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Thread: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

  1. #46
    Moderator RedlegJake's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    Quote Originally Posted by cumberlandreds View Post
    Just my opinion buddy. TFWIW. I'm not bitter at all towards him. In fact he's pretty good for what he does. I just feel like he has better stage for what he does. I'm actually giving most of RZ a compliment. I feel like a good portion of the people on RZ knows as much as Kenney or any other sabermatician or baseball media person. In fact I respect a good number of peoples opinion on RZ about baseball more than just about anyone else you see in the media everyday.
    I feel the same way about people on RedsZone Cumberland. Some I respect so much I actually take a look at my own hard-headed views if they disagree. Which is verrrry unlike this stubborn old goat.

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  3. #47
    Member cumberlandreds's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    Quote Originally Posted by RedlegJake View Post
    I feel the same way about people on RedsZone Cumberland. Some I respect so much I actually take a look at my own hard-headed views if they disagree. Which is verrrry unlike this stubborn old goat.
    Same here. Some people have convinced me of newer and better ways of looking at things. I've learned more about baseball in the 10 years on RZ than all the 40 years of my being a baseball fan.
    Reds Fan Since 1971

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  5. #48
    Member smith288's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    I'm of the opinion the Reds are where they are despite the manager. I sense no urgency to the team or fire. Hopefully they turn it on and show more passion.

    I could be wrong, but it's my POV.

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  7. #49
    Member OnBaseMachine's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    When you admit to leaving a pitcher in for too long because you want him to get the win, you deserve every bit of criticism thrown your way. This is a team game, not individual. Who cares if Bailey were to get a no decision as long as the Reds won. I had no problem bringing Bailey back out for the 7th inning even though he was around 100 pitches. I didn't even mind leaving him in after the one out double, but after Mercer's RBI single he should absolutely have been pulled. It was very hot, he was around 120 pitches, and the Pirates were starting to hit the ball. In the end, that decision possibly cost the Reds the game.

    Also, the Reds have the worst caught stealing percentage in all of baseball. Quit giving away outs on the bases! The Reds gave away five outs on the bases in the three game series against the Pirates.
    I miss Adam Dunn.

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  9. #50
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    Quote Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine View Post
    When you admit to leaving a pitcher in for too long because you want him to get the win, you deserve every bit of criticism thrown your way. This is a team game, not individual. Who cares if Bailey were to get a no decision as long as the Reds won. I had no problem bringing Bailey back out for the 7th inning even though he was around 100 pitches. I didn't even mind leaving him in after the one out double, but after Mercer's RBI single he should absolutely have been pulled. It was very hot, he was around 120 pitches, and the Pirates were starting to hit the ball. In the end, that decision possibly cost the Reds the game.

    Also, the Reds have the worst caught stealing percentage in all of baseball. Quit giving away outs on the bases! The Reds gave away five outs on the bases in the three game series against the Pirates.
    I would imagine that Homer Bailey wants the win and appreciates Baker giving him the chance to get it. I think Dusty left him in there a little too long but I also think Homer will tell you that its on him. He let guys named McKerny, Mercer, and Barmes beat him.

    You can blame Dusty for leaving Homer in the game too long, but I think more of the blame goes to Homer for allowing poor hitters to beat him and the middle of the order producing 1 run with the bases loaded and 0 out.

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  11. #51
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I would imagine that Homer Bailey wants the win and appreciates Baker giving him the chance to get it. I think Dusty left him in there a little too long but I also think Homer will tell you that its on him. He let guys named McKerny, Mercer, and Barmes beat him.

    You can blame Dusty for leaving Homer in the game too long, but I think more of the blame goes to Homer for allowing poor hitters to beat him and the middle of the order producing 1 run with the bases loaded and 0 out.
    Too much logic and reason on display here. Tone it down, if you would.

  12. #52
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    Quote Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine View Post
    When you admit to leaving a pitcher in for too long because you want him to get the win, you deserve every bit of criticism thrown your way. This is a team game, not individual. Who cares if Bailey were to get a no decision as long as the Reds won. I had no problem bringing Bailey back out for the 7th inning even though he was around 100 pitches. I didn't even mind leaving him in after the one out double, but after Mercer's RBI single he should absolutely have been pulled. It was very hot, he was around 120 pitches, and the Pirates were starting to hit the ball. In the end, that decision possibly cost the Reds the game.

    Also, the Reds have the worst caught stealing percentage in all of baseball. Quit giving away outs on the bases! The Reds gave away five outs on the bases in the three game series against the Pirates.
    Two points;
    1) Of course it's a team game, but it's a team game played by individuals. If individuals trust the manager to give them chances at individual success, they're more likely to be fully committed to the team's goals.

    2) When you say he should have "absolutely been pulled" why at that point and not one batter later or sooner? What made that the ABSOLUTE correct time to pull him?

    All this said, I probably would have sped up the clock as well. Price goes out to visit after the double, he's pulled after mercer's hit. But I don't think it's an absolute answer.
    If the ground ball Mercer hit is 1 foot right, Phillips gets to it. If the ground ball Votto hit is 1 foot left, it's a two RBI single instead of a double play.
    When people say that I donít know what Iím talking about when it comes to sports or writing, I think: Man, you should see me in the rest of my life.
    ---Joe Posnanski

  13. #53
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    Quote Originally Posted by smith288 View Post
    I'm of the opinion the Reds are where they are despite the manager. I sense no urgency to the team or fire. Hopefully they turn it on and show more passion.

    I could be wrong, but it's my POV.
    I hear that complaint alot and I'm curious just from a comparison perspective. What does a team with fire and urgency look like? Give me an example of a team that has fire and urgency.

    Did you see it last year? If so, why do you suppose they had it last year and not this year?
    When people say that I donít know what Iím talking about when it comes to sports or writing, I think: Man, you should see me in the rest of my life.
    ---Joe Posnanski

  14. #54
    Member Norm Chortleton's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    I'm not saying Baker should have left Bailey in and I'm not saying he should have pulled him. But I will say this. You can't pull your starting pitcher (or reliever, for that matter) every time he gets in trouble. If you do, he'll never learn to gut it out and fight through adversity.

    There is no right answer. You can make a case for either decision.

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  16. #55
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    One thing I think is important when discussing the lack of fire and/or lack of urgency. The rarely talked about downside to managing a regular season game like it's game 7 of the world series is that despite the best efforts, sometimes you still lose.

    The Giants game on July 3 is a perfect example. That was a game they clearly were targeting as a "must win". Zito was pulled after 4 innings despite giving up just 1 run. The Giants had a 2-1 lead and Bochy knew they couldn't afford to lose it.

    He used 3 pitchers(including Zito) in the 5th, 1 more in the 6th, and another in the 7th. So by the end of 7, He had used 5 pitchers in total, and burned his top two left handed relievers.

    He made it quite clear that the season very well rested on that game.

    Then they lost.

    Bochy's very lucky the next day's game was rained out, because I can't imagine they would have had a lot of fight.


    By contrast, the Reds(who have admittedly not played their best ball yet) haven't lost more than three games in a row since the middle of April.
    When people say that I donít know what Iím talking about when it comes to sports or writing, I think: Man, you should see me in the rest of my life.
    ---Joe Posnanski

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  18. #56
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    [QUOTE=Hoosier Red;2914850]I hear that complaint alot and I'm curious just from a comparison perspective. What does a team with fire and urgency look like? Give me an example of a team that has fire and urgency.

    Did you see it last year? If so, why do you suppose they had it last year and not this year?[/QUOTE]


    Dusty Baker contract year? No winning seasons with the Red's yet not in a contract year. 188-136 contract years, 286-298 non contract years (including this one).

  19. #57
    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    Dusty is in the first year of his contract and is well on his way to a winning season.
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

  20. #58
    Member RedsBrick's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    To me there's another way to look at it.

    Ok, Dusty's a 'player's manager'. I think he made the right call in sending Bailey out for the start of the 7th. He still looked strong...send him out there and see where it takes him. Dusty wanted to get him the win....player's manager and all.

    But at what point is it the 'player's manager's' job to help him avoid taking the loss? Maybe the player's manager should have minimized that by pulling Bailey at the first sign of trouble.

    He'd already pitched into the 7th and threw more than 100 pitches. Why make the guy work harder to get out of a jam. Why not maximize his chance of gaining a no decision rather than hanging another loss on him?

    A pitcher's job is to pitch and more often than not they'll do that until the manager comes and gets them. It's a manager's job to manage, not only the game but that player. Baker gave it a shot to help Bailey go for the win by sending him out in the 7th....but as is oftern the case, he took it too far and ultimately minimized the chances of something other than a negative outcome.
    Last edited by RedsBrick; 07-22-2013 at 02:26 PM.

  21. #59
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    Really we should just have a Brian Kenny appreciation page, the guy obviously knows so much more about baseball. It's lame when anyone does not agree with your bashing of the manager. You guys HATE and I mean HATE Dusty Baker and would rather lose 100 games with a different manager than win 100 with a guy you HATE so strongly. Brain Kenny is your prophet, the man that will lead the Baker HATERS to the promised land of SABR utopia. Amazing bunch of Baker HATERS!

  22. #60
    Member Strikes Out Looking's Avatar
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    Re: Brian Kenny crushing Dusty on Twitter

    Dusty is no Sparky, but I don't think the Reds run enough, not too much, so I'd have to disagree with that point of Bk's.
    Win the Division

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