Re-sign Choo, please.
Most think there's no shot. I am holding out hope.
Re-sign Choo, please.
Most think there's no shot. I am holding out hope.
Big Klu (09-12-2013),marcshoe (09-02-2013),OnBaseMachine (09-04-2013)
I hope Walt finds every cent available to pay Choo whatever it takes. Walt can roll pennies, nickles, and dimes. Walt can go door-to-door and ask for donations. Whatever it takes. Make the team pay for their own drinks out of a vending machine like the Oakland A's did. Whatever it takes. Sell ad space to the highest bidder. Even if their official name next year has to be "The Cincinnati Reds brought to you by LaRosa's Pizza and Fifth Third Bank." Whatever it takes.
It will be hard to go back to a typical leadoff hitter if Choo walks. No matter what the Reds do, the guy in the number one slot will drop off.
That's not to denigrate Billy "White Shoes" Hamilton in any way; I think he could be decent next year, but I think that if Choo isn't there next year, just how much he meant to this team will become evident.
It is on the whole probable that we continually dream, but that consciousness makes such a noise that we do not hear it. Carl Jung.
Hmmm. . . I dreamed that the Reds signed Chapman a week before they did. I also dreamed that Cesar Geronimo was invited to Spring Training and was the best hitter on the team.
It is on the whole probable that we continually dream, but that consciousness makes such a noise that we do not hear it. Carl Jung.
The only way I re-sign Choo is if you move Phillips first.
Otherwise you're going to be looking at a lot of bad money later in those contracts on top of Votto's 700 billion dollars.
If you move Phillips, play Choo in CF next year and then slide him over to LF when Ludwick is gone/Hamilton is ready, I could go for that.
A lot's going to depend on how much of a increase Choo wants from his 7 million this year.
Cot's has 79 million in contracts already for 2014. Hanigan and Bailey are due for their third arbitration raise, Leake his 2nd. That'll give us roughly 25 million to handle arbitration and handle any other contracts.
It's not impossible, but the numbers dictate it will be very hard to do.
I probably would not re-sign Choo to more than a 2 year deal with an option.
Between Hamilton, Yorman, Winker and Ervin, it doesn't make much sense to carry an inflated salary for Choo past 2015. One or more of those guys will (hopefully) step in and be ready to takeover starting duties for much, MUCH cheaper by that point. I might consider a backloaded 3rd year, especially if it were in the form of an option.
Otherwise, I think this deal will hamstring the team too much come 2016 and 2017, especially with Votto/Bruce/Phillips and hopefully Latos and one or two other pitchers making a lot of dough during those years. Choo will certainly not be able to handle CF by then, and the Reds have enough in the pipeline to comfortably take care of LF by then.
What we likely WON'T have by 2016 is a capable, younger cheaper solution at SS or 3B, and Cozart and Frazier could start to get expensive in those arbitration years. If they're worth it, great, but if they are just league average guys that are getting expensive, I'd rather use chips (or currency) to acquire an ABOVE average solution at either or both positions by then.
Therefore, the big exception to all of this would be if we could pull off a trade of Aroldis Chapman or Homer Bailey for a guy like Jurickson Profar or Xander Bogaerts - because that would both free up some payroll and potentially solve SS for the forseeable future, and for not a lot of money. In that scenario, I'd probably offer Choo something like 3/$35M or maybe even 4/$40M. Until then, my offer would be 2/$25M, with an option for 2016. Whatever you do in any scenario, make sure it doesn't preclude you financially from extending Latos and probably one other pitcher.
Last edited by Benihana; 09-03-2013 at 04:06 PM.
Go BLUE!!!
I feel like I look at the breakdown of BP's contract every few weeks, shudder, and then after a few weeks tell myself "Well, maybe it wasn't really that bad. I should check again..."
“I don’t care,” Votto said of passing his friend and former teammate. “He’s in the past. Bye-bye, Jay.”
*BaseClogger* (09-05-2013),PepperJack (09-03-2013),SporkLover (09-09-2013)
Yes. Stubbs is not a horrible complimentary player. I think the Reds had to move him to Cleveland to get the $$ to work for Choo.
For example, if Stubbs was a FA, he'd be a nice stop gap to play CF next year until BHam is deemed ready.
I have the feeling that BHam's first year is going to require some patience from the fans and the media. The guy was promoted aggressively. He struggled the first half in AAA, but then did much better in the second half.
I worry a bit about when he's promoted. Is extra time in AAA going to lessen his adjustment period in the major leagues? I honestly don't know, but I can see lots of people turning on him when he struggles the first 6-8 weeks in the bigs.
Heck, Parra didn't get much of a grace period when he started the year.
[Phil ] Castellini celebrated the team's farm system and noted the team had promising prospects who would one day be great Reds -- and then joke then they'd be ex-Reds, saying "of course we're going to lose them". #SellTheTeamBob
Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!
Tavaras wasn't a horrible player in his first three years in the majors though
age 23, OBP 325, 34 steals, WAR 1.9
age 24 OBP 333, 33 steals, WAR 2.6
age 35 OBP 367, 33 steals WAR 1.1 (only 372 AB)
That's obviously not a star player, but let's say Hamilton replicates that.
He will have more steals if Dusty lets him run. (I realize the value of steals is controversial)
Hamilton also projects to be a fantastic defensive CF.
If Bill H can OBP around the 333 mark like Wily T did for his first three seasons and provide great defense in CF, I'd call that a success for a 2nd round draft pick.
[Phil ] Castellini celebrated the team's farm system and noted the team had promising prospects who would one day be great Reds -- and then joke then they'd be ex-Reds, saying "of course we're going to lose them". #SellTheTeamBob
Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!
Revering4Blue (09-04-2013)
But the reality is that there's not many CF that are OBP monsters.
There's only 13 CF with at least 300 at bats that have been able to OBP 330 or better this year. Lower the bar to your unacceptable 320, and you have 21 qualifiers. Even Span, one of our big wish list items last year, is only OBPing 329 this year.
http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting...ePct/minpa/300
That's why I think if BillyH gives us elite defense in CF and OBP 315-320, he's going to be adequate. Not an allstar, but definitely adequate.
[Phil ] Castellini celebrated the team's farm system and noted the team had promising prospects who would one day be great Reds -- and then joke then they'd be ex-Reds, saying "of course we're going to lose them". #SellTheTeamBob
Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!
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