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Thread: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

  1. #61
    Member redsfandan's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    I said if you want to talk specifics on Votto's deal that's one thing, but I said you also can't blanket statement things by saying you should never overpay on the back end.

    To which you said you disagreed 1000%.
    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    If you want to argue specifics on this deal, that's fine. But to blanket-statement things with "it shouldn't be ok to overpay a guy on the back end" is missing the big picture.
    You forgot that part. I get why they did it. I just think that probably wasn't the best direction to go.

    As far as generalizations go, it's next to impossible to avoid overpaying on any long term contract. That's a given. But, with this specific situation it's just another reason not to like the contract.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

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  3. #62
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    Sure, but not that much.
    Well at the time Votto and Phillips were resigned, the options were:

    1. Sign them and try to contend
    2. Trade them and rebuild
    3. Trade them and try to find replacements.

    Their contracts haven't hindered the club yet, I'm glad they were extended.
    I'm thrilled the Reds got Choo, but we paid a relatively steep (but fair) price for just one year of Choo.. Trading for upper level talent is a tough way to build a team. It's a lot easier to retain what you have.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  4. #63
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    Well at the time Votto and Phillips were resigned, the options were:

    1. Sign them and try to contend
    2. Trade them and rebuild
    3. Trade them and try to find replacements.

    Their contracts haven't hindered the club yet, I'm glad they were extended.
    I'm thrilled the Reds got Choo, but we paid a relatively steep (but fair) price for just one year of Choo.. Trading for upper level talent is a tough way to build a team. It's a lot easier to retain what you have.
    Option 2 was the best choice.
    I was in the ORG once, best 6 months of my life.

  5. #64
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfanmia View Post
    Option 2 was the best choice.
    I'm glad they extended Votto and Phillips and "went for it"

    They have gotten more attendence and are positioning themselves for a better TV contract. They are thinking big.

    The entire lost decade was about "trade the big contracts to rebuild". It didn't work. Time to try something different.

    I still don't see how Phillips and Votto's contract's have hurt the club yet.

    Maybe Votto's deal hurts the club after 2020, but does that really matter?
    Chances are, the club won't be contending then anyhow.

    It was important not to destroy the offense while we had good starting pitching.
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

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  7. #65
    Ripsnort wheels's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfanmia View Post
    Option 2 was the best choice.
    Rebuild? After the 2011 season?

    Utter lunacy. Sorry, but there is no other way to describe it.
    "We know we're better than this, but we can't prove it." - Tony Gwynn

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  9. #66
    Member redsfandan's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    I'm glad they extended Votto and Phillips and "went for it"

    They have gotten more attendence and are positioning themselves for a better TV contract. They are thinking big.

    The entire lost decade was about "trade the big contracts to rebuild". It didn't work. Time to try something different.

    I still don't see how Phillips and Votto's contract's have hurt the club yet.
    They haven't ... yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    Maybe Votto's deal hurts the club after 2020, but does that really matter?
    Chances are, the club won't be contending then anyhow.


    It was important not to destroy the offense while we had good starting pitching.
    It's ok for the team to possibly not be competitive after 2020? Why?
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

  10. #67
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Reds aren't the A's, they can't tear it down and build it back up over and over.

    They have a regional fan base that shrinks with each losing season.

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  12. #68
    Ripsnort wheels's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Reds aren't the A's, they can't tear it down and build it back up over and over.

    They have a regional fan base that shrinks with each losing season.
    Especially when the club is a year removed from a division title after ten years of abject nothingness.

    You don't trade away the 2010 MVP, you do exactly what they did. Improve the roster, get back to winning.
    "We know we're better than this, but we can't prove it." - Tony Gwynn

  13. #69
    Ripsnort wheels's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    They haven't ... yet.



    It's ok for the team to possibly not be competitive after 2020? Why?
    We have no idea what the team will look like in 2020.

    They could be coming off back to back championships for all we know.
    "We know we're better than this, but we can't prove it." - Tony Gwynn

  14. #70
    Member redsfandan's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by wheels View Post
    We have no idea what the team will look like in 2020.

    They could be coming off back to back championships for all we know.
    Yep, I agree. I just don't agree with the thinking that the Reds have a window to compete.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

  15. #71
    Ripsnort wheels's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    Yep, I agree. I just don't agree with the thinking that the Reds have a window to compete.
    Yeah. I quoted you and added my quip in agreement.
    "We know we're better than this, but we can't prove it." - Tony Gwynn

  16. #72
    Member redsfandan's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by wheels View Post
    Yeah. I quoted you and added my quip in agreement.
    I would really love to see the back to back championships.
    "Now that's a real shame when folks be throwin' away a perfectly good white boy like that."

  17. #73
    Ripsnort wheels's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    It was really cool in the seventies.
    "We know we're better than this, but we can't prove it." - Tony Gwynn

  18. #74
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by wheels View Post
    Rebuild? After the 2011 season?

    Utter lunacy. Sorry, but there is no other way to describe it.
    Not rebuild, reload with younger cheaper talent, I'm now convinced this core will not win a championship.
    Last edited by redsfanmia; 10-16-2013 at 06:07 PM.
    I was in the ORG once, best 6 months of my life.

  19. #75
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Votto's 10yr extension finally starts in 2014

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfanmia View Post
    Not rebuild, reload with younger cheaper talent, I'm now convinced this core will not win a championship.
    Just like Bill DeWitt did!


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