Turn Off Ads?
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 29

Thread: 4 Days in October

  1. #1
    Member BungleBengals's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    618

    4 Days in October

    I recently watched the 30 for 30: 4 Days in October about the Red Sox coming back from 3-0 in the ALCS. (It's on Netflix).

    Anyways, I realized that in Game 4 and Game 5, Boston used a pinch runner in Dave Roberts who helped them tie both games and they won them in extras. In Game 4, 8th inning and Boston was down by 1. Kevin Millar walked and was pinch run by Roberts. Mariano Rivera, knowing he would try to steal, threw over to first base a few times. As soon as Rivera went home with the ball, Roberts stole second. Bill Mueller then hit a single to drive Roberts home and tie the game. Ortiz wins it for them in extras.

    Game 5 was very similar. 8th inning and the Boston was down by 1 after Ortiz hit a HR. Millar is walked and pinch run for by Roberts. A single by Trot Nixon got Roberts from 1st to 3rd. An ensuing sacrifice fly scored Roberts to tie the game. Ortiz wins it for them in extras.

    Couldn't Hamilton be that asset for us? Roberts was effective in two ways in these games. He was able to use his speed to get into scoring position and eventually score. Further, he was able to rattle the pitchers knowing he was on base. I definitely think that Billy can do that for us, which would be pivotal in big playoff games.

    Wouldn't he have to be on our roster by Aug 31st to be able to go to the playoffs?
    2013 Attendance: 6-0
    4/3/13, 4/16/13, 4/17/13, 8/3/13, 8/21/13, 9/7/13

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    Member RadfordVA's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Posts
    892

    Re: 4 Days in October

    No there is always a loophole to get players added onto playoff roster who were added after August 31st using players on the DL I believe.

  4. #3
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    34,171

    Re: 4 Days in October

    Why use Hamilton when we can use Robinson? There can't be that much drop off in speed.
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160

  5. #4
    Member cumberlandreds's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Sterling VA
    Posts
    8,765

    Re: 4 Days in October

    One thing to remember, Roberts was a veteran and knew how to read pitchers moves. Hamilton would be a fresh rookie and may be more prone to be picked off than Roberts ever was. Chip is correct. Robinson is the more logical choice. From what I have read there is very little difference Robinsons and Hamiltons speed.
    Reds Fan Since 1971

  6. Likes:

    remdog (08-13-2013)

  7. #5
    Member BungleBengals's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    618

    Re: 4 Days in October

    I agree that Robinson and Hamilton are similar in speed, but I think that Hamilton is physically better to steal bases. I do not know specifics, but I think he has some long arms which make all the difference in stealing bases. Not to mention, that Robinson has not stolen that much in majors. Of course that could be Dusty saying not to steal.
    2013 Attendance: 6-0
    4/3/13, 4/16/13, 4/17/13, 8/3/13, 8/21/13, 9/7/13

  8. #6
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Cincinnati
    Posts
    10,028

    Re: 4 Days in October

    Quote Originally Posted by cumberlandreds View Post
    One thing to remember, Roberts was a veteran and knew how to read pitchers moves. Hamilton would be a fresh rookie and may be more prone to be picked off than Roberts ever was. Chip is correct. Robinson is the more logical choice. From what I have read there is very little difference Robinsons and Hamiltons speed.
    Robinson is awful at stealing bases, just awful. He gets poor jumps and is often thrown out from here to there.

    I don't know about Hamilton's defense, but I do think you need to give serious consideration to adding him to a playoff roster. Even as a pinch runner who isn't going to steal he puts added pressure on both the pitcher and defense. In a short series in which you don't need 12 pitchers, adding Hamilton as your base runner isn't such a bad idea.

  9. #7
    nothing more than a fan Always Red's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Cincy West
    Posts
    4,731

    Re: 4 Days in October

    Robinson's very fast, but has shown no propensity for the SB.

    He's had only 3 and been thrown out 5 times.

    But I would like to see Robinson playing CF late in close playoff games.

  10. #8
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    34,171

    Re: 4 Days in October

    Quote Originally Posted by BungleBengals View Post
    Of course that could be Dusty saying not to steal.
    That may be the fly in the ointment. As much of a "small ball" reputation that Dusty has, with the exception of Stubbs he really hasn't turned anyone loose on the basepaths.

    If we are going to have a pinch-runner on the post-season roster, I'd like to see someone who can do more than steal bases.
    The Rally Onion wants 150 fans before Opening Day.

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/Rally-...24872650873160

  11. #9
    Member BungleBengals's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    618

    Re: 4 Days in October

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    That may be the fly in the ointment. As much of a "small ball" reputation that Dusty has, with the exception of Stubbs he really hasn't turned anyone loose on the basepaths.

    If we are going to have a pinch-runner on the post-season roster, I'd like to see someone who can do more than steal bases.
    Okay, but what if it is the one game playoff? And we are down 1 going into the 8th and Hanigan gets walked? I would much rather have Hamilton PR for him. As Hamilton has stolen over 200 bases in the last 2 years. Yes, he hasn't seen much of major league pitching, but he knows how to steal bases very well and the other team knows he will steal which likely distracts the pitcher.

    DRob is better tooled player in terms of hitting and defense, but none of that matters when we are down by 1 and need a PR for someone who walked.
    2013 Attendance: 6-0
    4/3/13, 4/16/13, 4/17/13, 8/3/13, 8/21/13, 9/7/13

  12. #10
    Member NebraskaRed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Lincoln, NE
    Posts
    1,131

    Re: 4 Days in October

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    That may be the fly in the ointment. As much of a "small ball" reputation that Dusty has, with the exception of Stubbs he really hasn't turned anyone loose on the basepaths.

    If we are going to have a pinch-runner on the post-season roster, I'd like to see someone who can do more than steal bases.
    From everything I've read, if Hamilton were called up (which seems likely) he'd most likely only be used in pinch-running situations.

    Also, 4 Days in October was pretty good. I especially liked seeing Arroyo's role in that series.

  13. Likes:

    JB12 (08-13-2013)

  14. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2001
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    7,064

    Re: 4 Days in October

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    That may be the fly in the ointment. As much of a "small ball" reputation that Dusty has, with the exception of Stubbs he really hasn't turned anyone loose on the basepaths.

    If we are going to have a pinch-runner on the post-season roster, I'd like to see someone who can do more than steal bases.
    So let's say you've made the decision to go with 11 pitchers, and free up a spot for Robinson and/or Hamilton.

    Do you a) Want Robinson for his ability to take over defense in CF or b) Hamilton for his ability to pinch run?

    I realize Hamilton is likely an upgrade defensively in CF as well, but not as much of one as Robinson, and if one is added on to the roster, it's likely for one specific purpose so Hamilton's ability to play defense wouldn't likely be an issue after he's brought in to pinch run.
    When people say that I donít know what Iím talking about when it comes to sports or writing, I think: Man, you should see me in the rest of my life.
    ---Joe Posnanski

  15. #12
    Member BungleBengals's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    618

    Re: 4 Days in October

    I agree that having Robinson on the playoff roster would be nice and he does deserve it. But wouldn't it make sense to leave Hannahan off the roster for Hamilton?

    What does Hannahan bring to the table? A backup 3B with no power, below average defense (lately), terrible batting average, and a lefty bat?

    We have Paul for a pinch hitting power lefty bat. Izturis, Robinson, and Hamilton are all switch hitters so they can bat lefty too. Plus would Frazier ever come out of the game at 3B barring injury? Not to mention, Izturis has some experience at the 3B anyways to fill in for an emergency (Frazier injured).
    2013 Attendance: 6-0
    4/3/13, 4/16/13, 4/17/13, 8/3/13, 8/21/13, 9/7/13

  16. Likes:

    mth123 (08-13-2013)

  17. #13
    Member klw's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    New England
    Posts
    5,705

    Re: 4 Days in October


    For that wish to watch.

  18. #14
    Moderator LexRedsFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Greenville, South Carolina
    Posts
    557

    Re: 4 Days in October

    Quote Originally Posted by BungleBengals View Post
    INot to mention, Izturis has some experience at the 3B anyways to fill in for an emergency (Frazier injured).
    And as we saw last year with Cueto, if the emergency is dire enough you can drop Frazier from the roster and add Hannahan.

  19. #15
    Member medford's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Posts
    2,078

    Re: 4 Days in October

    I have nothing to back this up, but I would think a pinch runner has more potential to impact a game than a late inning defensive replacement. There is obviously no garuntee that you're in a situation to use either, thought the defensive replacement stands a greater chance of playing as you're not going to pinch run for Votto, Bruce, Choo, etc... nor is there any garuntee that a player you would pinch run for gets on base, but when used, they have the opportunity to steal a base (or 2) go 1st to 3rd when the guy they replaced would be stuck on 2nd, go 1st to home on a double or 2nd to home on a single, etc... A defensive replacement may not see a ball hit his way, if he does, the odds are its not going to be a terribly difficult ball to field. How many opportunities does a CF get to make a difference w/ his defense in any given game, let alone any given inning (or 2) that you'd use him as a defensive replacement/ How many opportunities does a pinch runner get to steal, go 1st to 3rd, 2nd to home, 1st to home, etc...?


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25