Paul Daugherty says Brandon Phillips is very available

[Wonderful Monds]

I dig Gardner too, but I dread the potential black hole at 2B.

Just do what the Cardinals would do.

Trade for Gardner and then play him at second base.

[mth123]

1. Phillips for Gardner
2. Leake for Howie Kendrick
3. Chapman to the rotation
4. Find a middle reliever for a couple million or maybe a scrap heap closer with injury issues. Andrew Bailey? Joel Hanrahan? Anyone go back to the Ryan Madson well? Seems like there are more closers available than there will be spots. Rodney, Benoit, Balfour, Gregg, Mujica, Perez, Veras, Wilson. Lots of other middle relief options, some with closing experience like K-Rod, Gregg, etc. Some of these guys are going to be available on the cheap in January IMO.

[dubc47834]

Gardner could move to left next year. He'd be fine. But he's a free agent after this year. Reds would have to extend him or get a prospect with him.

Gardner and Hamilton could eventually be a very potent top of the order combo.

Phillips isn't getting you a big righty bat.

As far as second base, Reds should just go out and spend some money and sign Infante before he's off the market. BP is going -- they should just do it. Overpay a bit, just sign Infante.

Overpay...isnt that what everyone is complaining about with BP. Makes total sense, lets trade our All-Star 2B and probly not get the value he is probly worth then over pay a "bit" to get Infante.........makes total buisness sense!!!

[dubc47834]

1. Phillips for Gardner
2. Leake for Howie Kendrick
3. Chapman to the rotation
4. Find a middle reliever for a couple million or maybe a scrap heap closer with injury issues. Andrew Bailey? Joel Hanrahan? Anyone go back to the Ryan Madson well? Seems like there are more closers available than there will be spots. Rodney, Benoit, Balfour, Gregg, Mujica, Perez, Veras, Wilson. Lots of other middle relief options, some with closing experience like K-Rod, Gregg, etc. Some of these guys are going to be available on the cheap in January IMO.

Is this MLB2K14?

[REDREAD]

You put that lineup out and expect to contend with the Cardinals?

If that's the plan I would just assume trade Phillips for prospects, trade Bailey for prospects and trade Leake for prospects. Put Chapman in the rotation and use 2014 as a test year. You have a wave of prospects coming for 2015 already in Stephenson, Winker, Irvin, Yorman and Lorenzen. If you could supplement that with 3 or 4 more good prospects you could have a new window starting in 2015. Latos, Cingrani, Bruce, Votto, Chapman, Mesoraco, Cueto, Hamilton, Hoover would all still be young enough to contribute with the next wave coming.

The Reds have a great chance of making the playoffs in 2014 without making any more moves. Sure, a less chance than StL of winning the World Series, but the strategy is to get into the playoffs with a strong defense and bullpen and hope your starting pitchers have a good game...

If the Reds trade Phillips, Homer and Leake for prospects now, they are wasting good/relatively cheap years from their good players (Bruce, Latos, Cueto, Chapman).. Then in 2015, they have to find 2 starting pitchers, a 2b, a LF, and possibly other players too.
Now is the time to go for it. Rebuilding period will arrive naturally (before we want it to).

[NeilHamburger]

The Reds have a great chance of making the playoffs in 2014 without making any more moves. Sure, a less chance than StL of winning the World Series, but the strategy is to get into the playoffs with a strong defense and bullpen and hope your starting pitchers have a good game...

If the Reds trade Phillips, Homer and Leake for prospects now, they are wasting good/relatively cheap years from their good players (Bruce, Latos, Cueto, Chapman).. Then in 2015, they have to find 2 starting pitchers, a 2b, a LF, and possibly other players too.
Now is the time to go for it. Rebuilding period will arrive naturally (before we want it to).

There is a very good chance Homer won't be a Red in 2015. Leake will be very costly, and Phillips will probably be in a pretty good decline.

My 2015 rotation would be Cueto, Latos, Chapman, Stephenson and Cingrani.

One of Winker, Irvin or Yorman should be ready for left field. I know prospects are a crap shoot, but by trading some good players now you'll be able to stock pile a very very good farm system. It's one year. It's not like it's a 5 year rebuild. In trades I'm looking for 2nd base, SS or 3rd base help. You add a couple of good infield prospects to go with Winker, Irvin, Yorman, Stephenson, Hamilton, Lorenzen and you have a hell of a good young group coming up starting in 2015.

I think if you do a quick rebuild now, and are smart with the trades, you have a new window starting in 2015 that will go for another 5 years.

[Falls City Beer]

The Reds have a great chance of making the playoffs in 2014 without making any more moves. Sure, a less chance than StL of winning the World Series, but the strategy is to get into the playoffs with a strong defense and bullpen and hope your starting pitchers have a good game...

If the Reds trade Phillips, Homer and Leake for prospects now, they are wasting good/relatively cheap years from their good players (Bruce, Latos, Cueto, Chapman).. Then in 2015, they have to find 2 starting pitchers, a 2b, a LF, and possibly other players too.
Now is the time to go for it. Rebuilding period will arrive naturally (before we want it to).

The Reds have a so so chance without making anymore moves. I don't think most people grasp what losing Choo and Arroyo is likely to mean without reliable replacements. This is a wobbly roster right now.

[RiverRat13]

There is a very good chance Homer won't be a Red in 2015. Leake will be very costly, and Phillips will probably be in a pretty good decline.

My 2015 rotation would be Cueto, Latos, Chapman, Stephenson and Cingrani.

One of Winker, Irvin or Yorman should be ready for left field. I know prospects are a crap shoot, but by trading some good players now you'll be able to stock pile a very very good farm system. It's one year. It's not like it's a 5 year rebuild. In trades I'm looking for 2nd base, SS or 3rd base help. You add a couple of good infield prospects to go with Winker, Irvin, Yorman, Stephenson, Hamilton, Lorenzen and you have a hell of a good young group coming up starting in 2015.

I think if you do a quick rebuild now, and are smart with the trades, you have a new window starting in 2015 that will go for another 5 years.

This is what I advocated for at the end of the season. Mini-punt on '14 and set yourself up for another 3-5 year run. I don't think it is in Bob C.'s DNA, though.

[757690]

The Reds have a so so chance without making anymore moves. I don't think most people grasp what losing Choo and Arroyo is likely to mean without reliable replacements. This is a wobbly roster right now.

If they replaced Choo with Stubbs they'd have the same lineup they had in 2012 when they won 97 games.

Cingrani should be light years better than Arroyo, though he won't give the Reds the same number of innings.

The real issue is if Ludwick can come back.

[mth123]

Is this MLB2K14?

Why does it have to be? Seems like teams are making deals in conjunction with a plan that comes together all the time. Why not the Reds? Be happy with Skippy and Pena. I'm ready for that run at the series with those two.

I think this team has 2 postion players who are above average. Need to move a pitcher or two to change the mix and how the payroll is allocated.

[HokieRed]

Agree that the Reds have two above average position players and that we, obviously, need more. Problem is the next closest to an above average player is the one on whom most of the trade discussion has focused--Phillips--and it's unlikely that any of the available options to replace him at 2b will be better than he is. So trading him probably weakens one more position.

But we might still do this to get out from under his contract. Except that this year, as every other year, it seems, indicates that the few available everyday regulars on the market are very highly priced--so much so that Phillips' salary starts to look a lot better (it's getting pretty obvious that the money owed him, for instance, doesn't amount to half of what it's going to require to get Choo.)

This is just to say it seems to me incredibly complex for WJ and the team is doing about what I thought they'd be able to do: which is not a whole lot of anything that will impact 2014. Real problem, as I see it, is simply that our most attractive young players have already been dealt--Wood, Alonso, Grandal. And we've already lost 200 innings of starting pitching in Arroyo that makes it a lot harder to pull the trigger on any deal involving Bailey, Leake, or Chapman.

[swaisuc]

The Reds have a so so chance without making anymore moves. I don't think most people grasp what losing Choo and Arroyo is likely to mean without reliable replacements. This is a wobbly roster right now.

Agree that those are bigger losses than people realize, but I don't think you can discount what a healthy Cueto would mean. I honestly believe a healthy Cueto would offsets those losses.

Cueto, Latos, Bailey, Leake, Cingrani is a rotation that gets you to the playoffs. That's not even mentioning Chapman. I think that's the case even if the hitting is pretty awful and there is only so bad you can be with guys like Votto and Bruce holding down the fort.

As we stand today, I think the MOST likely Reds 2014 includes an offense with multiple dead spots and a pitching staff winning anyway. If we're putting our eggs in that basket though, we need those SPs to stay healthy or hope some of these AAA guys are ready.

[RedTeamGo!]

If they replaced Choo with Stubbs they'd have the same lineup they had in 2012 when they won 97 games.

Cingrani should be light years better than Arroyo, though he won't give the Reds the same number of innings.

The real issue is if Ludwick can come back.

You keep ignoring Ryan Hanigan and his .365 obp in 2012

Granted he was not a huge part of the offense, but he was solid in 12. Also, Ludwick had one of his best career seasons and that was before a horrible shoulder injury.

Like I said in the other thread - If winning 97 games was a forgone conclusion with this team why did Walt trade for Choo in the first place?

[NebraskaRed]

Like I said in the other thread - If winning 97 games was a forgone conclusion with this team why did Walt trade for Choo in the first place?

Because a team can always be better?

[RedTeamGo!]

Because a team can always be better?

That is my point I am trying to make. Simply being OK with the current roster because they won 97 games in 2012 is setting yourself up for failure.

The A's, Tigers, and Cardinals all had good records and made the playoffs in 2013 and yet they have all made drastic changes to their teams already. Why would they do that when they won so many games with their 2013 lineups?