Turn Off Ads?
Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 16 to 25 of 25

Thread: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

  1. #16
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    718

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    What I've seen lately from BP is his attempt to turn some routine plays into something spectacular. His footwork around the bag has declined to "jumping" on DP turns, which results in nothing on his throws. I know it's necessary sometimes, but he does it way too often. Just about every slow grounder hit his way results in a bare-handed attempt instead of using his glove. No doubt he is a tremendous fielder, one of the elite. Back to fundamentals and a little less mustard please.

  2. Likes:

    Always Red (08-24-2013), Ironman92 (08-24-2013), Larkin Fan (08-24-2013), mth123 (08-24-2013), Number_Fourteen (08-24-2013), OnBaseMachine (08-24-2013), RANDY IN INDY (08-24-2013), Roy Tucker (08-24-2013), Sea Ray (08-24-2013)

  3. Turn Off Ads?
  4. #17
    Moderator RedlegJake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    North Kansas City, Mo
    Posts
    5,624

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    Looking at that link I actually agree with Searay. BP is quick on athleticism more than technique. Maybe the fact that he was a SS coming up is why. The best Reds I ever saw turning a DP were Helms and Oester. Morgan was good but Tommy Helms was magical. He was a light hitter and pre-BRM so people tend to forget him but good gosh he was so smooth and fluid. Oester wasn't as good a pure gloveman but he made that pirouette at second look like ballet. BP gets it done but, to me anyway, he looks less graceful - but sometimes he does it in ways that look impossible - I'll grant him that. BP makes plays that I don't think I've ever seen anyone else make.

  5. #18
    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    15,531

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    Quote Originally Posted by RedlegJake View Post
    Looking at that link I actually agree with Searay. BP is quick on athleticism more than technique. Maybe the fact that he was a SS coming up is why. The best Reds I ever saw turning a DP were Helms and Oester. Morgan was good but Tommy Helms was magical. He was a light hitter and pre-BRM so people tend to forget him but good gosh he was so smooth and fluid. Oester wasn't as good a pure gloveman but he made that pirouette at second look like ballet. BP gets it done but, to me anyway, he looks less graceful - but sometimes he does it in ways that look impossible - I'll grant him that. BP makes plays that I don't think I've ever seen anyone else make.
    I think that DP pivot at 2B is the biggest issue for SS's changing to second basemen. I must say I'm too young to remember Tommy Helms but given his weak bat, he must have been something in the field. In defense of BP, his range allows him to start DPs that 99% of the time wouldn't be possible.

    Old NDN makes a great point about his jumping and throwing in the air. That's not "textbook" to say the least and is exactly what I'm referring to

  6. #19
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    8,138

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    Well, I'll pop in to say that I live and breathe defensive baseball. I really dive into watching great defenders. Brandon has fantastic hands, he's got incredibly quick reflexes and instincts. But, his range has deteriorated considerably over the years...but he also makes up for that by positioning himself much better than he used to as well.

    As for turning the DP. Yes, he is slow at that. He gets the job done due to his strong and accurate arm, but that is the one part of his game that is really lacking and always has been. The transfer. Yes, he'll make some slick plays, but watch Cozart. His transfer from the glove to the throw is much quicker than Brandons. The Brewers IF combo is also much faster than Brandon at this. All that being said, Phillips is STILL the best defensive 2b in the bigs right now AND the best to ever don a Reds uniform overall defensively.

    And btw, I'm fairly certain that Phillips knows he has this shortcoming. It's quite likely one reason you see him barehand the ball so often. Other than the fact that it looks quite awesome (and we all know Brandon loves him some flash *grin*)
    2014 predictions:
    99-63 WS champs (Cards take 2nd WC, Mil 3rd, Pit 4th, Chi 5th)
    Bruce/Votto neck and neck MVP race (neither takes it)
    Bailey CYA winner
    Hamilton ROY & GG

  7. #20
    ZCTRMTP!!!!!
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    10,795

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    The Reds have had 780 opportunities to turn a double play, fewest in the league. The league average is 873. They have turned 83 double plays, fewest in the league. The league average is 98. Cincinnati converts double play opportunities at 11%. That is the league average.
    Mitigating factors:
    1) They strike out 22.0% of the hitters, highest in the league. The league average is 19.7%
    2) Their GB/FB ratio is .79. The league average is .87.

    So, the pitchers keep off the bases, lowering opportunities. When opportunity arises, more strikeouts and less ground balls result in fewer actual opportunities. If you mix it all together I would say the Reds are about average at turning two. Simply having a league average double play opportunties would add about 10 to the team total. They would rank 10th. Less strikeouts and more ground balls would, no doubt, push that total higher.

    Another way of looking at it is that, if double play opportunities appear at a consistent rate for whomever is playing second base, Brandon has turned (been the relay man) 32 GIDP in 4438 PA. Or 1 every 138 PA. All others that have played second have turned (been the relay man) 5 GIDP in 401 PA. Or 1 in every 80 PA. But the may be a sample size issue as much as anything.

    All stats are from http://www.baseball-reference.com/te...fielding.shtml .
    Zero chance the Reds miss the playoffs!

  8. Likes:

    mth123 (08-24-2013)

  9. #21
    Yay!
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Middletown, Ohio
    Posts
    7,418

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post
    3 of those 4 highlights were of the same play and in it he shows the art of avoiding injury but it's a poor example of a quick pivot. In it he takes a step, jumps high enough to avoid being taken out and then he releases the ball as he's coming back down to earth. That all takes time. I don't blame him for taking care of himself physically; I support that. It's just the nature of the play that doesn't lend itself to being a good example. I'm puzzled why you thought that play out to be linked 3 times
    I did copy the same link twice. My bad.

    The bottom link shows a search of MLB video for all DPs involving Phillips in the last couple months.
    When all is said and done more is said than done.

  10. #22
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Calgary, Alberta, aka, the most prosperous city in the world.
    Posts
    10,528

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    Quote Originally Posted by texasdave View Post
    The Reds have had 780 opportunities to turn a double play, fewest in the league. The league average is 873. They have turned 83 double plays, fewest in the league. The league average is 98. Cincinnati converts double play opportunities at 11%. That is the league average.
    Mitigating factors:
    1) They strike out 22.0% of the hitters, highest in the league. The league average is 19.7%
    2) Their GB/FB ratio is .79. The league average is .87.

    So, the pitchers keep off the bases, lowering opportunities. When opportunity arises, more strikeouts and less ground balls result in fewer actual opportunities. If you mix it all together I would say the Reds are about average at turning two.

    All stats are from http://www.baseball-reference.com/te...fielding.shtml .
    I'm reading that the stats say they are above average at turning DP's, based on the skill of the infielders.

    If they convert DP's at 11%based on opportunities (the league average), but during those opportunities they strike out more batters and throw less than average GB's, those infielders are are making more of those GB opportunites and turning them into more DP's.

    The lack of DP's has everytihng to do with opportunities. In fact, the infielders turn 2 more often when they actually get the chance.

  11. #23
    Member Ironman92's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    3,552

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    I don't think this is hardly even a factor in the pennant race. Phillips drives me nuts more than most of you guys but I just don't see this as a problem....his whole game is hot doggish, the DP is just another part of it. The # of DP's is simply 98.879% reliant on other factors out of his control. I'll give him 1.121% of the blame on our DP issues.

    I remember Bret Boone being lightning quick, but my microfiche machine is still down so this has no merit.

  12. Likes:

    texasdave (08-24-2013)

  13. #24
    ZCTRMTP!!!!!
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    10,795

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    I'm reading that the stats say they are above average at turning DP's, based on the skill of the infielders.

    If they convert DP's at 11%based on opportunities (the league average), but during those opportunities they strike out more batters and throw less than average GB's, those infielders are are making more of those GB opportunites and turning them into more DP's.

    The lack of DP's has everytihng to do with opportunities. In fact, the infielders turn 2 more often when they actually get the chance.
    I can see average to slightly above average. I guess my post was trying to refute the idea that they are below average at turning two. The 11% for both the team and the league is a little misleading. The Reds actually turn at 10.7%. The league average is 11.2%. So, they both round off to 11%. I should have pointed that out in my first post. I am too lazy to do the math on how more strike outs and few ground balls affects things. But I am thinking that gets them to around league average of maybe a touch better.
    Last edited by texasdave; 08-24-2013 at 06:23 PM.
    Zero chance the Reds miss the playoffs!

  14. #25
    Member Crumbley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Toledo
    Posts
    698

    Re: What Can't Phillips Do Defensively? I'll Answer

    BP has maybe lost half a step out there as far as I can see. Datdude is still a wizard.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25