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Thread: How good is Billy Hamilton?

  1. #1
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    How good is Billy Hamilton?

    Folks, I have visions of sugar plums dancing in my head for the Reds lineup going forward.

    Last night Billy looked WAY better with the bat than I expected. From scouting reports I thought he would look frail and overmatched against major league pitchers, but instead he look spry and even threatening at the plate, despite his thin stature. He also seems to have a knack for spraying the ball down the lines and inside the bags, which makes his speed that much more dangerous. I couldn't believe he was standing on second after such a short amount of time.

    Walt -- sign Choo and put this lineup out there next year, please:

    Hamilton CF
    Choo LF
    Votto 1B
    Bruce RF
    Phillips 2B
    Frazier 3B
    Mesoraco C
    Cozart SS
    Pitcher

    What a fun lineup that could be to watch!
    Last edited by RedEye; 09-19-2013 at 11:28 AM.

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    KC2135 (09-20-2013)

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  4. #2

    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    Folks, I have visions of sugar plums dancing in my head for the Reds lineup going forward.

    Last night Billy looked WAY better with the bat than I expected. From scouting reports I thought he would look frail and overmatched against major league pitchers, but instead he look spry and even threatening at the plate, despite his thin stature. He also seems to have a knack for spraying the ball down the lines and inside the bags, which makes his speed that much more dangerous. I couldn't believe he was standing on second after such a short amount of time.

    Walt -- sign Choo and put this lineup out there next year, please:

    Hamilton CF
    Choo LF
    Votto 1B
    Bruce RF
    Phillips 2B
    Frazier 3B
    Mesoraco C
    Cozart SS
    Pitcher

    What a fun lineup that could be to watch!
    No he is not that good yet. Sugar Plums?
    Last edited by Hubba; 09-19-2013 at 12:07 PM.
    HUBBA A man who knows everything,just can't remember it all at one time.

  5. #3
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hubba View Post
    No he is not that good yet. Sugar Plums?
    "Night Before Christmas" reference. You know, before opening your presents. Maybe not a perfect joke for RZ.

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    One and a half men Patrick Bateman's Avatar
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    As a hitter, right now the answer is no. He's probably a .600 OPS guy in the majors at this juncture. In the field and basepaths? I think it's pretty clear he's the best baserunner in baseball, and from the scouting reports I hear, it sounds like he might be that lethal in the field too.

    He probably already has enough attributes that he can add some value to a major league lineup even with a .600 OPS. I'd still rather wait to let his bat season at the appropriate levels so we can try to turn him into a capable .700 guy rather than hinder his development. If he can do just that, and I think the chances are reasonably good, then yes, he can be an absolute star.

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    RedEye (09-19-2013)

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    Newbie Rock of Truth's Avatar
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    What is crazy to me is that with only 2 weeks in 'the Bigs' he is 2nd on the team in stolen bases. Maybe that says more about the current line up than it does about Billy. For me, his hitting is still a little bit too slappy. Maybe when he is done, bring in Ichiro to help him refine that craft.

  9. #6
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman View Post
    As a hitter, right now the answer is no. He's probably a .600 OPS guy in the majors at this juncture. In the field and basepaths? I think it's pretty clear he's the best baserunner in baseball, and from the scouting reports I hear, it sounds like he might be that lethal in the field too.

    He probably already has enough attributes that he can add some value to a major league lineup even with a .600 OPS. I'd still rather wait to let his bat season at the appropriate levels so we can try to turn him into a capable .700 guy rather than hinder his development. If he can do just that, and I think the chances are reasonably good, then yes, he can be an absolute star.

    OPS isn't going to matter much with Hamilton. OBP is all that is going to matter. A single is almost a guaranteed double. You think someone will come up with a new stat for him, because of that?

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    Old school 1983 (09-19-2013)

  11. #7
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by hebroncougar View Post
    OPS isn't going to matter much with Hamilton. OBP is all that is going to matter. A single is almost a guaranteed double. You think someone will come up with a new stat for him, because of that?
    If Billy can put up an OBP in the .330 to .350 range, he is going to be deadly IMO. Anything more than that will make him lethal. And something less than that will still make him a useful player.

  12. #8
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rock of Truth View Post
    What is crazy to me is that with only 2 weeks in 'the Bigs' he is 2nd on the team in stolen bases. Maybe that says more about the current line up than it does about Billy. For me, his hitting is still a little bit too slappy. Maybe when he is done, bring in Ichiro to help him refine that craft.
    I think it says something about both Billy (Flash) and the current lineup (nobody runs real well).

  13. #9
    Member cumberlandreds's Avatar
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    If Billy can put up an OBP in the .330 to .350 range, he is going to be deadly IMO. Anything more than that will make him lethal. And something less than that will still make him a useful player.
    I have said that before on here. If he OBP's just .330 he is a highly effective player. If he finds the magic to OBP around .400 he is a big time star.
    Reds Fan Since 1971

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    RedEye (09-19-2013)

  15. #10
    One and a half men Patrick Bateman's Avatar
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by hebroncougar View Post
    OPS isn't going to matter much with Hamilton. OBP is all that is going to matter. A single is almost a guaranteed double. You think someone will come up with a new stat for him, because of that?
    Agreed. but he's probably going to have trouble with a .300 OBP at this point (just spitballing based on his minor league performance). I think he has a quite a bit of potential in that regard in the future though.

  16. #11
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman View Post
    Agreed. but he's probably going to have trouble with a .300 OBP at this point (just spitballing based on his minor league performance). I think he has a quite a bit of potential in that regard in the future though.
    Yeah, I agree. But as others have pointed out in the minor league forum, Billy shows great aptitude for improvement so far after some time at a new level. He was starting to trend up in AAA after an abysmal start. I think his first 1000 PA's in the majors will tell us a lot about where he is and where he can go.

  17. #12
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    Folks, I have visions of sugar plums dancing in my head for the Reds lineup going forward.

    Last night Billy looked WAY better with the bat than I expected. From scouting reports I thought he would look frail and overmatched against major league pitchers, but instead he look spry and even threatening at the plate, despite his thin stature. He also seems to have a knack for spraying the ball down the lines and inside the bags, which makes his speed that much more dangerous. I couldn't believe he was standing on second after such a short amount of time.

    Walt -- sign Choo and put this lineup out there next year, please:

    Hamilton CF
    Choo LF
    Votto 1B
    Bruce RF
    Phillips 2B
    Frazier 3B
    Mesoraco C
    Cozart SS
    Pitcher

    What a fun lineup that could be to watch!
    Man I certainly hope so. I would just caution on the excitement tho. I know last night was GREAT, but I think a lot of the negativity levied toward Bruce early on was because he tore it up early. Also, I would hit Hamilton 9th and the pitcher 8th. I know Dusty probly wouldn't do that, but it would take a lot of the pressure off him hitting leadoff. If they were to somehow resign Choo then he could still hit leadoff. If they can't resign Choo then who knows what, might have to hit Hamilton leadoff. Just my thoughts on it tho!!!

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    _Sir_Charles_ (09-19-2013)

  19. #13
    Member hebroncougar's Avatar
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedEye View Post
    If Billy can put up an OBP in the .330 to .350 range, he is going to be deadly IMO. Anything more than that will make him lethal. And something less than that will still make him a useful player.
    Honestly, I don't know if it HAS to get that high based on his SB's. How often does Choo make it to 2b w/o an out being made? If Billy's OBP was .310, and he steals 2b successfully (theoretically) 90% of the time, before an out is made. That means, what, he's reaching second base .9 X .310, he's reaching 2b without an out being made 27.9% of the time. Now that's all based on some seriously hypothetical numbers, but is there a value you can place on THAT number? I really don't know. Any serious stats guys out there know? Am I out of my mind for even thinking it?

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    Old school 1983 (09-19-2013)

  21. #14
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    Re: Is Billy Hamilton really this good?

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman View Post
    As a hitter, right now the answer is no. He's probably a .600 OPS guy in the majors at this juncture. In the field and basepaths? I think it's pretty clear he's the best baserunner in baseball, and from the scouting reports I hear, it sounds like he might be that lethal in the field too.

    He probably already has enough attributes that he can add some value to a major league lineup even with a .600 OPS. I'd still rather wait to let his bat season at the appropriate levels so we can try to turn him into a capable .700 guy rather than hinder his development. If he can do just that, and I think the chances are reasonably good, then yes, he can be an absolute star.
    I fundamentally agree with you, but which is better?

    A. Choo's defense in LF, Hamilton's Defense in CF, and Hamilton's (likely) ~.600 OPS bat

    or

    B. Choo's Defense in CF, Ludwick's Defense in LF, and Ludwick's .626 (2013)/.794(career) OPS bat?

    I lean toward A in a playoff run.

  22. #15
    Member Billy Hamilton's Legs's Avatar
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    Re: How good is Billy Hamilton?

    I just love watching him (if you couldn't tell from the username); on both sides of the ball he has the potential to make a lot of really exciting plays that we haven't seen in awhile. I know it probably wouldn't have worked, but imagine if he could have stuck at SS. Only in dreams I guess.
    Just call me Legs


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