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Thread: Offseason Deals and Rumors

  1. #211
    .377 in 1905 CySeymour's Avatar
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by corkedbat View Post
    * Homer Bailey, Brandon Phillips & Ryan Ludwick to Toronto for Jose Bautista & Colby Rasmus
    What would Toronto want any part of that deal?
    ...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound.

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  4. #212
    One and a half men Patrick Bateman's Avatar
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    12/11 Cincinnati Reds acquired LHP Sean Marshall from the Chicago Cubs for LHP Travis Wood, outfielder Dave Sappelt and nonroster second baseman Ronald Torreyes.
    Sean Marshall... blockbuster? What? Sean Marshall is a quality set-up man. Not exactly a team altering kind of trade.

    12/23/11 Washington Nationals acquired LHP Gio Gonzalez and nonroster RHP Robert Gilliam from the Oakland Athletics for catcher Derek Norris, nonroster RHP A.J. Cole, RHP Brad Peacock and LHP Tom Milone.
    Big trade for sure.

    12/11 Oakland Athletics traded RHP Andrew Bailey and RF Ryan Sweeney to Boston Red Sox for RF Josh Reddick, 1B Miles Head and RHP Raul Alcantara.
    A closer and middling platoon player... hardly a "blockbuster".

    2/31/11 San Diego Padres acquired outfielder Carlos Quentin from the Chicago White Sox for RHP Simon Castro and LHP Pedro Hernandez.
    Quentin's star had long fallen. This was a reclamation project move. Probably no more significance than the "Ludwick blockbuster free agent signing".


    11/07/11 San Francisco Giants acquired outfielder Melky Cabrera from the Kansas City Royals for LHP Jonathan Sanchez and nonroster LHP Ryan Verdugo.
    Melky was a pretty good, not elite starting outfielder for the Royals when traded. If you thought that was a blockbuster you must have been foaming at the mouth when Jocketty announced the Hanigan deal.


    12/11 Arizona Diamondbacks acquired RHP Trevor Cahill, LHP Craig Breslow and cash from the Oakland Athletics for RHP Jarrod Parker, RHP Ryan Cook and outfielder Collin Cowgill.
    Cool.

    12/17/11 San Diego Padres acquired OF Yonder Alonso, nonroster RHP Brad Boxberger, catcher Yasmani Grandal and RHP Edinson Volquez from the Cincinnati Reds for RHP Mat Latos.
    Cool



    I really don't see a huge difference between your's and Beni's list. I think you made up an agenda for some reason about no large trades being possible without really having any evidence and probably assumed nobody would call you on it, and when they did you've tried to cobble together some evidence that isn't really there to fit your preconceived agenda.

    It was a good try, but I don't think anyone's really buying it. A big trade might be in store. It also might not be. I think you are generally right that most of the heavy lifting has been done by GM's at this point, but it certainly doesn't close the door. Braveszone might have thought the same thing when the Upton talks cooled down only to see the trade happen a month after Christmas. I'm not holding my breath, but if a trade doesn't go down I think it has less to do about the date on the calendar as much as it does Jocketty not finding the fit he likes, or the Reds being stuck a bit between "win-now" and still being a pretty budget conscious team.

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    Benihana (12-28-2013)

  6. #213
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by nate1213 View Post
    Anyone see on twitter that Mark Sheldon and Lance McAlister said Jose Bautista and his agent both started following them?
    Joey Bats has been following me since October.

    He's going to be traded to RaisorZone!
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

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  8. #214
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman View Post
    Sean Marshall... blockbuster? What? Sean Marshall is a quality set-up man. Not exactly a team altering kind of trade.



    Big trade for sure.



    A closer and middling platoon player... hardly a "blockbuster".



    Quentin's star had long fallen. This was a reclamation project move. Probably no more significance than the "Ludwick blockbuster free agent signing".




    Melky was a pretty good, not elite starting outfielder for the Royals when traded. If you thought that was a blockbuster you must have been foaming at the mouth when Jocketty announced the Hanigan deal.




    Cool.



    Cool



    I really don't see a huge difference between your's and Beni's list. I think you made up an agenda for some reason about no large trades being possible without really having any evidence and probably assumed nobody would call you on it, and when they did you've tried to cobble together some evidence that isn't really there to fit your preconceived agenda.

    It was a good try, but I don't think anyone's really buying it. A big trade might be in store. It also might not be. I think you are generally right that most of the heavy lifting has been done by GM's at this point, but it certainly doesn't close the door. Braveszone might have thought the same thing when the Upton talks cooled down only to see the trade happen a month after Christmas. I'm not holding my breath, but if a trade doesn't go down I think it has less to do about the date on the calendar as much as it does Jocketty not finding the fit he likes, or the Reds being stuck a bit between "win-now" and still being a pretty budget conscious team.
    Blockbusters involve star principals moving or many players moving all at once or some combo of both. This isn't even a controversial definition. All of the trades I lumped under that definition. The winter meetings occur in December. I made what I considered a pretty innocuous but obvious observation that most all of the major wheeling and dealing occurs prior to Jan 1, slows considerably, then resumes a to a lesser extent in spring training. I didn't really need to look it up, but when I did, it validated what my inclinations were telling me.

    But if you want to hold your breath and hope the Reds are one of the four or so teams on average involved in blockbusters post January 1, have fun. I'm hoping for some spring training injury opening up the door myself.
    Last edited by Falls City Beer; 12-28-2013 at 08:29 AM.

  9. #215
    One and a half men Patrick Bateman's Avatar
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    But if you want to hold your breath and hope the Reds are one of the four or so teams on average involved in blockbusters post January 1, have fun. I'm hoping for some spring training injury opening up the door myself.
    That's just pure garbage. You completely ignored my second paragraph. Sometimes I'm not sure why people bother when you just make things up in the fly.

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    Wonderful Monds (12-28-2013)

  11. #216
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman View Post
    That's just pure garbage. You completely ignored my second paragraph. Sometimes I'm not sure why people bother when you just make things up in the fly.
    Okay, so you don't believe a deal will be made. You're not holding your breath. Good. Got it. (Though I would argue that only reinforces my point).

    What else will put your mind at ease? What else will convince you?

    Block me if my perceived disingenuousness bothers you. I'm not the one here flinging personal attacks or attacks on character.

    I'm not even sure what you're arguing with me for, since, in essence, we seem to agree ("the heavy lifting has been done")
    Last edited by Falls City Beer; 12-28-2013 at 11:10 AM.

  12. #217
    Just A Couple Johnny's OneManBand's Avatar
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    We are bickering over trades? Yikes.. This offseason has turned us against one another! Way to go Bob & Walt..

  13. #218
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Okay, so you don't believe a deal will be made. You're not holding your breath. Good. Got it. (Though I would argue that only reinforces my point).

    What else will put your mind at ease? What else will convince you?

    Block me if my perceived disingenuousness bothers you. I'm not the one here flinging personal attacks or attacks on character.

    I'm not even sure what you're arguing with me for, since, in essence, we seem to agree ("the heavy lifting has been done")
    I think what PB is pointing out, again, is that it is OK to admit when you're wrong, when you made a sweeping generalization that wasn't supported by factual evidence. It actually makes your factually correct arguments stronger and makes people (or the board collectively) less prone to rolling their eyes when you make your next sweepingly pessimistic statement.

    While hyperbole can sometimes be effective to illustrate an argument, it can also dilute and sometimes jeopardize the credibility of what could otherwise be a good point. Like many longtime posters on this board, you do frequently make good points. This was not an example of one that held up in reality. Probably best to admit it and move on.
    Last edited by Benihana; 12-28-2013 at 12:40 PM.
    Go BLUE!!!

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  15. #219
    malingered here too long malcontent's Avatar
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by OneManBand View Post
    We are bickering over trades? Yikes.. This offseason has turned us against one another! Way to go Bob & Walt..
    I think you just solved the riddle of what Jocketty has been spending his off-season time doing.

    He's probably been sitting in his plush office, maliciously watching RZ disintegrate waiting for him to do anything.
    Everything is perfect, but there is a lot of room for improvement. --- Shunryu Suzuki-roshi

  16. #220
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by CySeymour View Post
    What would Toronto want any part of that deal?
    I can kind of see it depending how much they value Phillips. Homer and Rasmus are both expiring contracts, so they kind of even out.

    I would not want the Reds to do it actually.
    They don't think it be like it is, but it do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    He has also taught me that even when the Reds win it is important to focus on the fact that they could have lost.

  17. #221
    Just A Couple Johnny's OneManBand's Avatar
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    I'd like to see something involving Phillips to the Yankees for Gardner and Homer to the Angels for Kendrick. We then address our top of the batting order. We'd have a hole in the rotation that we'd need to address w/ maybe a FA signing.. but the offense would seem to be solved.

    Gardner - CF
    Kendrick - 2B
    Votto - 1B
    Bruce - RF
    Ludwick - LF
    Frazier - 3B
    Cozart - SS

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  19. #222
    .377 in 1905 CySeymour's Avatar
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Wonderful Monds View Post
    I can kind of see it depending how much they value Phillips. Homer and Rasmus are both expiring contracts, so they kind of even out.

    I would not want the Reds to do it actually.

    So it would be Ludwick for Bautista, essentially. No way Toronto would do that.
    ...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound.

  20. #223
    Member Old school 1983's Avatar
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Best way for the Reds to make a significant trade unless Walt really rips a team a new one.
    1. Sign Arroyo or another solid starting option. It'll give you the same starters as last year.
    2. Trade Cueto or Bailey for the best possible return.
    3. Depending on who is acquired, move other pieces accordingly.

    Unless Walt can find a good three way deal or a GM that really finds value in a player that we don't, I believe this would be the most realistic course of action to acquire more offense.

  21. #224
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Been thinking about it. I'm calling Phillips to be traded in January.

    Blue Jays probably. Braves possibly.

    Reds won't allow BP to become a five and ten year player. Then they won't be able to move him.

    Jays have always been most logical. They haven't solved their second base issue.

    Reds get either Bautista or Rasmus. Maybe Reds add Ludwick and/or a prospect. Conceivably a bigger trade involving a Reds pitcher. Jays include maybe Izturis their current second baseman. Reds probably would also like Brett Lawrie to add some big time scrapiness.

    Braves, harder to find a trade mix. Uggla might come over but that's just for money purposes. Reds would need a major additional sweetener.

    The details are probably wrong, but I'm calling BP to be traded in the next few weeks.

  22. #225
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    Re: Offseason Deals and Rumors

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Been thinking about it. I'm calling Phillips to be traded in January.

    Blue Jays probably. Braves possibly.

    Reds won't allow BP to become a five and ten year player. Then they won't be able to move him.

    Jays have always been most logical. They haven't solved their second base issue.

    Reds get either Bautista or Rasmus. Maybe Reds add Ludwick and/or a prospect. Conceivably a bigger trade involving a Reds pitcher. Jays include maybe Izturis their current second baseman. Reds probably would also like Brett Lawrie to add some big time scrapiness.

    Braves, harder to find a trade mix. Uggla might come over but that's just for money purposes. Reds would need a major additional sweetener.

    The details are probably wrong, but I'm calling BP to be traded in the next few weeks.
    Sending Phillips to baseball Siberia (TOR) seems cruel. If the return is just Rasmus, count me largely uninspired.


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