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Thread: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called up

  1. #61
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    The guy is NOT an OF, just like Kearns wasn't a 3rd baseman, like WMP couldn't be sent down, like Phillips isn't a SS

    Saying it doesn't make it so
    To be fair, all of those guys would be moving to the wrong side of the defensive spectrum. Edwin had enough tools to play 3B for a few years, he just didn't have the footwork. He would've had enough physical ability to play LF.

    Bear in mind, I'm not saying he'd play it well, but I'm sure he could get by enough to stick there.
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

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  3. #62
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by Wonderful Monds View Post
    To be fair, all of those guys would be moving to the wrong side of the defensive spectrum. Edwin had enough tools to play 3B for a few years, he just didn't have the footwork. He would've had enough physical ability to play LF.

    Bear in mind, I'm not saying he'd play it well, but I'm sure he could get by enough to stick there.
    In theory I would agree, but watching him play defense recently, he can barely play 1B good enough to get by.
    "Since I've been with the Reds in 1989, we've never had a farm system this loaded," Bowden said. "If we were the New York Yankees and had unlimited dollars, we could have traded for Colon, (Jeff) Weaver, Rolen, (Cliff) Floyd, (Kenny) Rogers and Finley and gotten them all -- and still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement."

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  5. #63
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    In theory I would agree, but watching him play defense recently, he can barely play 1B good enough to get by.
    Good point, he is 30 now too I forgot.

    So maybe I should say, he could have at some point.
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

  6. #64
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by Wonderful Monds View Post
    To be fair, all of those guys would be moving to the wrong side of the defensive spectrum. Edwin had enough tools to play 3B for a few years, he just didn't have the footwork. He would've had enough physical ability to play LF.

    Bear in mind, I'm not saying he'd play it well, but I'm sure he could get by enough to stick there.
    17 innings in the OF 5752 IP played in MLB career

    Speaks volumes to me, volumes

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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    Not to pick on you, but just because Broxton ended up getting hurt doesn't mean this was a bad plan. That's kind of like saying it was dumb to sign Cueto because he was lost for most of this year too.. No one is saying that of course, but it's a similiar argument. Pitchers get hurt, that's why you can never have too much pitching.
    It wasn't a bad plan because Broxton got hurt, it was a bad plan because the Reds paid top of the market money and guaranteed three years for a notoriously volatile position. Just look at some of the alternatives that were available:

    Joakim Soria - $8mm / 2 years
    Jason Grili - $6.75mm / 2 years
    Joel Peralta - $6mm / 2 years
    Koji Uehara - $4.25mm / 1 year
    JP Howell - $2.85mm / 1 year
    Jason Frasor - $1.5mm / 1 year
    Oliver Perez - $1.5mm / 1 year

    Heck even the Reds decision to drop $8.5mm for Madson was better because while they got no production out of him, they also weren't on the hook for multiple seasons thereafter.

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  9. #66
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    No, not seriously. It was meant as a joke. I will put a smiley face next time.
    My apologies. Surely, though, you can understand how around this place one might not know someone was joking
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  10. #67
    Five Tool Fool jojo's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by nmculbreth View Post
    It wasn't a bad plan because Broxton got hurt, it was a bad plan because the Reds paid top of the market money and guaranteed three years for a notoriously volatile position. Just look at some of the alternatives that were available:

    Joakim Soria - $8mm / 2 years
    Jason Grili - $6.75mm / 2 years
    Joel Peralta - $6mm / 2 years
    Koji Uehara - $4.25mm / 1 year
    JP Howell - $2.85mm / 1 year
    Jason Frasor - $1.5mm / 1 year
    Oliver Perez - $1.5mm / 1 year

    Heck even the Reds decision to drop $8.5mm for Madson was better because while they got no production out of him, they also weren't on the hook for multiple seasons thereafter.
    Three years for a reliever with an injury history and not much track record post recovery coupled with the general trend for relievers to be highly volatile is excessive. It wasn't genius thinking and this is again before this season's injuries.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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    malingered here too long malcontent's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by Wonderful Monds View Post
    Good point, he is 30 now too I forgot.

    So maybe I should say, he could have at some point.
    An "old" 30, to boot.



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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    Just think, we have 2+ more seasons of "Worst.Contract.Ever."

    And I admit I will/have say it every once in awhile myself.


    You must be new around here, because Eric Milton had a far worse contract.

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  14. #70
    Just A Couple Johnny's OneManBand's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Fall guy.. Cueto was DL'd then activated.. Then DL'd then activated.. Then DL'd.. And most likely done for the season.

    Nick Masset? Chirp..chirp.. Crickets..crickets. Anyone seen him on the mound in almost two years?

    Sean Marshall has been back and forth between active roster and DL..

    Jonathan Broxton is just another recurring casualty.

    Not to jump on just pitching injuries but we were told as a fan base that Ludwicks injury was a couple months tops injury.. He made appearance in his 2nd game on Aug 11th. Four and a half months into the season..

    But your right.. Someone has to take a hit. Not that I'm upset because we are we're we are... But where would we be if these injuries could be properly diagnosed and the right amount of time is allotted to heal? Injuries happen.. They do.. I can barely walk some days without rolling an ankle.. It happens. The thing is whats being done to prevent further injuries that has me scratching my head.

  15. #71
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by OneManBand View Post
    Fall guy.. Cueto was DL'd then activated.. Then DL'd then activated.. Then DL'd.. And most likely done for the season.

    Nick Masset? Chirp..chirp.. Crickets..crickets. Anyone seen him on the mound in almost two years?

    Sean Marshall has been back and forth between active roster and DL..

    Jonathan Broxton is just another recurring casualty.

    Not to jump on just pitching injuries but we were told as a fan base that Ludwicks injury was a couple months tops injury.. He made appearance in his 2nd game on Aug 11th. Four and a half months into the season..
    Pretty sure they said pretty quickly when it became clear he was going to need surgery that it was going to be after the ASB, which is right around the time he went on rehab.


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  16. #72
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by OneManBand View Post
    Fall guy.. Cueto was DL'd then activated.. Then DL'd then activated.. Then DL'd.. And most likely done for the season.

    Nick Masset? Chirp..chirp.. Crickets..crickets. Anyone seen him on the mound in almost two years?

    Sean Marshall has been back and forth between active roster and DL..

    Jonathan Broxton is just another recurring casualty.

    Not to jump on just pitching injuries but we were told as a fan base that Ludwicks injury was a couple months tops injury.. He made appearance in his 2nd game on Aug 11th. Four and a half months into the season..

    But your right.. Someone has to take a hit. Not that I'm upset because we are we're we are... But where would we be if these injuries could be properly diagnosed and the right amount of time is allotted to heal? Injuries happen.. They do.. I can barely walk some days without rolling an ankle.. It happens. The thing is whats being done to prevent further injuries that has me scratching my head.
    No one expected Ludwick back till the ASB at earliest. Most figured August. Not sure I see the confusion you claim on that one.

  17. #73
    Will post for food BuckeyeRedleg's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Who called Broxton's contact "the worst ever"?

    All the hyperbole in the world still doesn't change the fact that it was a pretty lousy contract.

  18. #74
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by nmculbreth View Post
    It wasn't a bad plan because Broxton got hurt, it was a bad plan because the Reds paid top of the market money and guaranteed three years for a notoriously volatile position. Just look at some of the alternatives that were available:

    Joakim Soria - $8mm / 2 years
    Jason Grili - $6.75mm / 2 years
    Joel Peralta - $6mm / 2 years
    Koji Uehara - $4.25mm / 1 year
    JP Howell - $2.85mm / 1 year
    Jason Frasor - $1.5mm / 1 year
    Oliver Perez - $1.5mm / 1 year

    Heck even the Reds decision to drop $8.5mm for Madson was better because while they got no production out of him, they also weren't on the hook for multiple seasons thereafter.

    And then there's another long list of players given cheap contracts that didn't work out.

    I'm not going to research every one of them, how exactly were the Reds supposed to get Grilli over the offseason? Trade for him, after he just had a great year as a setup man for the Pirates?
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

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  19. #75
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    Re: Broxton to the DL; needs surgery. Cueto to the 60 day DL, Nick Christiani called

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    And then there's another long list of players given cheap contracts that didn't work out.

    I'm not going to research every one of them, how exactly were the Reds supposed to get Grilli over the offseason? Trade for him, after he just had a great year as a setup man for the Pirates?
    But that's sort of the point - relief pitchers are notoriously volatile and it's a whole lot easier to jettison a short, cheap contract than it is a long, expensive one.

    The contracts that I listed weren't pulled randomly out of thin air, they were the alternatives to Broxton that were available via free agency and unsigned at the time the Reds re-signed Broxton. Instead of letting the market settle and look for value, the front office panicked, bought early and ended up massively overpaying both in terms of salary and the number of years guaranteed.


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