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Thread: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

  1. #1
    Moderator The Operator's Avatar
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    Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    http://insider.espn.go.com/blog/bust...y/post?id=3120

    But if you happened to see the last innings of the 16-inning grinder between the Cardinals and Reds and hung on long enough to see the St. Louis players celebrating the final out of a really important victory -- in which Matt Adams became the first player in major league history to club two homers after the 13th inning -- you couldn’t help but think Cincinnati blew it with the bunt along the way.

    Glad to see we aren't the only ones noticing how ridiculously much this team bunts. The worst part is - they aren't even remotely good at it. Sooo many outs just given away this year.
    Quote Originally Posted by BCubb2003 View Post
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    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Quote Originally Posted by The Operator View Post
    http://insider.espn.go.com/blog/bust...y/post?id=3120




    Glad to see we aren't the only ones noticing how ridiculously much this team bunts. The worst part is - they aren't even remotely good at it. Sooo many outs just given away this year.
    So true and in fairness to Dusty, he's not even calling for a lot of these. Dusty needs to have a team only meeting and let them know this was a national embarrassment and is not acceptable

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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    David Schoenfield
    http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/po...ro-in-st-louis

    In the 15th, Shin-Soo Choo led off with a base hit and Dusty Baker had 100-RBI man Brandon Phillips sacrifice. The stats guys on Twitter went crazy (Dusty never gets much love on Twitter), but Phillips does ground into a lot of double plays (16 on the season), and Joey Votto and Jay Bruce were on deck against right-handed Carlos Martinez. I'm in the "no bunting" club for the most part, and it's not often 100-RBI guys -- even overrated 100-RBI guys -- are asked to bunt. But, hey, National League baseball, or something like that. Maybe Dusty got caught up in Billy Hamilton and thought we were back in the 1980s. Anyway, Votto grounded out to move Choo to third, Bruce was intentionally walked and Chris Heisey then attempted to bunt (remember, two outs), missed the pitch, and Choo got caught in a rundown -- a play that has to go down as the worst of the season, or at least the worst in a crucial game in September that you can't afford to lose.

    The two teams have the final game of the series on Thursday. It's their last meeting of the year and the last chance the Cardinals have against their division's contenders to gain ground without help -- they're already done with the Pirates (the Reds and Pirates have six of their final nine against each other).

    Cardinals fans will remember this one for Matt Adams. I have a feeling Reds fans will remember this one for the bunts.

  7. #4
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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Heisey's bunt had nothing to do with 'bunt' strategy. He was trying to get a hit....as he's usually an exceptional bunter.

    Choo was the problem on that play.....and Olney might be better served pointed out the Reds continuous base running blunders.
    Baseball is like church. Many attend, few understand

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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Anthony Castrovince
    http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=mlb

    So certainly, all credit where it is due to the Cardinals for toughing it out on a tough night.

    But now that that is all out of the way, let's add this: The Reds lost this game. Lost it in ways that cannot be condoned.
    No, what made this loss more vexing was Buntapalooza, a squaring-up spree that sprouted up in extras and absolutely killed the Reds' would-be rallies.

    There are good bunts and bad bunts in baseball. Arroyo bunting in the second, fourth and sixth to advance runners to second and third? Good bunts. The latter two, executed with one out, did not result in any runs, but the strategy was sound.

    Bunting -- or, at least, attempting to bunt -- with Blazin' Billy Hamilton at first base with no outs in the 14th? Well, let's be kind and call it strange.

    Bunting with the winning run at first and no outs and Brandon Phillips, who reached 100 RBIs earlier in the evening, at the plate in the 15th? Let's be kind and call it… interesting.

    Bunting -- or, at least, attempting to bunt -- later that inning with two outs and the winning run at third? Let's be kind and… ah, forget it, I can't say anything kind about that.
    My focus is what happened next. With runners at the corners and two outs, Heisey squared up. He squared up against a guy who throws 99 mph. With two outs. Heisey's absolute best (and only) hope in that situation was to leg out a bunt single. Instead, he missed the bunt completely, and Choo was caught in the middle of the basepath and left for dead. He was tagged out to end the 15th, and Adams' second shot in the 16th put this one to bed.

    Heisey, Baker made it clear, was acting on his own.

    "You're not going to try and squeeze bunt with two outs," Baker said. "He thought that the third baseman was back."

    It was not a smart play, and it was one of several not-so-smart plays that came back to bite the Reds, much like the double-steal attempt Baker tried to pull with Bruce and Scott Rolen when Cincinnati had a rally going against Matt Cain in Game 5 of last year's Division Series.

    Again, maybe this loss does not loom as large as it felt in the aftermath. But that is not for us to know right now. All we know is that on a night when the Cardinals lost their cleanup man, the Reds gave away a ballgame, and both losses stung. Unlike the Craig injury, though, Buntapalooza could have been avoided.

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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Buntapalooza would have never reared its ugly head had the Reds taken care of business in the very first inning with a knock out punch...2nd & 3rd...no outs and the team failed to deliver a single run.

    palooza that!

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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post
    Dusty needs to have a team only meeting and let them know this was a national embarrassment and is not acceptable
    I am not saying Dusty should do this, but it would be funny to see a similar blunder in an NFL game and how the coaching staff would react. An NFL coach would freak out on the player and basically yell at them until they understand it is unacceptable. In MLB a manager/coach will pat a player on the back and say "aw, it's ok buddy, you'll do better next time!"

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    .377 in 1905 CySeymour's Avatar
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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I am not saying Dusty should do this, but it would be funny to see a similar blunder in an NFL game and how the coaching staff would react. An NFL coach would freak out on the player and basically yell at them until they understand it is unacceptable. In MLB a manager/coach will pat a player on the back and say "aw, it's ok buddy, you'll do better next time!"
    I always thought that was the big difference between Rose and Pinnella when Lou became the manager. Pete would always say something like "well, we don't want to take his aggressiveness away." But Lou would say "he's a big league ballplayer, he should know how to run the bases!"
    ...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound.

  15. #9
    Et tu, Brutus? Brutus's Avatar
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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    When the winning run is on first in the bottom half of extra innings with no one out, I'd bunt him over 89% of the time. The only 11% I wouldn't is the one time through the order my best hitter is at the plate.

    I fully and utterly, without any reservation, support Dusty's decision to sacrifice the runner over from first with no outs both times he did it. I also have no issues with Heisey trying to bunt for a hit.

    The only time the Reds attempted a bunt that I didn't agree with is down by one after the first Adams' homer. I don't like the idea of trying a sacrifice to score a tying run. But giving up the first out to get the winning run in scoring position? DO IT.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

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    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Someone should (tm) "Buntapalooza".

    Around cyber campfires in the future RZ when tales of woe and sad laments are being told, this will be known as the Buntapalooza game.

    So it is said.

    Pay attention to the open sky

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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Votto and Bruce go 0-13 and the Reds score 1 run after the 6th inning (in a 15 inning game) and the story is Dusty Baker.

    Hilarious. The Reds losing continues to be an excuse for people to vent their dislike for Dusty Baker, whether the points are valid or not.
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

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    The Boss dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    I am not saying Dusty should do this, but it would be funny to see a similar blunder in an NFL game and how the coaching staff would react. An NFL coach would freak out on the player and basically yell at them until they understand it is unacceptable. In MLB a manager/coach will pat a player on the back and say "aw, it's ok buddy, you'll do better next time!"
    The NFL plays 16 games. Each one is far more important than a single MLB game. A mistake in a single NFL game is huge. A mistake in an MLB game isn't nearly as costly.

    If a manager yelled at a player 50 games out of the year, they would quickly lose that team and probably wind up in a few fights with players. Different game, different circumstances.

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  22. #13
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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    When the winning run is on first in the bottom half of extra innings with no one out, I'd bunt him over 89% of the time. The only 11% I wouldn't is the one time through the order my best hitter is at the plate.

    I fully and utterly, without any reservation, support Dusty's decision to sacrifice the runner over from first with no outs both times he did it. I also have no issues with Heisey trying to bunt for a hit.

    The only time the Reds attempted a bunt that I didn't agree with is down by one after the first Adams' homer. I don't like the idea of trying a sacrifice to score a tying run. But giving up the first out to get the winning run in scoring position? DO IT.
    Agreed. I thought sacrificing with Hamilton on 1st base was an odd move.

    Phillips is a DP waiting to happen, especially against a hard throwing righty. I have no problem with taking the DP out of order and giving yourself 2 chances to get a hit (one which was guranteed to either be Votto or Bruce).

    I didn't even have issues with Heisey trying to lay one down. I think if he gets it down the Reds win. The only risk should have been a strike. Can't blame Dusty for Choo doing whatever that was.
    Quote Originally Posted by PuffyPig View Post
    Let's face it, you mis-hit the bun with the mustard squirter, no one will really care.

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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    There are dozens of moments that win and lose MLB games. Hack writers and lazy-boy fans like to zero in on one and act like it was the only reason or at least the main reason why a team won or lost.

    Even if you agree that the team bunted too much in last night's game, it's insulting and ignorant to argue that that was why the team lost. The game is far more complex than that, which is why the game is so wonderful to watch.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

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  26. #15
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    Re: Buster Olney: A Bunt addiction burns The Reds

    BTW, Votto gets a hit after Phillips' bunt, and Dusty is a genius.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

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