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Thread: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

  1. #151
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    While I don't find the "trade Votto" talk surprising, I find it funny. Votto isn't going anywhere. Bob and Walt inked him to a big contract, a $20M/year contract because they didn't want to lose him. They wanted to keep on of the best hitters in baseball a Red through his prime and through his ladder years. As a fan I am happy Joey Votto is a Red the foreseeable future.

    If I am Walt I am going to ask Votto why his power numbers were down? I am going to ask him why he made more base running and fielding errors this season? That is all. I am not going to tell him he should do X because the Reds are paying him Y. I am not going to say that he needs to drive in more runs. But I am going to remind him that he is the Reds best player. That the Reds need him to step up at times and carry the team. Other than that I am going to let him go about his business the way he normally does.

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  4. #152
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    While I don't find the "trade Votto" talk surprising, I find it funny. Votto isn't going anywhere. Bob and Walt inked him to a big contract, a $20M/year contract because they didn't want to lose him. They wanted to keep on of the best hitters in baseball a Red through his prime and through his ladder years. As a fan I am happy Joey Votto is a Red the foreseeable future.

    If I am Walt I am going to ask Votto why his power numbers were down? I am going to ask him why he made more base running and fielding errors this season? That is all. I am not going to tell him he should do X because the Reds are paying him Y. I am not going to say that he needs to drive in more runs. But I am going to remind him that he is the Reds best player. That the Reds need him to step up at times and carry the team. Other than that I am going to let him go about his business the way he normally does.
    I would also tell him to try to exemplify a leader for this team. Leake's interview with Lance the other day might give us a glimpse into how players view Votto. I know it is not part of his personality, but being the face of a franchise, it is something that just has to be done.

    We know that Votto can get firery and loud. How many f-bombs have we heard when he strikes out or gets a crucial out? Just apply that same fire and attitude towards pumping up the guys.

    If you have every seen the movie '4192' just FF to the Mike Schmidt segments. His thoughts and insights into what Pete did once he got to Philly is pretty telling of what helped the BRM live up to its potential. That is something Votto has to try to emulate with this team. We have the potential, just need the push to achieve it.
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  5. #153
    Titanic Struggles Caveat Emperor's Avatar
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Just on the eyeball test, the problem with Votto (if you can even call it a problem) is that he didn't do enough damage on mistake pitches this year. About the only difference I noticed from 2012 to 2013 is that he was more likely to foul those pitches off this season than he was to drive them. You could see him becoming frustrated with that as the year wore on.

    I suspect it's a one year abberation and that he'll be back to his old self next season. The important thing was that he never let any of this change his approach or impact his pitch selectivity. That's a good thing. Anyone who says otherwise needs to learn more about how runs are scored.
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  7. #154
    malingered here too long malcontent's Avatar
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Quote Originally Posted by Caveat Emperor View Post
    Just on the eyeball test, the problem with Votto (if you can even call it a problem) is that he didn't do enough damage on mistake pitches this year. About the only difference I noticed from 2012 to 2013 is that he was more likely to foul those pitches off this season than he was to drive them.
    That was about all I saw from Votto this year. Fouling relative meatballs off. Always to the left.

    For one thing, I think that "never pulled a ball foul" thing has gone a bit too far.

    The other possibility is that choking up three inches 75% or whatever of the time may not be the greatest idea.
    Last edited by malcontent; 10-24-2013 at 11:56 AM.
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  8. #155
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelSD View Post
    The Reds signed Joey Votto to his new contract after the 2011 season.

    Votto 2011: 155 OPS+, 5.9 oWAR, 127.8 Runs Created

    In 2013...

    Votto 2013: 154 OPS+, 5.8 oWAR, 127.9 Runs Created

    For his career, Votto's at a 155 OPS+. Historically, no Red has topped that. He ranks first in career OBP and second in career SLG among all Reds hitters. Ever.

    If his career ended today, Joey Votto would most productive hitter to ever put on a Reds uniform while playing- over his career- at his 2013 level of performance.

    The 2013 version of Joey Votto IS the 'old' Joey Votto.
    You make a compelling argument. Having said that, you are using a different set of criteria to judge Votto than the Reds management.

    It is pretty black-and-white what Walt said in that interview. He said he and Price have discussed it. He said they would like Votto to modify his approach, or they may move him in the order. He said Price will talk to Votto about it. My take is they want the best player to do as much damage as possible, because he is more capable than his teammates.

    Maybe you are right. Maybe they are right. Maybe Votto is right. One thing is certain, however. The Reds are the ones writing the checks; so unless Votto is willing to make small changes, I think you'll see him in the 2 spot (assuming other personnel make the change possible).

  9. #156
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Quote Originally Posted by edabbs44 View Post
    Maybe the 2013 version "is" the 2011 version, but in no way is he the 2010 version.
    Well, that's the heart of the issue. His 2010 season is the outlier, not the norm. That 2010 season was carried by a 25.0% HR per Fly Ball ratio. For a guy with Votto's game, that's unsustainable. To put it in context, a 25.0% HR/FB ratio has never been achieved by Albert Pujols and only once by Miguel Cabrera (2013). Adam Dunn, who likely had and has more raw power than anyone in the game has done it exactly twice.

    There's nothing about Votto's game that projected or projects that he'll consistently pull the kind of power numbers people are demanding he 'return' to. He's not that guy. Instead, he's a highly-disciplined line drive machine who carries a moderate amount of power. The Reds clearly should have known that before signing him to his LTC as they saw exactly who he was over multiple seasons; including the one (2011) immediately before they offered him his deal.
    "The problem with strikeouts isn't that they hurt your team, it's that they hurt your feelings..." --Rob Neyer

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  11. #157
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelSD View Post
    The Reds signed Joey Votto to his new contract after the 2011 season.

    Votto 2011: 155 OPS+, 5.9 oWAR, 127.8 Runs Created

    In 2013...

    Votto 2013: 154 OPS+, 5.8 oWAR, 127.9 Runs Created

    For his career, Votto's at a 155 OPS+. Historically, no Red has topped that. He ranks first in career OBP and second in career SLG among all Reds hitters. Ever.

    If his career ended today, Joey Votto would most productive hitter to ever put on a Reds uniform while playing- over his career- at his 2013 level of performance.

    The 2013 version of Joey Votto IS the 'old' Joey Votto.
    Votto hit much worse in the clutch in 2013 than in his previous years. That is what Jocketty was referring up to about his role. This is a perfect example of how big overall theoretical numbers fall apart when analyses in more detail.

    The 2013 version of Joey Votto wasn't the same as the old Joey Votto, when it mattered most.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

  12. #158
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Quote Originally Posted by dubc47834 View Post
    If Walt and Bob don't sign that contract you would be the first guy bashing them for being cheap skates. Now you're bashing them because the contract is too long and we are a small market. Boo hoo...the contract is signed, if ya don't like it you can root for a team in a larger market!!!
    Thank you for playing and completely misinterpreting my post. Carry on.

  13. #159
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Votto hit much worse in the clutch in 2013 than in his previous years. That is what Jocketty was referring up to about his role. This is a perfect example of how big overall theoretical numbers fall apart when analyses in more detail.

    The 2013 version of Joey Votto wasn't the same as the old Joey Votto, when it mattered most.
    Ah. "Clutchiness". So your angle is that Votto isn't KRISPY enough?

    Good luck with that.
    "The problem with strikeouts isn't that they hurt your team, it's that they hurt your feelings..." --Rob Neyer

    "The single most important thing for a hitter is to get a good pitch to hit. A good hitter can hit a pitch that’s over the plate three times better than a great hitter with a ball in a tough spot.”
    --Ted Williams

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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Say what you want about Votto's offensive production in 2013. Where he fell on his face was outside the batters box. Defense was bad, baserunning bad, didn't run out ground balls, seemed disinterested, couldn't remember how many outs there are - - - - for $220 million, THESE are the things they should demand he improve on, immediately!
    Huh? Huh-uh. Oh yeah, uh-huh.

  16. #161
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Votto himself said he was disappointed in 2013 and never got it going. A great year for most guys, an average offensive year for a superstar. The defense, mental errors and baserunning were another story. Not sure why this is still a debate. 2013 was an ok year for Votto - nothing special nothing to panic about.

    As many have pointed out the advanced numbers say it was a pretty good year. Probably better than Joey himself realized at the time of his quote.

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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelSD View Post
    Ah. "Clutchiness". So your angle is that Votto isn't KRISPY enough?

    Good luck with that.
    Joey Votto in the Clutch:

    Code:
    Situation	Career	2013
    RISP	        0.341	0.291
    Men On	        0.331   0.287
    2 out RISP	0.286	0.162
    Late & Close	0.305	0.231
    High Leverage	0.346	0.263
    The evidence is overwhelming. IN 2013, he wasn't the Joey Votto he had always been, when hitting in the clutch.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

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  19. #163
    malingered here too long malcontent's Avatar
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    Quote Originally Posted by HUHUH View Post
    Where he fell on his face was outside the batters box. Defense was bad, baserunning bad, didn't run out ground balls, seemed disinterested, couldn't remember how many outs there are - - - - for $220 million, THESE are the things they should demand he improve on, immediately!
    All too true. I'm surprised he didn't take more heat for not running out the occasional grounder.

    Has anyone run the before/after F-bomb ban splits?
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  20. #164
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    I've got no problem putting Joey in the 2 hole if the Reds think that is his proper role. The only issue I might raise is-who do you then put at 3?

    I really don't think anyone else in the lineup would work at 3.

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  22. #165
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    Re: Walt interview (with Cunningham)

    IMO the best thing the Reds can do regarding Votto is to give him more and better support in the lineup.

    The better the overall lineup, the more Votto will get to hit, the less teams can say "I'm not letting Votto beat me." Hitters do better when surrounded by other good hitters.

    Folks want to bunch the good hitters, but when there are only two or three of them you can't bunch them enough. Add bats and watch Votto do better.

    I was disappointed to hear Jocketty's comment. He can discuss this with Joey all he wants, but he'd be better off letting Votto be Votto and focusing on 2B, 3B, SS, LF, CF and C for next year.
    Last edited by Kc61; 10-24-2013 at 01:24 PM.

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