Turn Off Ads?
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 30

Thread: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

  1. #1
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    14,872

    Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    As best as I can tell, the Reds have 16 guys for 10 rotation spots in AA and AAA. Looking at the guys, I'm guessing Schmidt and Dennhardt will be in a bullpen somewhere. Holmberg, Corcino and Rogers would seem to be locks at AAA and Stephenson and Moscot locks at AA. I'm not sure whether Francis and Wang will stick around if they don't make the big league team and I'm unsure whether Contreras will continue starting. Tim Crabbe looks like a guy who may step forward in the bullpen, but I'm not sure if that's the plan. Mikey O'Brien is interesting. He had decent numbers at AA and he was only 23 last year, but the Yankees let him go. I think he could be a find. Josh Smith and Daniel Renken have been solid starters, but the Reds leaving them off the 40 man (and no team taking a rule 5 shot) speaks volumes. Shane Dyer and Ryan Dennick would seem to be decent choices to get another look. Not sure how it sorts out really. Anybody with any knowledge want to weigh in? (These are minor league numbers only, BTW).

    Code:
    Name	         Age	ERA	G	GS	IP	TBF	H	R	ER	HR	BB	IBB	HBP	WP	SO	K/9	BB/9	K/BB	HR/9	K%	BB%	BABIP
    R. Stephenson	20	2.99	22	22	114.1	465	92	49	38	10	35	0	3	12	136	10.71	2.76	3.89	0.79	29.30%	7.50%	0.292
    Jon Moscot	21	4.3	28	28	146.2	629	143	78	70	20	48	3	9	11	140	8.59	2.95	2.92	1.23	22.30%	7.60%	0.299
    David Holmberg	21	2.75	26	26	157.1	651	138	59	48	12	50	2	7	3	116	6.64	2.86	2.32	0.69	17.80%	7.70%	0.27
    C. Contreras	22	3.47	26	26	132.1	560	106	56	51	11	62	3	8	9	122	8.3	4.22	1.97	0.75	21.80%	11.10%	0.266
    Daniel Corcino	22	5.86	28	23	129	594	141	95	84	17	73	0	11	7	90	6.28	5.09	1.23	1.19	15.20%	12.30%	0.308
    Chad Rogers	23	2.99	34	25	153.2	623	123	60	51	15	49	2	5	4	115	6.74	2.87	2.35	0.88	18.50%	7.90%	0.246
    Michael O'Brien	23	4.17	27	25	133.2	589	140	71	62	10	52	1	10	8	124	8.35	3.5	2.38	0.67	21.10%	8.80%	0.331
    M. Dennhardt	23	4.92	27	13	82.1	368	99	54	45	9	24	1	4	5	70	7.65	2.62	2.92	0.98	19.00%	6.50%	0.345
    Daniel Renken	23	3.99	27	24	142	605	129	70	63	13	60	0	5	3	117	7.42	3.8	1.95	0.82	19.30%	9.90%	0.283
    Tim Crabbe	25	3.06	27	26	153	634	151	63	52	12	43	1	4	6	109	6.41	2.53	2.53	0.71	17.20%	6.80%	0.298
    Josh Smith	25	3.26	28	28	160	674	148	65	58	16	50	2	7	5	139	7.82	2.81	2.78	0.9	20.60%	7.40%	0.286
    Shane Dyer	25	3.45	18	18	107	456	108	55	41	10	20	0	16	5	84	7.07	1.68	4.2	0.84	18.40%	4.40%	0.301
    Ryan Dennick	26	3.82	27	21	122.2	514	122	57	52	10	35	0	1	3	78	5.72	2.57	2.23	0.73	15.20%	6.80%	0.287
    Nick Schmidt	27	4.71	37	8	91.2	410	107	52	48	10	38	0	1	9	72	7.07	3.73	1.89	0.98	17.60%	9.30%	0.336
    Jeff Francis	32	4.34	11	6	37.1	167	42	24	18	1	9	0	2	1	33	7.96	2.17	3.67	0.24	19.80%	5.40%	0.336
    Chien-Ming Wang	33	2.87	18	17	109.2	448	103	39	35	5	22	0	2	5	55	4.51	1.81	2.5	0.41	12.30%	4.90%	0.269
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #2
    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    11,450

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Did you forget about Trevor Reckling and Chad Reineke?

  4. #3
    Vampire Weekend @Bernie's camisadelgolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    11,450

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Here's my stab at it:
    AAA
    Francis
    Wang
    Holmberg
    Rogers
    Corcino

    And that would make Reineke the swingman.

    AA
    Stephenson
    Moscot
    Contreras
    Renken
    O'Brien

    Dyer would step in if the Reds start grooming Contreras for the closer role. Everyone else goes to the bullpen or gets released.

  5. #4
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    28,271

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Doesn't O'Brien have to stay in AAA or higher because of Rule 5?
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  6. #5
    Moderator Gallen5862's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Wilmington,NC
    Posts
    6,534

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    Doesn't O'Brien have to stay in AAA or higher because of Rule 5?
    Minor league Rule V players can be assigned to any level in the minors. The only restriction was that there had to be a AAA spot open when he was selected.

  7. Likes:

    M2 (01-19-2014), REDREAD (01-19-2014)

  8. #6
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    14,872

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Quote Originally Posted by camisadelgolf View Post
    Did you forget about Trevor Reckling and Chad Reineke?
    I didn't forget them, just ruled them out. Probably should have included them.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS

  9. #7
    Moderator Gallen5862's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Wilmington,NC
    Posts
    6,534

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    http://www.baseballamerica.com/minors/ask-ba-2/

    Ask BA: How Do The Minor League Phases Of The Rule 5 Draft Work?

    In the Triple-A phase of the Rule 5 draft, teams may select any eligible player left off the major league 40-man roster or the Triple-A reserve roster of 38 players. In the Double-A phase of the draft, teams may select any eligible player left off the major league roster, the Triple-A reserve roster or the Double-A reserve roster of 37 players. In other words, a player selected in the Triple-A phase does not rank among his organization’s top 78 talents, and a Double-A selection does not rank among its top 115. In these cases, players are not required to remain on a particular roster. The player’s contract is irrevocably assigned to the drafting team and the drafting fee ($12,000 for Triple-A, $4,000 for Double-A) is paid.

  10. #8
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    28,271

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Quote Originally Posted by Gallen5862 View Post
    Minor league Rule V players can be assigned to any level in the minors. The only restriction was that there had to be a AAA spot open when he was selected.
    Thanks for the clarification.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  11. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    6,226

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Just my WAG

    Louisville River Bats (AAA)

    Chien-Mein Wang - guaranteed the spot unless they say no thanks we like the kids better and release him near the end of the Spring
    Jeff Francis - guaranteed spot if he's a starter. Hasn't had much luck as a starter in the majors - always a need for bullpen lefties - wouldn't shock me to see them groom him a little for the pen in case of a big club injury
    Daniel Corcino - may end up in the Reds pen at some point. Unless he's dealt though, I expect him in the Bats rotation
    David Holmberg strong spring shows Reds knew what they were getting
    Sharky Rogers - bottom of L'Ville rotation
    Nick Schmidt & Chris Reineke - duel for the Bats swing spot
    Trevor Reckling - lefty in Bats pen unless he's cut
    Carlos Contreras - Bats Closer

    Pensacola Blue Wahoos

    Robert Stephenson - Top of the Wahoos rotation until June 1 when Wang opts out of Bats contract (if not sooner
    Jon Moscot - Ditto for Francis
    Ryan Dennick - lefty for the Pepsi rotation
    Tim Crabbe - may be a surprise who moves up by draft day
    Shane Dyer - solid guy for the bottom of a AA rotation
    Mikey O'Brien & Mike Dennhart - vie for swing spot

    Bakersfield Blaze (A+)

    Josh Smith - unless there's an injury or call-up, here until the Memorial day move-up
    Daniel Renken - Ditto
    Ishmael Guillon - might beat the previous two to up the ladder if he can show decent control, if he can't he might end up in the pen
    Drew Cisco - advanced control advances him
    Ben Lively - they challenge him after last season's stellar season
    James Allen & Jake Johnson - fight for 6th spot

    Dayton Dragons

    Nick Travieso
    Sal Ramano
    Wandy Peralta
    Rhadames Quezada
    Amir Garrett
    Jackson Stephens
    Last edited by corkedbat; 01-19-2014 at 09:24 PM.

  12. Likes:

    RedlegJake (01-19-2014)

  13. #10
    Moderator RedlegJake's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    North Kansas City, Mo
    Posts
    5,913

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Billings -

    Ty Boyles
    Jeremy Kivel
    Ty Mahle
    Mark Armstrong
    Jacob Constante

    Armstrong and Weiss may vie for a spot in Dayton too, otherwise I like corked bat's thinking
    No - I am not from State Farm!

  14. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    1,200

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Quote Originally Posted by corkedbat View Post
    Just my WAG

    Louisville River Bats (AAA)

    Chien-Mein Wang - guaranteed the spot unless they say no thanks we like the kids better and release him near the end of the Spring
    Jeff Francis - guaranteed spot if he's a starter. Hasn't had much luck as a starter in the majors - always a need for bullpen lefties - wouldn't shock me to see them groom him a little for the pen in case of a big club injury
    Daniel Corcino - may end up in the Reds pen at some point. Unless he's dealt though, I expect him in the Bats rotation
    David Holmberg strong spring shows Reds knew what they were getting
    Sharky Rogers - bottom of L'Ville rotation
    Nick Schmidt & Chris Reineke - duel for the Bats swing spot
    Trevor Reckling - lefty in Bats pen unless he's cut
    Carlos Contreras - Bats Closer

    Pensacola Blue Wahoos

    Robert Stephenson - Top of the Wahoos rotation until June 1 when Wang opts out of Bats contract (if not sooner
    Jon Moscot - Ditto for Francis
    Ryan Dennick - lefty for the Pepsi rotation
    Tim Crabbe - may be a surprise who moves up by draft day
    Shane Dyer - solid guy for the bottom of a AA rotation
    Mikey O'Brien & Mike Dennhart - vie for swing spot

    Bakersfield Blaze (A+)

    Josh Smith - unless there's an injury or call-up, here until the Memorial day move-up
    Daniel Renken - Ditto
    Ishmael Guillon - might beat the previous two to up the ladder if he can show decent control, if he can't he might end up in the pen
    Drew Cisco - advanced control advances him
    Ben Lively - they challenge him after last season's stellar season
    James Allen & Jake Johnson - fight for 6th spot

    Dayton Dragons

    Nick Travieso
    Sal Ramano
    Wandy Peralta
    Rhadames Quezada
    Amir Garrett
    Jackson Stephens
    Looks pretty good, but a couple of comments.

    Francis made 11 relief appearances for Rockies last year with roughly the same results as starting. It is possible that he might be persuaded that the best way to prolong his career is in that role.

    Crabbe was promoted to AAA at the end of the year and pitched well. I can't see him going back to AA. He seems like a candidate for the AAA pen which is also getting crowded.

    Josh Smith is 26 and has pitched well at every level, including AA. I can't see him going back to A+ after a full, successful season at AA. Reds need to make up their mind what to do with him.

    Daniel Renken pitched poorly at A+, but has done fairly well everywhere else, including a full season at AA. I see no point in sending him down.

    I have heard that many successful relief pitchers are starters up to a point in the minors. I think several pitchers have reached that fork in the road.

  15. Likes:

    HokieRed (01-20-2014), mth123 (01-20-2014), OGB (01-28-2014)

  16. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    6,226

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Quote Originally Posted by RED VAN HOT View Post
    Looks pretty good, but a couple of comments.

    Francis made 11 relief appearances for Rockies last year with roughly the same results as starting. It is possible that he might be persuaded that the best way to prolong his career is in that role.

    Crabbe was promoted to AAA at the end of the year and pitched well. I can't see him going back to AA. He seems like a candidate for the AAA pen which is also getting crowded.

    Josh Smith is 26 and has pitched well at every level, including AA. I can't see him going back to A+ after a full, successful season at AA. Reds need to make up their mind what to do with him.

    Daniel Renken pitched poorly at A+, but has done fairly well everywhere else, including a full season at AA. I see no point in sending him down.

    I have heard that many successful relief pitchers are starters up to a point in the minors. I think several pitchers have reached that fork in the road.
    I agree in principal with what you say. The presence of so many AAAA and ML retreads though make it conceivable that the way I have it could be the reality. Three possibilities - a) some of the afore-mentioned AAAA and ML retreads pitch their way out of the picture b) trade(s) remove one or more of the prospects from the competition c) the always ugly possibility of injury intervenes.

    Also, there's the distinct possibility that Reineke, Reckling, Schmidt, Dennick, Dyer and Dennhart (as well as Wang and Francis for that matter) are not locks for any rotation. They could just as easily be in the bullpen or out of the organization come April if prospects show they're superior.

    You're right though. After you get past Louisville, there are probably at least two starters at every level that are a wrung or so lower than they should be. If nothing else, Memorial Day (and soon after, Draft Day) may do a lot to remedy things
    Last edited by corkedbat; 01-19-2014 at 11:41 PM.

  17. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Lexington
    Posts
    6,226

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    nm
    Last edited by corkedbat; 01-19-2014 at 11:39 PM.

  18. #14
    Posting in Dynarama M2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2000
    Location
    Boston
    Posts
    28,271

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    Wild guess:

    AAA

    Wang
    Francis
    Corcino
    Rogers
    Smith

    Reineke and O'Brien in the pen and at the ready when/if some of those guys get ripped.

    AA

    Holmberg
    Stephenson
    Moscot
    Crabbe
    Renken

    Contreras closing.
    Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong

    I'm witchcrafting everybody.

  19. #15
    The Big Dog mth123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    14,872

    Re: Sorting out the Upper Level Rotations

    My shot at it:

    AAA: 13 Man staff

    Wang, Holmberg, Corcino, Smith and Rogers.

    Curtis Partch closing with Francis and Schmidt as bullpen lefty arms. Drew Hayes, Tim Crabbe, Nick Christiani, Jose Diaz and Pedro Beato round things out. (Logan Ondrusek opens in the big leagues with Broxton on the DL).

    AA: 13 Man Staff

    Stephenson, Moscot, O'Brien, Renken and Dennick (over Dyer because he's a lefty)

    Contreras closing with lefty arms Chris Manno, Lee Hyde and Wilkin De La Rosa. Dyer, Trevor Bell, James Walczak and Chad Reineke round things out.

    Dennhardt goes to the A+ pen.

    Say goodbye to Brian Pearl, Trevor Reckling, Pedro Villareal and Justin Freeman. Some could start out in extended spring training in case of injury (Reckling most likely).
    Last edited by mth123; 01-20-2014 at 06:28 AM.
    "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH

    Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | BCubb2003 | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | LexRedsFan | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | redsfan1995 | The Operator | Tommyjohn25