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Thread: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

  1. #61
    Member membengal's Avatar
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Big Klu..."sleazeball politics" with waiver wire claims? Claiming guys to block competitors from getting them post trade-deadline is SOP...

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  3. #62
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by junkhead View Post
    Frankly, starting Hamilton instead of Choo or Ludwick is the craziest idea I have ever heard.
    Stick around here longer, you will hear crazier ideas almost every week. ex. there was this one summer I was pushing Alex Gonzalez to be the lead off guy.

  4. #63
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    If someone clearly isn't an improvement, why should they get credit for "trying?"

    The Reds were "trying" to improve when they signed Wily Taveras, but everyone knew he wasn't going to improve the club much, if at all.

    Morneau absolutely has not been productive. He had a .741 OPS with Minnesota and has a .683 OPS with Pittsburgh. Morneau was a name acquisition only.
    Morneau has a .370 OBP. He certainly hasn't turned it around like they had hoped with a change of scenery, but he hasn't been a flop either. When you make two moves and one works out great and the other is getting you a .370 OBP you have improved your team. Their lineup and their bench is better now than it was a couple months ago.

  5. #64
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by davereds24 View Post
    Morneau has a .370 OBP. He certainly hasn't turned it around like they had hoped with a change of scenery, but he hasn't been a flop either. When you make two moves and one works out great and the other is getting you a .370 OBP you have improved your team. Their lineup and their bench is better now than it was a couple months ago.
    He didn't improve the team, though. A .311 wOBA, for a premium position, is really poor. The MLB average for first basemen this year is .333. To give perspective, Casey Kotchman's career wOBA was .313.

    Ignore the name "Morneau" for a moment and imagine the Pirates trading for Casey Kotchman and try to tell me that is an upgrade.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  6. #65
    The Future is Now Ghosts of 1990's Avatar
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    Yeah I mean, how on earth did they ever win 90 games with things as bad as they are? The sky is definitely going to fall for real this time.
    Okay, but they haven't really been able to get hot all season. Who cares about 90 wins. That's great... but it wasn't enough. Wasn't the goal this year to win a playoff series?
    2009 Attendance Record: 3-5 2010 Attendance Record: 2-9
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  7. #66
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghosts of 1990 View Post
    Okay, but they haven't really been able to get hot all season. Who cares about 90 wins. That's great... but it wasn't enough. Wasn't the goal this year to win a playoff series?
    What wasn't enough? They're in the playoffs and they start Tuesday.

    Are you preemptively writing the season off as a failure based on not winning a playoff series before the playoffs begin?
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  8. #67
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghosts of 1990 View Post
    Okay, but they haven't really been able to get hot all season. Who cares about 90 wins. That's great... but it wasn't enough. Wasn't the goal this year to win a playoff series?
    You can go 1-0, 3-2, 4-3 and 4-3 and win the World Series. Never once having to get hot.

  9. #68
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    What wasn't enough? They're in the playoffs and they start Tuesday.

    Are you preemptively writing the season off as a failure based on not winning a playoff series before the playoffs begin?
    It wasn't enough that they didn't win 90 games the way people wanted them too. More consistently with their offense. Or more hot streaks (which of course would mean more losing streaks). Or with more "fire" or with more throwing bases at umpires. Or something.

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    Brutus (09-29-2013), Homer Bailey (09-29-2013)

  11. #69
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    It wasn't enough that they didn't win 90 games the way people wanted them too. More consistently with their offense. Or more hot streaks (which of course would mean more losing streaks). Or with more "fire" or with more throwing bases at umpires. Or something.
    Indeed. And yet someone will inevitably show up to say we aren't allowing for "rational" discussion because they're allowed to be "critical."
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  12. #70
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    Indeed. And yet someone will inevitably show up to say we aren't allowing for "rational" discussion because they're allowed to be "critical."
    They clearly haven't paid attention to my posting habits here or on twitter then.

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  14. #71
    Knowledge Is Good Big Klu's Avatar
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    Big Klu..."sleazeball politics" with waiver wire claims? Claiming guys to block competitors from getting them post trade-deadline is SOP...
    It was hardly ever done until Jimbo started doing it. Before then, GM's had a gentlemen's agreement, "I won't claim the guys you want if you won't claim the guys I want."
    Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.

  15. #72
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    He didn't improve the team, though. A .311 wOBA, for a premium position, is really poor. The MLB average for first basemen this year is .333. To give perspective, Casey Kotchman's career wOBA was .313.

    Ignore the name "Morneau" for a moment and imagine the Pirates trading for Casey Kotchman and try to tell me that is an upgrade.
    You're using a 25 game sample (92 PA).

    For some context, Morneau's combined 2013 wOBA is .321. Which on the Reds roster ranks behind only Votto, Choo, Bruce and Paul. I imagine the Pirates saw an opportunity to add a decent LH bat, for relatively little in return, which would give them additional options for lineup/roster construction. That he's underperformed since the trade shouldn't cloud the decision making at the time.

    He sure would be appealing to me as a lefty PH off the bench in the playoffs instead of one of Hanrahan or Izturis.

  16. #73
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fil3232 View Post
    You're using a 25 game sample (92 PA).

    For some context, Morneau's combined 2013 wOBA is .321. Which on the Reds roster ranks behind only Votto, Choo, Bruce and Paul. I imagine the Pirates saw an opportunity to add a decent LH bat, for relatively little in return, which would give them additional options for lineup/roster construction. That he's underperformed since the trade shouldn't cloud the decision making at the time.

    He sure would be appealing to me as a lefty PH off the bench in the playoffs instead of one of Hanrahan or Izturis.
    He was a below average option when they acquired him (which I said at the time so I'm being consistent about this).

    If you're concerned about simply acquiring a left-handed pinch hitter for the playoffs, first and foremost, I would not acquire a guy who can only play one position and I would also not acquire a guy who is paid several million to be nothing more than a pinch hitter. There are many better options out there than a one-position, multi-million, .321 wOBA hitter.
    "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

  17. #74
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    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Brutus View Post
    He was a below average option when they acquired him (which I said at the time so I'm being consistent about this).

    If you're concerned about simply acquiring a left-handed pinch hitter for the playoffs, first and foremost, I would not acquire a guy who can only play one position and I would also not acquire a guy who is paid several million to be nothing more than a pinch hitter. There are many better options out there than a one-position, multi-million, .321 wOBA hitter.
    It's a shame Walt couldn't find one.

  18. #75

    Re: Reds need to shake things up in the WC game.

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Klu View Post
    It was hardly ever done until Jimbo started doing it. Before then, GM's had a gentlemen's agreement, "I won't claim the guys you want if you won't claim the guys I want."
    HUH?
    HUBBA A man who knows everything,just can't remember it all at one time.


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