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View Poll Results: Assuming the same contract, would you rather the Reds sign Cueto or Desmond?

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  • Sign Johnny Cueto. Pitching and loyalty.

    13 31.71%
  • Sign Ian Desmond. Need the position upgrade and nothing in the pipeline.

    3 7.32%
  • Neither. We can't afford another nine-figure deal for a guy on the wrong side of 30.

    25 60.98%
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Thread: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

  1. #1
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    FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Same money, same length of contract (whatever that is - 6 years/$150M, or whatever you expect that they'll get), but assume for these purposes the contract is the exact same. Would you rather the Reds sign RHP Johnny Cueto or SS Ian Desmond, or neither?

    Desmond has led all shortstops in WAR since 2012. From MLBTR's rankings of 2016 free agents:

    4. Ian Desmond. The Nationals’ shortstop rejected a seven-year, $107MM extension offer during the 2013-14 offseason, according to Adam Kilgore of the Washington Post. Kilgore reported that the offer was actually only for five additional seasons, and it included deferred money. Desmond, 30 in September, has the potential to exceed $200MM on the open market with another strong season. In terms of wins above replacement, he’s easily been the game’s best shortstop since 2012. Desmond offers the extremely rare combination of power, durability, speed, and solid shortstop defense. However, his contact rate dipped below 70% for the first time in 2014, and a continuation of that trend would affect his earning power.

    5. Johnny Cueto. Only Clayton Kershaw‘s brilliance prevented Cueto from winning the NL Cy Young award in 2014. Cueto, who turned 29 last Sunday, posted a 2.25 ERA over 243 2/3 innings last year with a career-best strikeout rate. That was a huge workload, especially since Cueto was limited to 11 starts in 2013 due to a shoulder strain. He missed significant time in 2011 with shoulder issues as well. Cueto can set aside some concerns with a DL-free 2015 campaign. Potential bonus: he could become ineligible for a qualifying offer if the Reds trade him during the season.
    Last edited by Benihana; 02-17-2015 at 11:44 AM.
    Go BLUE!!!

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  3. #2
    Member wlf WV's Avatar
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Shoulder strain?
    May the Lord bless

  4. #3
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Desmond is 30, signing him for more than 4 years would be a financial mistake.

  5. #4
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    For those voting neither, what are we holding the money for? What significant pieces are going to require real money in the near future? I don't see many. Do we think the Reds will make a huge FA splash to spend money? Would we even want them to? Would we sign anyone that concedes a pick due to qualifying offer?

    I voted Cueto, but I would be happy to see either deal. I fail to see how that money would be better spent in the near future to help this team win. I'm not interested in seeing the same money go to fringe Ludwick/Broxton type deals or just be held in Bob C's pocket. Spend the money on difference makers while you still have 1 to spend it on.

  6. #5
    Member Norm Chortleton's Avatar
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Quote Originally Posted by swaisuc View Post
    For those voting neither, what are we holding the money for? What significant pieces are going to require real money in the near future? I don't see many. Do we think the Reds will make a huge FA splash to spend money? Would we even want them to? Would we sign anyone that concedes a pick due to qualifying offer?

    I voted Cueto, but I would be happy to see either deal. I fail to see how that money would be better spent in the near future to help this team win. I'm not interested in seeing the same money go to fringe Ludwick/Broxton type deals or just be held in Bob C's pocket. Spend the money on difference makers while you still have 1 to spend it on.
    Spend the money on players in their primes. I don't won't 34-, 35-. 36-year-old pitchers or shortstops topping out my payroll.

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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Quote Originally Posted by Norm Chortleton View Post
    Spend the money on players in their primes. I don't won't 34-, 35-. 36-year-old pitchers or shortstops topping out my payroll.
    Like? Everybody is roughly the same age when they hit that first FA. Anybody we sign to a major contract will be the same age. Our guys younger than him won't need it due to arb years and other teams guys younger than him aren't available via FA.

  9. #7
    Grouch ac084c's Avatar
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Quote Originally Posted by swaisuc View Post
    Like? Everybody is roughly the same age when they hit that first FA. Anybody we sign to a major contract will be the same age. Our guys younger than him won't need it due to arb years and other teams guys younger than him aren't available via FA.
    Yoan Moncado, for one.
    I don't like to sound egotistical, but every time I stepped up to the plate with a bat in my hands, I couldn't help but feel sorry for the pitcher.
    -Rogers Hornsby

  10. #8
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Quote Originally Posted by ac084c View Post
    Yoan Moncado, for one.
    Works for me also

  11. #9
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    We already gave a big contract to a 30-year-old star middle-infielder back in 2011 when his name was Brandon Phillips. Only that was a lot less money and it didn't cost us a pick. Now everybody hates it. Why is it going to be different this time? I don't really like Cueto, either, though. I like Mike Leake, but it depends on how the prospects are looking at the end of the year. You could probably get Leake AND a good SS for the same money.

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  13. #10
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Has Desmond ever figured out where first base is?
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

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  15. #11
    Member Norm Chortleton's Avatar
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wonderful Monds View Post
    Has Desmond ever figured out where first base is?
    He's figured out where the outfield seats are, as he led all SS in HR last year. And he's figured out where home plate is, as he was 6th in R. I think he had to go to first base each of those times. But I still wouldn't want to be paying him a lot of money when he is an old man.

  16. #12
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    I would rather spend 200 million on more scouts, more Latin and Cuban prospects and on people on the right side of say 28. I'm sure the Reds can sign Johny, but can also (possibly) trade him at the deadline for 2 or 3 young stud prospects.
    Pete Rose will be leaving the Montreal Expos to become player - manager for the Cincinnati Reds

  17. #13
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Quote Originally Posted by SweetLou1990 View Post
    I would rather spend 200 million on more scouts, more Latin and Cuban prospects and on people on the right side of say 28. I'm sure the Reds can sign Johny, but can also (possibly) trade him at the deadline for 2 or 3 young stud prospects.
    Unfortunately the days of trading two months of a rental for huge value are behind us. The time to trade Cueto is now, or more realistically, was a couple months ago- either at the deadline or the winter meetings. Now I think we'll be lucky to get a top 50 prospect at the deadline.

    I'd rather sign Moncada than either Cueto or Desmond, but unfortunately I think the Reds are likely to go 0-for-3, and won't have received anything great for Johnny either. Hopefully they can make good on the compensatory draft pick.
    Go BLUE!!!

  18. #14
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    If someone spends $200+ million on Desmond they deserve to have their team contracted. That is just crazy to think about.

  19. #15
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: FA Question: Cueto or Desmond?

    Quote Originally Posted by Norm Chortleton View Post
    He's figured out where the outfield seats are, as he led all SS in HR last year. And he's figured out where home plate is, as he was 6th in R. I think he had to go to first base each of those times. But I still wouldn't want to be paying him a lot of money when he is an old man.
    I was actually seriously curious, my last memories of Desmond were a guy who couldn't OBP .300, hit some HR and made EdE level errors. I'm good on all that.

    But if he's improved then I don't know. Still probably no for the reasons listed above.

    EDIT: 24 HR last year (so he's no Kang) but just a .430 SLG/.743 OPS. Good but not even remotely close to being an ace pitcher in value, and definitely not someone you give 150 milli to.
    Last edited by Wonderful Monds; 02-17-2015 at 09:32 PM.
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.


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