. What did we expect from him? It's not his fault he bats 2nd.

    I also don't think anybody should be giving Leake or Cingrani less than an A. These guys have broken out in a way nobody could have expected.

    I'm not willing to give Broxton a pass just due to injury. He was a liability when healthy and I had high expectations for him after last year. Could probably make the exact same case against Hanigan, but it's hard to quantify if he's still making up for it defensively.

    Everyone else, I pretty much agree with consensus.

  16. #14
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Klu View Post
    Mr. Kroger, two C's, two D's and an F. That's a 1.2 grade point average. Congratulations, Kroger. You're at the top of the Delta pledge class.

    Mr. Dorfman. 0.2--Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life, son.

    Mr. Hoover, president of Delta House. 1.6--four C's and an F. A fine example you set.

    Daniel Simpson Day--has no grade point average. All courses incomplete.

    Mr. Blu--Mr. Blutarsky. Zero. Point. Zero.
    Made my morning Klu. Now I can't get the image out of my head of Belushi putting that powdered puffball in his mouth "see if you can guess what I am now". :O)
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
    Bailey CYA winner
    Hamilton ROY & GG

  17. #15
    Member Ironman92's Avatar
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    Re: Reds Grades so far...

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsfaninMT View Post
    Grade inflation!

    A= Leake, Parra
    A- = Choo
    B = Phillips, Bruce, Chapman, Parch, Arroyo, Hoover, Simon, Cingrani, Ondrusek
    B- = Paul, Robinson,
    C+ = Izturis, Votto, Lecure
    C- = Bailey, Mesoraco, Hannahan, Latos
    D+=Frazier
    D= Cozart, Heisey, Cueto, Marshall, Broxton
    F= Hannigan

    As I look at it, the only players who deserve above a "C" are those performing better than expected. Votto is performing as I expected. Many (too many) are doing far worse than I expected. Perhaps unfairly, I graded on an expectation of a healthy season.
    I had high hopes and expectations of a 100 win season, obviously naively so, but not many are dong better than I thought they would.

    I will give Ludwick an incomplete.
    Lol....how are you to know what I expected from each player? Lol What you expect from Frazier at the ASB? 18 Hr/70 RBI .290/.360/.925


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