2014 Bengals Discussion

[bucksfan2]

I thought Schlichter was a gambler?

I believe he had a drinking problem as well.

[Kingspoint]

I believe he had a drinking problem as well.

Bad combination, but they often go hand-in-hand.

[Kingspoint]

Though it's been pretty quiet the last few years, especially under the no-nonsense guidance of Mike Zimmer (I expect the lackadaisical Marvin Lewis' ways to come back and players to begin getting in trouble again), what's a Bengals' off-season without some off-the-field issues?

From Rotoworld w/ Rotoworld comments:

Updating a previous item, Bengals FB Orson Charles allegedly brandished a firearm while driving down the highway in Kentucky on Monday night.

Charles was arrested on first-degree wanton endangerment charges and is currently awaiting arraignment. A complaint was called in by another driver after Charles had a fit of road rage that saw the Bengals' H-back brandish a firearm several times and cut the aforementioned driver off on the interstate. Charles was booked for DUI prior to the 2012 draft.

Source: ESPN.com

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10...ngals-arrested

[Yachtzee]

Though it's been pretty quiet the last few years, especially under the no-nonsense guidance of Mike Zimmer (I expect the lackadaisical Marvin Lewis' ways to come back and players to begin getting in trouble again), what's a Bengals' off-season without some off-the-field issues?

From Rotoworld w/ Rotoworld comments:

Updating a previous item, Bengals FB Orson Charles allegedly brandished a firearm while driving down the highway in Kentucky on Monday night.

Charles was arrested on first-degree wanton endangerment charges and is currently awaiting arraignment. A complaint was called in by another driver after Charles had a fit of road rage that saw the Bengals' H-back brandish a firearm several times and cut the aforementioned driver off on the interstate. Charles was booked for DUI prior to the 2012 draft.

Source: ESPN.com

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10...ngals-arrested

So Zimmer was GM/director of player personnel in addition to being defensive coordinator? Who knew? Zimmer may be a no-nonsense guy, but I don't think he was ever the one who decided who to bring in and who to release. He may have had input, but only on defense. But I think the primary decision maker, at least since singing his last contract, has been Lewis. And I don't think Zimmer had much control in keeping the offense in line either.

[Hoosier Red]

So Zimmer was GM/director of player personnel in addition to being defensive coordinator? Who knew? Zimmer may be a no-nonsense guy, but I don't think he was ever the one who decided who to bring in and who to release. He may have had input, but only on defense. But I think the primary decision maker, at least since singing his last contract, has been Lewis. And I don't think Zimmer had much control in keeping the offense in line either.

Agreed. While I definitely respect the job Zimmer did as defensive coordinator, the glorification of all things Zimmer amuses me quite a bit.

THe last two head coaches the Bengals hired had a pretty good track record as Defensive Coordinator as well. I could see the argument that Zimmer's been even more impressive than LeBeau or Lewis. But the difference doesn't explain the belief that he'll be an all powerful head coach on par with Lombardi, Landry, and Halas.

[Kingspoint]

Agreed. While I definitely respect the job Zimmer did as defensive coordinator, the glorification of all things Zimmer amuses me quite a bit.

THe last two head coaches the Bengals hired had a pretty good track record as Defensive Coordinator as well. I could see the argument that Zimmer's been even more impressive than LeBeau or Lewis. But the difference doesn't explain the belief that he'll be an all powerful head coach on par with Lombardi, Landry, and Halas.

Everybody has a ceiling in the respective professions in life. Some don't succeed because of circumstances beyond their control, specifically because of decision-makers higher up the chain-of-command, or industry-wide and economic-wide failures.

One will never know if LeBeau's ceiling was that of Defensive Coordinator because he worked for the most inept General Manager, the most inept owner, and the most dsyfunctional organization in all of sports at the same time in Mike Brown and the Bengals. Bill Belichick would have failed miserably under the same conditions.

When LeBeau left, it marked the beginning of a change of attitude for Mike Brown. The day he signed Lorenzo Neal was the first day ever that he attempted to fix a problem on the team in a decisive manner. Baby steps, and very small baby steps, over the next 12 years by Mike Brown has put the organization into a "window of opportunity" to win it all, along with a plethora of talent throughout the organization in the players, the Coaches, the Scouting staff, and the facilities themselves. Any Coach has the ability to succeed under Mike Brown over the last five seasons, when the most major change occurred...the doubling-plus of the Scouting Staff (two to five) with Dick Tobin able to act as it's Chief of Scouts. That moved propelled the organization into an even playing field for the first time since Mike Brown took over as owner/General Manager.

I don't think Marvin Lewis was anything more than average when it came to being a Defensive Coordinator. He's proven time and time again to be inept at constructing a Defensive Team as Head Coach of the Bengals before Mike Zimmer got there. Any DC would have won a Super Bowl with the talent the Ravens had on Defense.

Year after year of Top Draft picks, along with the addition of Carson Palmer (thanks to the complete ineptness of Mike Brown which garnered the #1 overall pick in the draft) allowed the Bengals to succeed (for Bengals' standards, which have been pretty low for a long, long time, or else there still wouldn't be anybody left who thinks that Marvin Lewis was a good Head Coach, or even mediocre as a Head Coach) immediately under Marvin Lewis. That feeling quickly disappeared as the team is still waiting for Marvin Lewis to get his first playoff win. Give Marvin Lewis time to prepare and he's surely going to have the team unprepared. It took him almost ten years before he got a win after a bye, and he is 0-5 in the playoffs, despite having weeks off to heal and prepare and playing at home in some of them. After twelve years at the helm, one has to learn something simply from being around so long, unless you're a total idiot. So now, Marvin Lewis is at least, tolerable as a Head Coach. He delegates great, which is something that Zimmer should struggle with as a Head Coach. It would not be easy at this point to replace Marvin Lewis, but it could and should be done. Hello, Hue Jackson.

The Viking organization is inept in it's own ways, but not the way that Mike Brown was when LeBeau took over as HC for the Bengals. Zimmer has a chance to succeed based upon what he does. The Vikings have a scouting department. The Vikings have a General Manager. What is similar to the Vikings of today and the Bengals of 2000-2002 (LeBeau's tenure as HC) is the scouting departments' abilities to draft well. The Bengals couldn't back then, and the Vikings haven't been able up to now. Another thing that is similar is ownership's inability to get out of the way. The moronic move of trading for Josh Freeman is as bone-headed of a move as any owner can make. One could think that it was the G.M., but ownership also hired Mike Tice. No owner of any worth would ever hire Mike Tice to make decisions for the franchise. But, in defense of the Vikings' brass, they did hire Mike Zimmer. I think this shows them to be moving in the right direction when it comes to upper management making good decisions. I thought the hiring of Leslie Frazier was also a decision that moved the franchise in the right direction.

The Vikings also have a history of having had trouble-makers (boat/lake scandal) in the past. They added Jerome Simpson, and he's still on the team. There's no focus in Minnesota. Everything still seems like they are trying to put a picture together using pieces from several different puzzles. Zimmer definitely has a large task ahead of him. I'm looking forward to seeing if he can give the team an identity. Mike Zimmer put his stamp on the Cowboys (they haven't been the same without him). Mike Zimmer placed his stamp on the Bengals (this will still be Zimmer's team for the next two seasons his stamp was so firmly placed on this team, but I firmly believe in the abilities of Mike Brown to lead this team as it's General Manager...I think he's consistently trying to improve the team each year since 2002). Mike Zimmer will place his stamp on the Vikings, who had a horrendous Defense last season. Quarterback is just one of many problems that they have. They need a complete talent infusion.

[Hoosier Red]

I don't think Marvin Lewis was anything more than average when it came to being a Defensive Coordinator. He's proven time and time again to be inept at constructing a Defensive Team as Head Coach of the Bengals before Mike Zimmer got there. Any DC would have won a Super Bowl with the talent the Ravens had on Defense.

Year after year of Top Draft picks, along with the addition of Carson Palmer (thanks to the complete ineptness of Mike Brown which garnered the #1 overall pick in the draft) allowed the Bengals to succeed (for Bengals' standards, which have been pretty low for a long, long time, or else there still wouldn't be anybody left who thinks that Marvin Lewis was a good Head Coach, or even mediocre as a Head Coach) immediately under Marvin Lewis. That feeling quickly disappeared as the team is still waiting for Marvin Lewis to get his first playoff win. Give Marvin Lewis time to prepare and he's surely going to have the team unprepared. It took him almost ten years before he got a win after a bye, and he is 0-5 in the playoffs, despite having weeks off to heal and prepare and playing at home in some of them. After twelve years at the helm, one has to learn something simply from being around so long, unless you're a total idiot. So now, Marvin Lewis is at least, tolerable as a Head Coach. He delegates great, which is something that Zimmer should struggle with as a Head Coach. It would not be easy at this point to replace Marvin Lewis, but it could and should be done. Hello, Hue Jackson.

I think you make my point. While you may not believe Marvin was much of a Defensive Coordinator, his reputation was that of a very good one. Lebeau's a defensive savant but was unsuccessful as a head coach for a number of reasons. Regardless of Zimmer's success at Minnesota, to ascribe the success in the Bengals getting the arrest numbers down solely to his arrival is simply foolish.

I think it's more likely that Marvin's a pretty average coach, but has learned a few things about who is likely and not likely to burn him if he offers a second chance.

[Kingspoint]

I think it's more likely that Marvin's a pretty average coach, but has learned a few things about who is likely and not likely to burn him if he offers a second chance.

The Defense is a pretty tight unit right now.

From Twitter today...

DomataPeko RT @EmanLamur: Great workout today with @LukeKuechly @BrandonT_98 @DomataPeko @lbj97whatsgood at @lgnition
About 35 minutes ago by Domata Peko



terencenewman RT @Schaff37: Nice little golf trip to Virginia with @terencenewman and @REALPACMAN24 #Kinloch
About 8 hours ago by Terence Newman



....I have no idea what this means...

BOOMHERRON1 Have a great day every one remember to be #coltstrong
About 7 hours ago by Dan Herron

[WrongVerb]

I think you make my point. While you may not believe Marvin was much of a Defensive Coordinator, his reputation was that of a very good one. Lebeau's a defensive savant but was unsuccessful as a head coach for a number of reasons. Regardless of Zimmer's success at Minnesota, to ascribe the success in the Bengals getting the arrest numbers down solely to his arrival is simply foolish.

I think it's more likely that Marvin's a pretty average coach, but has learned a few things about who is likely and not likely to burn him if he offers a second chance.

The adopted son of a friend of my mom's is a top football coaching prospect. I've had the pleasure of talking to him a couple times, and one interesting point I remember him making was that the successful head coaches were the ones that kept order on the team, and was generally the "bad cop." The coordinators were the ones who were pals of their respective players. They were the ones who played the good cop. The point was that a personality that fits one doesn't necessarily fit the other. So a great coordinator who gets his players to do well by being the good guy doesn't necessarily transition to the bad cop (not bad guy) needed to keep the order necessary to win as a team.

[Kingspoint]

The adopted son of a friend of my mom's is a top football coaching prospect. I've had the pleasure of talking to him a couple times, and one interesting point I remember him making was that the successful head coaches were the ones that kept order on the team, and was generally the "bad cop." The coordinators were the ones who were pals of their respective players. They were the ones who played the good cop. The point was that a personality that fits one doesn't necessarily fit the other. So a great coordinator who gets his players to do well by being the good guy doesn't necessarily transition to the bad cop (not bad guy) needed to keep the order necessary to win as a team.

Except we know in the case of Zimmer and Lewis, that Zimmer is the bad cop and Lewis is the good cop. Lewis couldn't be a bad cop if his life depended on it.

[Mario-Rijo]

Draft Simulator here, pretty fun. Just an FYI I think the Walter Football rankings were the best for giving me a fairly realistic mock, Optimum Scouting was the worst (and by quite a bit I think), but I just killed it on the default rankings.

http://fanspeak.com/ontheclock/

Here was my recent mock under the default rankings. I consider that to be a nearly perfect scenario, not my dream scenario but damn near it.


24
CB DARQUEZE DENNARD
MICHIGAN STATE
55
OT CYRUS KOUANDJIO
ALABAMA
88
C MARCUS MARTIN
USC
123
DE KAREEM MARTIN
NORTH CAROLINA
164
RB STORM JOHNSON
UCF
199
QB TOM SAVAGE
PITTSBURGH
212
S JONATHAN DOWLING
WESTERN KENTUCKY
239
FB JAY PROSCH
AUBURN
252
OLB KEVIN PIERRE-LOUIS
BOSTON COLLEGE

[Danny Serafini]

....I have no idea what this means...

BOOMHERRON1 Have a great day every one remember to be #coltstrong
About 7 hours ago by Dan Herron

Herron is a Colt, they plucked him off the Bengals practice squad last year.

[Kingspoint]

Herron is a Colt, they plucked him off the Bengals practice squad last year.

Thanks, totally missed that. I know we lost another off of our practice squad, an OL that I thought the team felt pretty highly about. We've really amassed some quality talent on the team over the last several years.

[Hoosier Red]

Draft Simulator here, pretty fun. Just an FYI I think the Walter Football rankings were the best for giving me a fairly realistic mock, Optimum Scouting was the worst (and by quite a bit I think), but I just killed it on the default rankings.

http://fanspeak.com/ontheclock/

Cool link Mario. Here's the draft I did.
I really like the results. The only thing I missed out on was a good QB in the middle rounds. The options in Round 3 were Tajh Boyd and AJ McCarron. I was hoping to get Murray in round 5 but he got snagged at pick 163 by the Chiefs. Bad intelligence on my end.
And if Cody Lattimer actually is available where I drafted him, I'd be ecstatic.

24
CB DARQUEZE DENNARD
MICHIGAN STATE
55
RB CARLOS HYDE
OHIO STATE
88
S DEONE BUCANNON
WASHINGTON STATE
123
CB E.J. GAINES
MISSOURI
164
OT MICHAEL SCHOFIELD
MICHIGAN
199
WR CODY LATIMER
INDIANA
212
LB KEVIN PIERRE-LOUIS
BOSTON COLLEGE
239
ILB MAX BULLOUGH
MICHIGAN STATE
252
C COREY LINSLEY
OHIO STATE

[Mario-Rijo]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10...innati-bengals

Danieal Manning signs with the Bengals for 1 yr.