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Thread: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

  1. #16
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    If Boros gets his way


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    REDREAD (09-27-2013)

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  4. #17
    Member Old school 1983's Avatar
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    If Choo leaves, it will be terrible, but there is a bright side.

    Maybe then the Reds will focus on putting together a real championship caliber offense.

    They may be forced to make changes if Choo leaves that they otherwise might not make.

    Still, would rather Choo stays, terrific player.
    Id almost rather see him go, collect the pick, and build the championship caliber offense they needed this year. Get a right handed power bat please.
    Last edited by Old school 1983; 09-25-2013 at 06:42 PM.

  5. #18
    It's showtime! RedEye's Avatar
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Walt and Scott seems to be trading (equally unreliable) opinions in the press these days. Hard to tell what will happen, but the two sides are posturing, that's for sure.

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    Drugs Delaney (09-28-2013)

  7. #19
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Quote Originally Posted by mattfeet View Post
    http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/writer/...ref_map=%5B%5D

    Thinks 5yr/$100MM is "not in the ballpark" and that Choo will get more.

    "The value of a lead-off hitter who has a .420 on-base percentage, 20-stolen base speed, 20-home run power, the ability to score 100 runs, and who has the ability to play center field and is a Gold Glove type defender in right field is immense," Boras said. "We don't see these types of players in the free-agent market. I only want to talk about our clients, and the last one we had anywhere near this was Jayson Werth."

    Thanks for 2013, Mr. Choo. If Boras holds hard to this line of thinking I REALLY dont think the Reds will pay it, nor would I want them to do so. Who knows how it'll pan out...we'll see.

    -Matt
    Citing Jayson Werth and his massive contract is only going underscore the risk involved with such contracts.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    HokieRed (09-25-2013), REDREAD (09-27-2013), wlf WV (09-30-2013)

  9. #20
    Member Billy Hamilton's Legs's Avatar
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    My question is: what happens when a guy like Jesse Winker or Phillip Ervin come knocking on the door in a couple years? While the Reds payroll is increasing, it has a limit and you need young, cheap talent to survive. Also, how would people's opinions change if signing Choo prevents the Reds from signing two out of the three big arms long term?
    Just call me Legs

  10. #21
    Member Old school 1983's Avatar
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy Hamilton's Legs View Post
    My question is: what happens when a guy like Jesse Winker or Phillip Ervin come knocking on the door in a couple years? While the Reds payroll is increasing, it has a limit and you need young, cheap talent to survive. Also, how would people's opinions change if signing Choo prevents the Reds from signing two out of the three big arms long term?
    I for one am super excited about winker and ervin and see that while Choos OBP is awesome, it is the pitching that is carrying this team. If we have to chose, I chose pitching. Or pitching and maybe trying to acquire a younger or cheaper right handed hitter at one of our positions of need.

  11. #22
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Give Bailey the money and let Choo walk. I've thought all along that a 31 year old Choo would be very unwise to go for less than 5 years. I expect 6 for 90 and I think that's too much for the Reds. I would try to keep Bailey instead but don't expect that to be possible either. Maybe, as KC pointed out earlier, this will get the FO to think about how to restructure the offense rather than simply thinking of holding on to particular players or plugging in replacements for them.

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    Old school 1983 (09-26-2013), wlf WV (09-30-2013)

  13. #23
    5.3 Posts Abv Replacement BluegrassRedleg's Avatar
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Quote Originally Posted by mattfeet View Post
    http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/writer/...ref_map=%5B%5D

    Thinks 5yr/$100MM is "not in the ballpark" and that Choo will get more.

    "The value of a lead-off hitter who has a .420 on-base percentage, 20-stolen base speed, 20-home run power, the ability to score 100 runs, and who has the ability to play center field and is a Gold Glove type defender in right field is immense," Boras said. "We don't see these types of players in the free-agent market. I only want to talk about our clients, and the last one we had anywhere near this was Jayson Werth."

    Thanks for 2013, Mr. Choo. If Boras holds hard to this line of thinking I REALLY dont think the Reds will pay it, nor would I want them to do so. Who knows how it'll pan out...we'll see.

    -Matt
    Good luck to the organization who's paying him $20M-plus at age 37.
    Rounding third and heading for home...

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    klw (09-26-2013)

  15. #24
    Brett William Moore Will M's Avatar
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    when asked in a chat what he thought Choo would get Dave Cameron replied 5/75
    .

  16. #25
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Boras' remark that 5yr/$100MM is "not in the ballpark" and that Choo will get more seems pretty reasonable to me.
    There is nothing insane about that if you know the facts that Choo is the best offensive player among 2014 free-agent position players and that he's offensively even better than Cano who was born the same year as him and will seek $200 million contract.

    *2013
    Choo: .394wOBA(10th in MLB), 152wRC+(8th in MLB)
    Cano: .384wOBA(16th in MLB), 142wRC+(18th in MLB)

    *Career
    Choo: .374wOBA, 135wRC+
    Cano: .368wOBA, 126wRC+
    Last edited by junkhead; 09-26-2013 at 02:53 AM.

  17. #26
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Quote Originally Posted by Will M View Post
    when asked in a chat what he thought Choo would get Dave Cameron replied 5/75
    Even Andre Ethier got a 6 yrs/$95.95M contract.

  18. #27
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    Citing Jayson Werth and his massive contract is only going underscore the risk involved with such contracts.
    No kidding. I did a double take when I read that. Did he really just mention that? I thought agents would try to bury that deep in the Gary Matthews Jr closet by now. The fact that Jayson Werth is the best comparison is the EXACT reason everyone is worried.

  19. #28
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Quote Originally Posted by swaisuc View Post
    No kidding. I did a double take when I read that. Did he really just mention that? I thought agents would try to bury that deep in the Gary Matthews Jr closet by now. The fact that Jayson Werth is the best comparison is the EXACT reason everyone is worried.
    According to fWAR, he has been actually WERTH the money so far except for an injury-plagued season(2012).

    *2011
    Salary: $10.5M Actual Value: $10.5M

    *2012
    Salary: $13M Actual Value: $3.0M

    *2013
    Salary: $16M Actual Value: $22.2M
    Last edited by junkhead; 09-26-2013 at 08:23 AM.

  20. #29
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    Quote Originally Posted by junkhead View Post
    Boras' remark that 5yr/$100MM is "not in the ballpark" and that Choo will get more seems pretty reasonable to me.
    There is nothing insane about that if you know the facts that Choo is the best offensive player among 2014 free-agent position players and that he's offensively even better than Cano who was born the same year as him and will seek $200 million contract.

    *2013
    Choo: .394wOBA(10th in MLB), 152wRC+(8th in MLB)
    Cano: .384wOBA(16th in MLB), 142wRC+(18th in MLB)

    *Career
    Choo: .374wOBA, 135wRC+
    Cano: .368wOBA, 126wRC+
    Cano and Choo are the same age, but Cano plays a good defensive 2nd base while being the best offensive player at his position in the league (Carpenter has been better this year, but he has to do it for a few more years to overtake him). Choo plays a below average defensive CF. I think Choo is going to get paid a lot, but I do not think Cano is an equal comparision.

  21. #30
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    Re: If Boras gets his way, Choo likely won't be a Red.

    The Mets are now saying they won't go beyond 4 years for Choo. It'll make things a bit harder for Boras to get 5 for Choo.


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