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Thread: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

  1. #91
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    In 2004 ichiro was either 32 or 33. Not mid twenties like Bruce is now. I think you will be hard pressed to find people on this board to back you up if you are about argue that Bruce is a better defensive RF than Ichiro in his prime

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  3. #92
    Member RedsfaninMT's Avatar
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    So a post that lists the Reds high on the pitching list and low on the hitting list turns into a "Jay Bruce as the 2nd best hitter on the Reds is a problem."

    It's -10 (at 2 p.m.) here after hitting -30 last night. Spring Training is needed. NOW PLEASE!

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    Old school 1983 (02-06-2014), redsmetz (02-06-2014), Revering4Blue (02-06-2014)

  5. #93
    Member Old school 1983's Avatar
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    I would love to take both a fan and player poll to see how many of them think jay Bruce is elite. You'd all be upset
    Overall Jay isn't elite, but he does have some elite level skills. His ability to hit for XBH is elite and as a defender in RF, while he might not be the all time greatest (to me above elite) he is elite when compared to other RF in this current era. But overall, while I think he could bust out and put up an elite level season, he's more of an all star quality player than elite player. Some elite skills do not make you an elite level player.
    Last edited by Old school 1983; 02-06-2014 at 05:08 PM.

  6. #94
    They call me "chef"
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups



    "Why would a reviewer make the point of saying someone's *not* a genius?"
    Cincinnati Reds 2014 W-L Record: 76.6-85.4*

    Cincinnati Reds 2015 W-L Record: TBA

    *UPDATED: 2/11/2014

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    RadfordVA (02-07-2014), RedTeamGo! (02-06-2014)

  8. #95
    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    Quote Originally Posted by Salukifan2 View Post
    In 2004 ichiro was either 32 or 33. Not mid twenties like Bruce is now. I think you will be hard pressed to find people on this board to back you up if you are about argue that Bruce is a better defensive RF than Ichiro in his prime
    Did I say that? No. You brought up Ichiro as an example of an elite defensive RF. I showed that Ichiro only has 1 season better than Bruce. You tried to move the goal posts bringing up age for some reason and then said no one would agree with Bruce being better than ichiro, which is a statement I did not make.

  9. Likes:

    joshua (02-07-2014)

  10. #96
    Salukifan2
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    if you buy into that defensive metric, you should have no problem saying that Jay Bruce is of at least equal defensive prowess to Ichiro, no? If you don't, then it's use is moot. And you are just digging for stats that you don't believe in to make your claim, and if you are using data you do not believe in to support your claim you are lying to yourself in defense of yourself.

    If I say Ichiro is my perception of elite, and that Jay Bruce doesn't fit that mold, and then you retort by giving me stats in which Bruce appears superior, or at least equal, to Ichiro then it sounds to me like you are saying that shows Bruce is Ichiro's equal and, therefore elite.

    I do not agree, but we can agree to disagree? That aside, he needs to start accumulating defensive hardware ie.. gold gloves, platinum gloves etc. I think that matters when discussing how elite a player is.
    Last edited by Salukifan2; 02-06-2014 at 07:54 PM.

  11. #97
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    Quote Originally Posted by membengal View Post
    Hey everyone, I am gong to cherry pick stuff that fits my narrative/agenda and call myself objective. If anyone disagrees, well...you are not being objective .
    Are you talking about this?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    Your flaw that you disregard defense.
    If so, you are wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by junkhead View Post
    All right. Let's use WAR which includes the defense.

    2011(AS)




    Does he deserve to be an All-Star? No.

    2012(AS,MVP-10,SS)



    Does he deserve an All-Star selection? No.
    Does he deserve 10th place in MVP voting? No.



    Does he deserve SS? No.

    2013(MVP-10,SS)



    Does he deserve 10th place in MVP voting? No.



    Does he deserve SS? No.

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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    Quote Originally Posted by Old school 1983 View Post
    Overall Jay isn't elite, but he does have some elite level skills. His ability to hit for XBH is elite and as a defender in RF, while he might not be the all time greatest (to me above elite) he is elite when compared to other RF in this current era. But overall, while I think he could bust out and put up an elite level season, he's more of an all star quality player than elite player. Some elite skills do not make you an elite level player.
    2011: #15 in wRC+, #15 in Off, #17 in WAR among NL outfielders
    2012: #13 in wRC+, #14 in Off, #19 in WAR
    2013: #17 in wRC+, #16 in Off, #9 in WAR

    He's not an All-Star quality player.

  13. #99
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    Quote Originally Posted by westofyou View Post
    Don't be a Richard, this is a Reds community if it sucks for you so bad I suggest you find somewhere else to grace the unwashed with your vast knowledge of the game.
    It's a very childish response.

  14. #100
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    Quote Originally Posted by junkhead View Post
    2011: #15 in wRC+, #15 in Off, #17 in WAR among NL outfielders
    2012: #13 in wRC+, #14 in Off, #19 in WAR
    2013: #17 in wRC+, #16 in Off, #9 in WAR

    He's not an All-Star quality player.


    You do know that it's not Bruce's fault that Choo has never been an All Star right?

    Bruce didn't get voted in by the fan base that can be a popularity contest. He was picked by his peers the first time, and he was picked by the manager the second time.

    I'm surprised Choo has never been voted in by the Korean population the way that some Asian athletes can get a boost from their home country.

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  16. #101
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    If I had any authority over this place, I'd be banning some trolls right about now.

  17. #102
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    If the admins can permanently ban one of the greatest and most lauded comedic voices in RedsZone history, surely they can issue a weekend suspension to some underpass dwellers? Is this not an elite forum?
    Cincinnati Reds 2014 W-L Record: 76.6-85.4*

    Cincinnati Reds 2015 W-L Record: TBA

    *UPDATED: 2/11/2014

  18. #103
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    Quote Originally Posted by joshua View Post
    If I had any authority over this place, I'd be banning some trolls right about now.
    Do you want the Redszone to be like this?



  19. #104
    They call me "chef"
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    Are you threatening to invite all your friends if action is taken against you?
    Cincinnati Reds 2014 W-L Record: 76.6-85.4*

    Cincinnati Reds 2015 W-L Record: TBA

    *UPDATED: 2/11/2014

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    junkhead (02-07-2014)

  21. #105
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    Re: Anthony Castrovince: Top 10 Rotations & Top 10 Lineups

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry Schuler View Post
    Are you threatening to invite all your friends if action is taken against you?
    You are so funny. I love your sense of humor.


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