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Thread: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

  1. #31
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    He should have said nothing. If asked about it, say it's a not worth talking about, and move on. It seems that's what every other Cardinal has smartly chosen to do.
    I didnt realize every other cardinal was asked. Thanks.

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  3. #32
    Member cincrazy's Avatar
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    The Cardinals annoy me as much as anyone, but really, what do you expect the guy to say? "No, I don't forgive him, I hate his guts and he's not welcome here."

    I wouldn't be so quick to throw stones at the Cardinals, as there's little doubt due to the nature of the game the last few decades that more than a few of our favorite players here probably used whether we knew it or not.

  4. #33
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Sean Casey took "about a half a cup back in the 80s"

  5. #34
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    Isn't there an internet term for this? I cannot seem to remember what it is...

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  7. #35
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Wish I could like this 1 million times

  8. #36
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by cincrazy View Post
    The Cardinals annoy me as much as anyone, but really, what do you expect the guy to say? "No, I don't forgive him, I hate his guts and he's not welcome here."
    Forgive is not a term that MH should be tossing around referencing any PED user. Matt Holliday was not personally slighted nor is he in a position of power to be doling out forgiveness.

    Forgive is a hangup for me if he truly did use that terminology.

    Drop usage of forgiveness, and word things along the lines of "he served his time", or "we're ready to move on" and it's pretty much the plain vanilla type response a player should be giving.

  9. #37
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by indyscott View Post
    So are you starting a link about ryan ludwick and scott rolen? Oh and can you link me to the thread you started being furious when we signed Skip?
    I was being sarcastic. Lighten up, Francis.

  10. #38
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    links?

    And there it is.....the moment Salukifan2 lost all credibility on redszone in my eyes.
    I can't go any further back in the advanced search than last May. Those conversations took place during last off season.

    I had credibility? that is news to me

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  12. #39
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by cincrazy View Post
    The Cardinals annoy me as much as anyone, but really, what do you expect the guy to say? "No, I don't forgive him, I hate his guts and he's not welcome here."

    I wouldn't be so quick to throw stones at the Cardinals, as there's little doubt due to the nature of the game the last few decades that more than a few of our favorite players here probably used whether we knew it or not.
    I'm guessing there were at least a few Reds in the last decade or so who used PED's. This is likely true for every MLB team.

    However, whether the team knew or not is incredibly important. It would be difficult for a team to know the PED history of player they acquire without testing every player themselves. The Cardinals however, know the PED history of Peralta, and that's what makes the signing so different from most other situations.
    "Man, the pitch looks fast, even in slow motion." Thom Brennaman on Chapman's fastball.

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  14. #40
    breath westofyou's Avatar
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    I can't go any further back in the advanced search than last May. Those conversations took place during last off season.

    I had credibility? that is news to me
    Here's all your baseball posts to 10-12

    http://www.redszone.com/forums/searc...earchid=679647

  15. #41
    I don't want to grow up Red Raindog's Avatar
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by SporkLover View Post
    Forgive is not a term that MH should be tossing around referencing any PED user. Matt Holliday was not personally slighted nor is he in a position of power to be doling out forgiveness.

    Forgive is a hangup for me if he truly did use that terminology.

    Drop usage of forgiveness, and word things along the lines of "he served his time", or "we're ready to move on" and it's pretty much the plain vanilla type response a player should be giving.


    From the article:

    "I am against PEDs and always will be," Holliday said Monday at the Cardinals' winter fan festival. "But I also am a forgiving person, and he served his suspension. That's the rules of the game. I'm happy to have him as a teammate."

    What yanked my chain was he only mentioned giving a pass to his new team mate --- guess his passes only go so far.
    The older I get - the better I was

    and yes - I hate the Cardinals (Reds fan since 1958)

  16. #42
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    I hate the Cardinals.

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  18. #43
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I'm guessing there were at least a few Reds in the last decade or so who used PED's. This is likely true for every MLB team.

    However, whether the team knew or not is incredibly important. It would be difficult for a team to know the PED history of player they acquire without testing every player themselves. The Cardinals however, know the PED history of Peralta, and that's what makes the signing so different from most other situations.
    Except this is not true. The cardinals do not know the PED history of Peralta outside of that he was suspended for his alleged use. He has never failed a test, and was suspended for his part in the biogenesis scandal. It would be one thing if he were putting up an A-Rod type of fight, but he isn't and didn't.
    He took his suspension without much complaint.

    Also, at the time he got busted for using he was putting up one of his worst seasons on record. This is why i don't believe he has been "rewarded" for his use. His alleged use came in 2012, and he was suspended in 2013.

    At the end of the day its the GM's job to go out and put a winning team on the field. I would not begrudge the reds or Jocketty if they traded for Bruan, honestly I would be quite envious. If baseball wants to remove them, go for it, but until then I won't begrudge a team for doing what they believe is necessary to win (as long as it is within the rules).

    If the cardinals offered the reds Peralta for Cozart straight up (neglecting contractual obligations) would you actually say no for the reason of him having been busted for PEDs?

  19. #44
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    Also, at the time he got busted for using he was putting up one of his worst seasons on record. This is why i don't believe he has been "rewarded" for his use. His alleged use came in 2012, and he was suspended in 2013.
    If you believe his story (and you did state alleged). By looking at his stats I'd guess he found the "magic" in 2011. Not sure what happened in 2012, but he seems to be more of the 2009-2010 Jhonny. Then in 2013 the "magic" came back... until he got suspended. Of course Jhonny has over 1100 games in MLB at shortstop. History (pre-steroid) shows that those who play that much SS wear down.
    Small market fan... always hoping, but never expecting.

  20. #45
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Matt Holiday conveniently forgives Peralta

    Quote Originally Posted by RedFanAlways1966 View Post
    If you believe his story (and you did state alleged). By looking at his stats I'd guess he found the "magic" in 2011. Not sure what happened in 2012, but he seems to be more of the 2009-2010 Jhonny. Then in 2013 the "magic" came back... until he got suspended. Of course Jhonny has over 1100 games in MLB at shortstop. History (pre-steroid) shows that those who play that much SS wear down.
    I say alleged because he has never failed a test and has never been caught ingesting PEDs. Of course he is guilty in the court of public opinion.

    He does not, in my eyes, need to be player over his head again like last year. All he needs to do is be more threatening than Kozma which he still accomplishes. His contract was also worked out in a way that it shouldn't really cause the cards any problems moving forward.


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