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Thread: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

  1. #46
    Moderator The Operator's Avatar
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by MWM View Post
    Uh oh, reports are now that Dolphins coaches asked Incignito to "toughen up" Martin. Good lord!
    That could also be Incognito's way of shifting blame.

    "Don't blame me, the coaches told me to!!!"
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  3. #47
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    This is interesting. I am starting to think Incognito will be back in the league relatively soon:

    "Well, I've spoken to multiple people today about this and the explanation from all of them is that in the Dolphins locker room, Richie Incognito was considered a black guy. He was accepted by the black players. He was an honorary black man.

    And Jonathan Martin, who is bi-racial, was not. Indeed, Martin was considered less black than Incognito."

    Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolph...#storylink=cpy

  4. #48
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Red View Post
    This is interesting. I am starting to think Incognito will be back in the league relatively soon:

    "Well, I've spoken to multiple people today about this and the explanation from all of them is that in the Dolphins locker room, Richie Incognito was considered a black guy. He was accepted by the black players. He was an honorary black man.

    And Jonathan Martin, who is bi-racial, was not. Indeed, Martin was considered less black than Incognito."

    Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolph...#storylink=cpy
    I don't think that article helps Incognito or the Dolphins.
    Burn down the disco. Hang the blessed DJ. Because the music that he constantly plays, it says nothing to me about my life.

  5. #49
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    I don't think it helps the Dolphins, but I think it helps Incognito from the standpoint of whether another team would ever take him on. It sounds like he'd be welcome in most lockerrooms.

  6. #50
    I hate the Cubs LoganBuck's Avatar
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Red View Post
    This is interesting. I am starting to think Incognito will be back in the league relatively soon:

    "Well, I've spoken to multiple people today about this and the explanation from all of them is that in the Dolphins locker room, Richie Incognito was considered a black guy. He was accepted by the black players. He was an honorary black man.

    And Jonathan Martin, who is bi-racial, was not. Indeed, Martin was considered less black than Incognito."

    Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolph...#storylink=cpy
    Dave Chappelle used to have a bit, if you saw a group of tough looking black guys walking down the street with one tough looking white guy, you were to fear the white guy, because he must have done something crazy to earn respect.
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  7. #51
    On the brink wolfboy's Avatar
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Some may recall all the buzz prior to the season that an active gay player or players might come out during this season. I know it's unrelated, but doesn't this incident give some indication that the time might not be as right as some thought?
    How do we know he's not Mel Torme?

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  9. #52
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Although a racial slur was used in that infamous voicemail, the people reporting the story haven't been framing it as an issue where using the n-word was the sole problem or even the primary problem. So we should be careful about assuming, hey, black players get along with Incognito so it's all cool. If he's back in the league relatively soon, it'll be because the team was found guilty of ordering him to do what he did, so he'll dodge ultimate responsibility. But no one wants a journeyman who'll tear down his teammates on his own initiative.
    Not all who wander are lost

  10. #53
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Totally unscientific observation but it seems that most active players asked about this are more in Incognito's corner than the retired players who are now talking heads.
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  11. #54
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    Totally unscientific observation but it seems that most active players asked about this are more in Incognito's corner than the retired players who are now talking heads.
    It makes me wonder if this kind of behavior is more prevalent in other team locker rooms, and some of these players don't want Incognito to go down because they're guilty of the same kind of behavior. The more these guys talk, the more questions it raises about how prevalent bullying, harassment, and intimidation are in NFL locker rooms. My feeling is that the NFL would be better served to come out with a definitive statement on the issue and let players know this kind of stuff won't be tolerated.
    Burn down the disco. Hang the blessed DJ. Because the music that he constantly plays, it says nothing to me about my life.

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  13. #55
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by Yachtzee View Post
    It makes me wonder if this kind of behavior is more prevalent in other team locker rooms, and some of these players don't want Incognito to go down because they're guilty of the same kind of behavior. The more these guys talk, the more questions it raises about how prevalent bullying, harassment, and intimidation are in NFL locker rooms. My feeling is that the NFL would be better served to come out with a definitive statement on the issue and let players know this kind of stuff won't be tolerated.
    I agree.
    How do we know he's not Mel Torme?

  14. #56
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by Yachtzee View Post
    It makes me wonder if this kind of behavior is more prevalent in other team locker rooms, and some of these players don't want Incognito to go down because they're guilty of the same kind of behavior. The more these guys talk, the more questions it raises about how prevalent bullying, harassment, and intimidation are in NFL locker rooms. My feeling is that the NFL would be better served to come out with a definitive statement on the issue and let players know this kind of stuff won't be tolerated.
    The problem is that it's difficult to define it. Where is the line? Yes, it does appear what Incognito did crossed the line. However, other players disagree. I think they probably believed the voice mails and some of the texts were not good but all the other stuff about what led to Martin walking out was all good, clean fun. They felt Martin should have stood up to Incognito if he felt he was being picked on. They certainly don't think he should have gone outside the team to solve his problem.

    How many players - both current and former - are going to talk to Goodell, et. al. about this on the record? If it ever gets out that they talked to the league office about it there may be reprisals from not only their teammates but coaches and executives. We saw that article where a team executive said Martin was a coward.

    The NFL can't drag their feet on this but they shouldn't be in a hurry to define what is bad behavior and what the punishment will be for offenders.

    One of Incognito's problems is that he seems like a greedy guy. Someone interviewed him when Taneyhill (their QB) was drafted and Incognito remarked about how he expected some jet skis from him as a gift from a QB to the guys who protect him. Of course a QB giving his linemen gifts is nothing new but I'm guessing it's initiated by the QB. Now I don't know about anyone else but I don't ask for gifts unless someone asks me what gifts I want. I certainly don't tell them that I expect them to give me something. So he's hitting up the QB for jet skis and he's hitting up Martin for dinners and trips to Vegas.

    The way I see this eventually playing out for the Dolphins is that Philbin, his coaching staff, the GM and Incognito will all be fired. Martin will be welcomed back with "open arms" but will not come back to MIA. In public they will all say the right things but privately they will decide that there's too much history there with his teammates for him to be accepted.
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  15. #57
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    The problem is that it's difficult to define it. Where is the line? Yes, it does appear what Incognito did crossed the line. However, other players disagree. I think they probably believed the voice mails and some of the texts were not good but all the other stuff about what led to Martin walking out was all good, clean fun. They felt Martin should have stood up to Incognito if he felt he was being picked on. They certainly don't think he should have gone outside the team to solve his problem.

    How many players - both current and former - are going to talk to Goodell, et. al. about this on the record? If it ever gets out that they talked to the league office about it there may be reprisals from not only their teammates but coaches and executives. We saw that article where a team executive said Martin was a coward.

    The NFL can't drag their feet on this but they shouldn't be in a hurry to define what is bad behavior and what the punishment will be for offenders.

    One of Incognito's problems is that he seems like a greedy guy. Someone interviewed him when Taneyhill (their QB) was drafted and Incognito remarked about how he expected some jet skis from him as a gift from a QB to the guys who protect him. Of course a QB giving his linemen gifts is nothing new but I'm guessing it's initiated by the QB. Now I don't know about anyone else but I don't ask for gifts unless someone asks me what gifts I want. I certainly don't tell them that I expect them to give me something. So he's hitting up the QB for jet skis and he's hitting up Martin for dinners and trips to Vegas.

    The way I see this eventually playing out for the Dolphins is that Philbin, his coaching staff, the GM and Incognito will all be fired. Martin will be welcomed back with "open arms" but will not come back to MIA. In public they will all say the right things but privately they will decide that there's too much history there with his teammates for him to be accepted.
    Where's the line? Well unfortunately I think the NFL is going to have to come down on the side of zero tolerance, if only because it's becoming clear that NFL players are on the wrong side of history when it comes to bullying. So even the "good clean fun" stuff is going to come under scrutiny.

    For example, the Dolphins' players are definitely putting out a mixed message here. One article has players saying they didn't know about Martin's problems with Incognito and that Martin should have come to the so-called "leadership council" among the players to handle the issue. Yet in another article they seem pretty clear in saying that they view Incognito as one of their guys and even blacks view him as an honorary black, moreso than Martin who is actually half black. So they're basically saying Martin should have come to them, but they like Incognito better anyway, so the reality is that they would have at best done nothing and at worst joined in with Incognito and piled on Martin. In any case, it's clear Dolphins players are more willing to stick up for their buddy Incognito and throw Martin under the bus.
    Burn down the disco. Hang the blessed DJ. Because the music that he constantly plays, it says nothing to me about my life.

  16. #58
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by The Operator View Post
    That doesn't mean his teammates don't hate him, though.
    His teammates love him. I'm reserving my judgment until everything comes out on this. Initially I was on Martins side, but as more and more comes out on this I just don't see him as totally a victim. Other black players on the Dolphins said they consider Incognito more black than Martin and that he is part of the brotherhood. Now that doesn't give him the right to call Martin what he called him, even if he talks to his other black teammates that way. To me it's a respect thing, respect to all that African Americans have gone thru in the past. My time in the military I have became VERY VERY close friends with black Soldiers and some would say I was their "boy" and that I could call them the N word. I ALWAYS said no, that I respected them more than that and didn't feel comfortable using that word. To me both Incognito and Martin are equally wrong in this and it will be very interesting to see what else comes out in this...this is FAR from over!

  17. #59
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by dubc47834 View Post
    To me both Incognito and Martin are equally wrong in this
    Sorry, incorrect.
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  19. #60
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    Re: Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

    Quote Originally Posted by dubc47834 View Post
    To me both Incognito and Martin are equally wrong in this and it will be very interesting to see what else comes out in this...this is FAR from over!
    In other words, Martin was dressed like he wanted it?
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