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Thread: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

  1. #151
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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by mdccclxix View Post
    So Fangraphs is projecting Hanigan for 2+ WAR next year. How often can a team acquire an elite defensive catcher with 2 years of team control left that is only owed 2 million next year? Are we fans unaware of how valuable Hanigan potentially is?

    I don't know what he will bring back in trade, I just know some of the jobs are being taken. Yankees, Rays, wherever Navarro goes.

    I do know that if the Reds are going to trade a catcher, it should be the 34 year old who has just one year of team control, and value is entirely in his glove.

    Mesoraco is nine years younger, was the personal catcher for Latos and Leake(I believe they managed to pitch okay)who also caught games from Arroyo(who didn't really skip a beat with Hani) and Cingrani. Who has upside in his bat.
    Last edited by PepperJack; 11-26-2013 at 05:08 PM.

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  3. #152
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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by mdccclxix View Post
    So Fangraphs is projecting Hanigan for 2+ WAR next year. How often can a team acquire an elite defensive catcher with 2 years of team control left that is only owed 2 million next year? Are we fans unaware of how valuable Hanigan potentially is?
    It will be interesting to see how he shakes out. I assume bidders are waiting to see if the Reds tender him an offer. Once that happens, Walt might find he's a popular man during the winter meetings.
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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    It will be interesting to see how he shakes out. I assume bidders are waiting to see if the Reds tender him an offer. Once that happens, Walt might find he's a popular man during the winter meetings.
    Oops, let me edit, he's only got one year of control, next year. Still, projecting a 2 million dollar catcher for 2 WAR is a ton of value for the right team.

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    PepperJack (11-26-2013)

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by mdccclxix View Post
    Oops, let me edit, he's only got one year of control, next year. Still, projecting a 2 million dollar catcher for 2 WAR is a ton of value for the right team.
    And it's probably easy to buy another two years of that player if you're so inclined.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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    PepperJack (11-26-2013)

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    I'd start off by asking for one of Bradley, Garin Cecchini or Mookie Betts. The Sox probably will insist they don't want to move any of those three, but the Reds probably have a healthy market for Hanigan. For the moment they can demand a high OB, rock solid defensive catcher is worth a hot prospect.
    I'd be shocked -- no, shocked isn't strong enough -- if any of those guys is even in the conversation. Hanigan is a 33-year-old catcher who put up this line in 2013: .198 /.306 /.261 /.567. He has appeared in more than 91 games exactly once in his career. He hit 5 homers and knocked in 40 runs in his career year. He's a good defensive catcher; not great, but good.

    All this talk about statistically-savvy teams liking Hanigan is about one thing: value. They think he's a decent buy-low candidate. You don't give up prospects -- and all three of those guys are top-10 Sox prospects -- for guys like Hanigan. Even if he bounces back to a .700 OPS -- and considering age, his performance trends and everything we know about aging catchers, I think that's REALLY optimistic -- he's not worth one of those guys.

    I think Hanigan either brings back an extraneous bench/bullpen piece or a minor-leaguer we're unlikely to ever see in a Reds uniform.

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by osuceltic View Post
    I'd be shocked -- no, shocked isn't strong enough -- if any of those guys is even in the conversation. Hanigan is a 33-year-old catcher who put up this line in 2013: .198 /.306 /.261 /.567. He has appeared in more than 91 games exactly once in his career. He hit 5 homers and knocked in 40 runs in his career year. He's a good defensive catcher; not great, but good.

    All this talk about statistically-savvy teams liking Hanigan is about one thing: value. They think he's a decent buy-low candidate. You don't give up prospects -- and all three of those guys are top-10 Sox prospects -- for guys like Hanigan. Even if he bounces back to a .700 OPS -- and considering age, his performance trends and everything we know about aging catchers, I think that's REALLY optimistic -- he's not worth one of those guys.

    I think Hanigan either brings back an extraneous bench/bullpen piece or a minor-leaguer we're unlikely to ever see in a Reds uniform.
    I'd gladly "settle" for Bryce Brentz

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    I think Hanigan either brings back an extraneous bench/bullpen piece or a minor-leaguer we're unlikely to ever see in a Reds uniform.
    I'm guessing some team coughs up a top 10 prospect, if Hanigan is dealt alone. He could also be packaged with Phillips. I doubt the Reds put him in a deal for a C return. B or better is my guess.
    "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by osuceltic View Post
    I'd be shocked -- no, shocked isn't strong enough -- if any of those guys is even in the conversation. Hanigan is a 33-year-old catcher who put up this line in 2013: .198 /.306 /.261 /.567. He has appeared in more than 91 games exactly once in his career. He hit 5 homers and knocked in 40 runs in his career year. He's a good defensive catcher; not great, but good.

    All this talk about statistically-savvy teams liking Hanigan is about one thing: value. They think he's a decent buy-low candidate. You don't give up prospects -- and all three of those guys are top-10 Sox prospects -- for guys like Hanigan. Even if he bounces back to a .700 OPS -- and considering age, his performance trends and everything we know about aging catchers, I think that's REALLY optimistic -- he's not worth one of those guys.

    I think Hanigan either brings back an extraneous bench/bullpen piece or a minor-leaguer we're unlikely to ever see in a Reds uniform.
    Also those teams who want a catcher like Hanigan could have landed Jose Molina. He got 2 years 4.5 million. They could have signed Molina and not given up anything else. So instead they are going to ship a top prospect and pay the same as Molina this season? Hard to believe. I have a feeling if Hanigan brings anything back of note it will have to be in a package with Phillips.

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    I see the rumor that Reds have contacted Beltran. Doesn't say much for the Choo possibility.

    I hate when the Reds take the guys the Cards decide not to re-sign.

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    I see the rumor that Reds have contacted Beltran. Doesn't say much for the Choo possibility.

    I hate when the Reds take the guys the Cards decide not to re-sign.
    It hasn't happened, but if it does, it would be a much better and smarter signing than Peralta was with the Cards. The difference between Beltran and the Reds LF last year is greater than the difference between Peralta and Kozma. Plus it likely is a two year deal.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by osuceltic View Post
    I'd be shocked -- no, shocked isn't strong enough -- if any of those guys is even in the conversation.
    If you don't ask, you don't get. Hanigan's name is popping up a lot as a potential catching solution for a lot of teams. He's starting to sound like plan A for the Red Sox.

    There's no doubt the Reds can offload Hanigan. Right now the question is can they do better than that? I'm with lollipop in thinking they can.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by corkedbat View Post
    I'd gladly "settle" for Bryce Brentz
    I actively dislike Brentz's game. He's a Nolan Reimold wannabe. Brandon Workman would be interesting.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    It's reported that Arroyo wants 3 years at $27M. Would it be such a bad thing for the Reds to explore re-signing him to a 2/$20M plus a 3rd year option with a big buyout (like $4M or so) that vests on innings pitched? Having Arroyo back in the fold would definitely add some flexibility to the pitching staff next year for sure.
    Sabermetrics is this: A batter's goal is to extend the inning. Extend enough innings and you're going to score runs. Extend more innings than your opponent and you're going to score more runs than him.

    Forget the rain. It's never an official game until the Reds piss away a run between third base and home plate. - Bluegrass Redleg

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    REDREAD (12-02-2013)

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Keep an eye on Colorado. Wouldn't be shocked to see something built around Chapman for Fowler. Maybe some other names like Rutledge, Hanigan, and some prospects are thrown in.
    Go BLUE!!!

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    Re: Unofficial Hot Stove News and Rumor Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Benihana View Post
    Keep an eye on Colorado. Wouldn't be shocked to see something built around Chapman for Fowler. Maybe some other names like Rutledge, Hanigan, and some prospects are thrown in.
    Pure speculation or are there some rumblings?

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