Dolphins players accused of bullying teammates

[dubc47834]

I didn't mention race.

Despite Ingonito's slurs, I think a lot of this might be about class and personality. A whole bunch of Martin's kin are Harvard Alum. Is Martin too soft on the playing field? I don't follow football closely enough to know. But the "softness" might be because he was seen reading a book or something. If he can't do his job, cut him. But I don't blame him one bit for not wanting to hang in Vegas with a bunch of meatheads.

I understand the military's a different animal, maybe firefighting and cops too. But have you ever been in a work environment where doing your job well wasn't enough, where you had to become part of a team and were expected to mesh into a social Borg? Where everyone has to be "on the same page"? It's a recipe for mediocrity.

The military is pretty much the only job I have ever had, so I wouldn't know how the rest of the work force generally is. I would hope that in most professions doing your job well would be good enough, but I just don't see that actually being the case as often as it should be.

[Chip R]

Have you ever been to a boot camp? Its not as bad as people make it out to be. If you can stand someone in your face screaming and yelling, what are you going to do when bullets and bombs start flying around you. Has a drill sgt taken things too far, sure, but it is a rarity. They aren't allowed to get in your face and get personal or call you a piece of crap, its not verbal abuse like you state. The military has actually gotten pretty soft over the last few decades.

No judgements here and abuse may be too strong of a word. However I'm talking about how it was decades ago.

Think of when team sports began back in the 19th century. Football basically began in the universities and colleges. There weren't necessarily coaches then but one or two players who were in charge - captains, if you will. When that evolved into where you had coaches running things; they had to figure out a way to get the young men in their charge to be a team. You have to believe that most of these coaches served in the military so they used that example to organize their players. If that involved yelling and screaming, so be it.

[dabvu2498]

http://m.local10.com/sports/aventura...z/-/index.html

This guy is pretty much just not a nice guy.

[dubc47834]

No judgements here and abuse may be too strong of a word. However I'm talking about how it was decades ago.

Think of when team sports began back in the 19th century. Football basically began in the universities and colleges. There weren't necessarily coaches then but one or two players who were in charge - captains, if you will. When that evolved into where you had coaches running things; they had to figure out a way to get the young men in their charge to be a team. You have to believe that most of these coaches served in the military so they used that example to organize their players. If that involved yelling and screaming, so be it.

I see what you are saying and I don't disagree at all. There is a difference between hazing and bullying. I know all the info is not out yet, but the more I hear about this the more Im leaning toward this is hazing.

[Roy Tucker]

The multi-billion dollar NFL ship is springing leaks.

I don't doubt this Dolphin thing is not that far out of the ordinary of other NFL locker rooms. These positions are ultra-competitive, most careers are brutally short, and its an all alpha dog Darwinian world.

Doesn't make it right, but I think that's how it is. I'd think the NFL bigwigs are besides themselves and freaking out over trying to keep that ship from sinking and spin this somehow.

[Joseph]

I did the fraternity thing. I hated the hazing from time to time. I had other guys junk waved in my face once. I had to address every member of the fraternity when I walked into a room loudly and by name and then got yelled at for interrupting a conversation. I was 21 when I pledged so I bought beer. A LOT of beer.

But I CHOSE to do it.

Looking back, I love the guys I joined with. We all went through that stuff together. It DID make us bond. We bonded in stress and dislike of the 'actives'. And when it was all said and done, we were welcomed into the ranks and all had a bond because we'd all been through it.

Yes we'd done it to one another and continued to do it to classes after us, but it was just part of things. All things I will never forget.

Now when one of us have a kid, get married, or have a sorrow, we have a bond.

Not the same as Martin, but there is a difference in hazing and bullying. I don't want there to be confusion between the two.

[Yachtzee]

http://m.local10.com/sports/aventura...z/-/index.html

This guy is pretty much just not a nice guy.

He's lucky he didn't get charged with sexual imposition.

[Wonderful Monds]

The multi-billion dollar NFL ship is springing leaks.

I don't doubt this Dolphin thing is not that far out of the ordinary of other NFL locker rooms. These positions are ultra-competitive, most careers are brutally short, and its an all alpha dog Darwinian world.

Doesn't make it right, but I think that's how it is. I'd think the NFL bigwigs are besides themselves and freaking out over trying to keep that ship from sinking and spin this somehow.

Ha, that's funny. That SHOULD be the case, but half the country agrees that Martin is a wuss that needs to suck it up. The only thing more depressing than this story is the reaction to it.

The NFL is pretty much invincible.

[Yachtzee]

I did the fraternity thing. I hated the hazing from time to time. I had other guys junk waved in my face once. I had to address every member of the fraternity when I walked into a room loudly and by name and then got yelled at for interrupting a conversation. I was 21 when I pledged so I bought beer. A LOT of beer.

But I CHOSE to do it.

Looking back, I love the guys I joined with. We all went through that stuff together. It DID make us bond. We bonded in stress and dislike of the 'actives'. And when it was all said and done, we were welcomed into the ranks and all had a bond because we'd all been through it.

Yes we'd done it to one another and continued to do it to classes after us, but it was just part of things. All things I will never forget.

Now when one of us have a kid, get married, or have a sorrow, we have a bond.

Not the same as Martin, but there is a difference in hazing and bullying. I don't want there to be confusion between the two.

I think the differences here are: 1) a fraternity is a purely voluntary organization, whereas a spot on an NFL team is one of the most difficult jobs to get and your career is typically rather short. So while it may be easy to walk away from a fraternity if you don't like how they treat you, walking away from an NFL career is a much more difficult and financially detrimental choice. 2) The hazing ends once you make it through the pledge period. This is Martin's second season and he's still dealing with this garbage.

[Caveat Emperor]

The league is fighting a war right now for the hearts and minds of parents around the country when it comes to letting their sons play the game. You think they want to deal with yet ANOTHER reason for moms and dads to keep their kids off football teams -- fear of bullying from other kids in locker room environments?

They're going to come down on this like a sack of dynamite and you can bet that the punishments involved will look similar to the Saints bounty situation.

[Redsfaithful]

The military is a different beast, being life and death at times.

I'm not buying that NFL players need military strength bonds to do their jobs. And being inclusive/nice/relaxed seems to me like a better way to inspire success in football, which is a very brutal, nasty career. These guys have to carry huge amounts of stress relating to Sundays and I can't imagine adding stress through the week in prep is helpful.

[Yachtzee]

The military is a different beast, being life and death at times.

I'm not buying that NFL players need military strength bonds to do their jobs. And being inclusive/nice/relaxed seems to me like a better way to inspire success in football, which is a very brutal, nasty career. These guys have to carry huge amounts of stress relating to Sundays and I can't imagine adding stress through the week in prep is helpful.

The Seahawks have a meditation consultant. They seem to be doing okay.

You know, after 9/11 and the death of Pat Tillman, I thought we had gotten beyond this whole notion of equating football players with the military. Anyone remember when Kellen Winslow II was openly mocked for saying he was a soldier? These guys aren't soldiers. They're grown men playing a game for entertainment.

With all the issues the NFL is dealing with concerning concussions and mental health problems facing players, they really need to take a serious look at how teams are running their locker rooms before a tragedy happens. Remember this happened not too long ago and nobody seems to talk about it anymore.

http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?story...60&src=desktop

[dubc47834]

The Seahawks have a meditation consultant. They seem to be doing okay.

You know, after 9/11 and the death of Pat Tillman, I thought we had gotten beyond this whole notion of equating football players with the military. Anyone remember when Kellen Winslow II was openly mocked for saying he was a soldier? These guys aren't soldiers. They're grown men playing a game for entertainment.

With all the issues the NFL is dealing with concerning concussions and mental health problems facing players, they really need to take a serious look at how teams are running their locker rooms before a tragedy happens. Remember this happened not too long ago and nobody seems to talk about it anymore.

http://m.espn.go.com/nfl/story?story...60&src=desktop

This game that you speak of is killing people after they retire.

[RedTeamGo!]

This game that you speak of is killing people after they retire.

What does that have to do with the topic at hand? I am not seeing the correlation between traumatic head injuries and a dbag calling a young player racial slurs and bullying him in to treating him to Vegas and dinner.

[dubc47834]

What does that have to do with the topic at hand? I am not seeing the correlation between traumatic head injuries and a dbag calling a young player racial slurs and bullying him in to treating him to Vegas and dinner.

While these guys aren't Soldiers, they do rely on the man next to them, just like Soldiers. While no one that I can remember has died on the football field, these guys are killing themselves after football due to injuries. Plus there livelyhood isn't that great for many after football. I think you need to read up on this story more before you condem my post. Martin told the other players that he was going to go to Vegas, then at the last minute bailed...so yeah, he shoulda paid that 15 grand, just like everyone who went on the trip. Also, the racial slurs, while it isn't something that should be used, evidently it is something that goes on in many locker rooms. Is Incognito a good guy...NO. Am I saying that Martin shoulda kicked his ass, no, but he shoulda done something before it got this far. He is just as culpable as Incognito in all this.