1. He's one of the few "valuable" trade chips this team has. There are few players on this team that would bring the return that Chapman would.
2. This team has holes to the point that it makes having a dominant closer a luxury. imo
3. Despite what people think as a starter he's an unknown commodity. People can project his stuff all they want, but the fact is no one knows what he would or wouldn't be as a starter.
4. With Votto's contract and age, they have a closing window. They have to make moves to contend for a WS now.
Last edited by SidneySlicker; 11-18-2013 at 10:02 AM.
Not in my opinion.
Last edited by SidneySlicker; 11-18-2013 at 10:15 AM.
The late innings count too.
Nothing demoralizes and destroys a team like continual late inning losses.
There is no dominant reliever in the AAA pen ready to come up.
If fans want to posit Chapman as a starter, fine, but you need to replace him and show how the bullpen will function. Without Chapman, right now, as is, it doesn't function.
Last edited by Kc61; 11-18-2013 at 10:25 AM.
I think having a hot closer is more important. Let us look at the last couple WS teams.
2013 Boston Red Sox: Koji Uehara - He was dominant in 2013 - BUT he was the THIRD option behind Andrew Bailey and Joel Hanhrahan going into the season.
2012 San Francisco Giants: Sergio Romo - He had a fantastic season, but only 14 saves. The reason being that he was the SECOND option behind Brian Wilson who underwent Tommy John earlier in the season. Yet another example of a closer getting hot at the right time.
2011 St Louis Cardinals: Jason Motte - 9 saves in 2011. The St Louis Cardinals won the 2011 World Series without recording a save. Many people consider the Cardinals organization the smartest run organization in all of baseball. They put absolutely no stock in "dominant closers." They ride a pitcher while he is hot until he is not anymore (see: Edward Mujica - 2013)
2010 San Francisco Giants: Brian Wilson - Fantastic season as a closer. In the playoffs he pitched a grand total of 2.2 innings with 1 save. What a gigantic contribution.
Let us now look at the smartest teams in baseball over the past decade and how they value closers:
Oakland A's: Go through a different closer every year or so. As soon as a closer starts to dominate they trade him for whatever they can get.
St Lous Cardinals: Could not possibly care less about having a dominant closer.
Boston Red Sox: Allowed Jonathan Papelbon to walk after he asked for too much money. Won a world series without him while using their third option as closer.
Tampa Bay Rays: Could not possibly care less about having a dominant closer. Got lucky with taking a flier on Fernando Rodney, they will let him walk this year as he is a free agent and they have absolutely no intention of giving a reliever a large contract.
Last edited by RedTeamGo!; 11-18-2013 at 10:47 AM.
Norm Chortleton (11-18-2013)
In 2013 Porcello had a 3.2 WAR with a 55.3 Ground Ball%
Leake: 1.6 WAR with a 48.7 Ground Ball%
Arroyo: 0.8 WAR with a 44.4 Ground Ball%
Homer: 3.7 WAR with a 46.1 Ground Ball%
Latos: 4.4 WAR with a 45.1 Ground Ball%
Not only is Porcello not a downgrade to the rotation he is an upgrade. With that ground ball rate he would be a PERFECT pitcher for the Reds. He would slot in very nicely in 3 spot behind either Cueto and Latos (if Homer is moved) or 4th behind Cueto, Latos, and Bailey. If Porcello were added to this rotation and performed as he did in 2013 it would be the best rotation in the NL hands down.
Austin Jackson is also being undervalued on redszone. He strikes out a lot, but he also gets on base consistently, is fast and solid defensively.
Castellanos would instantly become the #2 prospect in the organization behind Stephenson and would be the power hitting left fielder the Reds need.
These upgrades come while cutting a bad Brandon Phillips contract.
This trade would be an absolute no brainer for Walt, and would never happen because it is one-sided and not in the way the Reds kool-aid drinkers think.
Last edited by SidneySlicker; 11-18-2013 at 11:38 AM.
Closer = most overrated position in sports.
If Aroldis Chapman is never going to be a starter (99.9% never going to happen) the Reds need to trade him sooner rather than later.
Edd Roush (11-18-2013)
If Porcello's so good, then why is Detroit making this trade? Who fills his spot in their rotation? Who's their CF with Jackson gone? Who's their LF with Castellanos gone? Are they going to open up three holes just to fill one they could fill just by re-signing their own guy? And why do they want Chapman again? He blew more saves than their closer last year.