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Thread: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

  1. #46
    Danger is my business! oneupper's Avatar
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    I saw a video of Guerrero playing SS on youtube. I don't have a scout's eye, but he looked "stiff" for my taste. I'd say there's a reason they're projecting him at second or third.

    Frankly, if you want a bat a SS that bad, you might as well play Frazier there.
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  3. #47
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    Quote Originally Posted by oneupper View Post
    I saw a video of Guerrero playing SS on youtube. I don't have a scout's eye, but he looked "stiff" for my taste. I'd say there's a reason they're projecting him at second or third.

    Frankly, if you want a bat a SS that bad, you might as well play Frazier there.
    Maybe we saw the same video. His footwork was anything but smooth. Like you, I'm no scout. But I don't see him at second either. I see him playing a Martin Prado-ish 3rd.
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  4. #48
    Member klw's Avatar
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2013/1...-guerrero.html

    Dodgers Still In Mix For Alexander Guerrero
    By Zach Links [October 15, 2013 at 9:36pm CST]
    The Dodgers thought they had a deal with Cuban second baseman Alexander Guerrero several weeks ago, but the pact dissolved when it was discovered that Guerrero's first representatives were not certified agents. Since then, the Dodgers have said that their previous five-year, $32MM deal was off the table, but that may have just been posturing. The Dodgers are again one of a few teams in the thick of the Guerrero talks, people familiar with the discussions tell Jon Heyman of CBSSports.com.

    Since the L.A. deal fell apart, Guerrero signed on with Scott Boras and the agent immediately opened the bidding back up to all major league clubs. Now, the 26-year-old is only seeking a four-year deal so that he can once again become a free agent at the age of 30. Many of the clubs in the mix for Guerrero are seeking a longer pact, but Heyman writes that the team willing to meet his asking price on a four-year deal will be the victor.

    The Giants, Rangers, Red Sox, and Reds have also been connected to Guerrero in recent weeks. However, Reds GM Walt Jocketty said yesterday that he expects the Cuban to sign elsewhere and a Rangers source suggested to Heyman that they're not making an aggressive push for him. Heyman adds that it's possible the Cardinals will get involved with Guerrero this winter.

  5. #49
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    I find it hard to believe a player who had all but signed with the Dodgers who then hires Boras wouldn't end up a Dodger.
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    I love the part where he can become a free agent after 4 years. Really? So Cubans are offered the right to become free agents after 4 years but everyone else must wait 6? I don't think so.
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  8. #51
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    Quote Originally Posted by paulrichjr View Post
    I love the part where he can become a free agent after 4 years. Really? So Cubans are offered the right to become free agents after 4 years but everyone else must wait 6? I don't think so.
    Yeah, that part confuses me too.
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    The Giants, Rangers, Red Sox, and Reds have also been connected to Guerrero in recent weeks. However, Reds GM Walt Jocketty said yesterday that he expects the Cuban to sign elsewhere and a Rangers source suggested to Heyman that they're not making an aggressive push for him. Heyman adds that it's possible the Cardinals will get involved with Guerrero this winter.
    Ugh, this could be another example of Walt passing on a guy who can fill a need for us only to see that guy goes to a rival and destroy our pitching.
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  10. #53
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    Quote Originally Posted by paulrichjr View Post
    I love the part where he can become a free agent after 4 years. Really? So Cubans are offered the right to become free agents after 4 years but everyone else must wait 6? I don't think so.
    He's a free agent right now. MLB organizations have spent no time or money developing the guy. Why would they be entitled to hold his rights beyond whatever contact he signs?
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  12. #54
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    Quote Originally Posted by George Foster View Post
    If he can play SS or 2nd base he sure as heck can play 3rd base. Johnny Bench played 3rd base later in his career to keep his bat in the line-up. We need bats, we need guys that put the ball in play. Trade Frazier or platoon him in left and release Heisey. When Guerrero needs a blow Frazier can play 3rd. When BP needs a blow Guerrero can play 2nd.... this solves a lot of problems.
    Good plan as long as Guerrero is at least a productive player as Frazier.
    Not criticizing your idea, but I wonder if the Reds are doubting Guerrero's talent level for the price tag? Because for 30 million, you can get a decent player with a track record.

    I'd hate to see the Reds sign Guerrero and then have sit through Redszone complaining for 6 years about what an albotross Guerrero is
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    If you look at his numbers for the Cuban team, he's far from the only player that put put great numbers. 80-85 mph is normal for starting pitching in that league. His power numbers look pretty good though for that position.

  14. #56
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    Quote Originally Posted by paulrichjr View Post
    I love the part where he can become a free agent after 4 years. Really? So Cubans are offered the right to become free agents after 4 years but everyone else must wait 6? I don't think so.
    That's the downside of signing with Boras.
    Boras is clearly trying to push the envelope and use Guerrero to set a precedent for FA after 4 years. He's done other game changing deals like this in the past too for the benefit of future clients. Unfortunately, some of his clients get screwed by these tactics. Boras said in an interview roughly 10-15 years ago that part of his agenda is to "break the system" because he thinks it artificially holds down players' salaries.

    I'm guessing no owner is going to cave and give him FA after 4 years.
    The owners are now cooperating more for their greater profitablity than they were years ago. It makes no sense to open the floodgates for early FA, just to get Guerrero. Especially if Guerrero needs a year or two in the minors.. How does that make sense?
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  15. #57
    Worst Behavior. reds44's Avatar
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    He's a free agent right now. MLB organizations have spent no time or money developing the guy. Why would they be entitled to hold his rights beyond whatever contact he signs?
    I'm confused, don't the Reds have Chapman under control for 6 years no matter what? Isn't Guerrero the same way?
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  16. #58
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    He's a free agent right now. MLB organizations have spent no time or money developing the guy. Why would they be entitled to hold his rights beyond whatever contact he signs?
    Great point. Logically makes sense.
    But the owners POV is that Guerrero is going to spend time in the minors.
    Also, why set the precedent that all other foreign FAs will want to get?
    The owners have gotten smarter, IMO.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

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  17. #59
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    Quote Originally Posted by mdccclxix View Post
    If you look at his numbers for the Cuban team, he's far from the only player that put put great numbers. 80-85 mph is normal for starting pitching in that league. His power numbers look pretty good though for that position.
    The pitching in that league may not be up to par with the pitching in the MLB, but I do not think that you can deny that Cuban hitters have done pretty well in this league. Puig and Cespedes are the big names, but there are also guys like Alexei Ramirez, Jose Iglesias, and Yunel Escobar. Don't forget that one of the better parts of the BRM was a Cuban in Tony Perez. Also, there have been some pretty good pitchers to come out of Cuba too. Namely, Chapman and Jose Fernandez.

    If I were the Reds I would take the chance on either (or both) of Guerrero and Abreu. Guerrero's numbers are in line with Tulo's and the expected price is 1/3 that of Tulo. And Abreu's expected price is around 1/2 that of the better performing 3B in MLB including Miggy, Beltre, Zimmerman, Young.
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    Re: Reds still in on Alexander Guerrero !

    Quote Originally Posted by BungleBengals View Post
    The pitching in that league may not be up to par with the pitching in the MLB, but I do not think that you can deny that Cuban hitters have done pretty well in this league. Puig and Cespedes are the big names, but there are also guys like Alexei Ramirez, Jose Iglesias, and Yunel Escobar. Don't forget that one of the better parts of the BRM was a Cuban in Tony Perez. Also, there have been some pretty good pitchers to come out of Cuba too. Namely, Chapman and Jose Fernandez.

    If I were the Reds I would take the chance on either (or both) of Guerrero and Abreu. Guerrero's numbers are in line with Tulo's and the expected price is 1/3 that of Tulo. And Abreu's expected price is around 1/2 that of the better performing 3B in MLB including Miggy, Beltre, Zimmerman, Young.


    I think you are the only one who thinks that Abreu has any legit chance to be a 3B from everything that I have read on him.

    Jose Fernandez, while from Cuba went to HS in Florida like Alonso and Grandal.

    Tulowitski is a legit SS, and proven star. Guererro is neither of those at this time. So that's a rough comp to make for him.


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