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Thread: How do the Reds replace Choo?

  1. #1
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    How do the Reds replace Choo?

    The Reds had a great RS698 RA589. Anytime it's over 100RD. 109+ for you guys last year was great even though the season didn't end how you would have hoped.


    I hoped the Cards would of paid Choo. I think having him in Center and bat 2nd behind Carpenter would of sealed the deal for the cards for a few years.

    But that didn't happen.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...choosh01.shtml


    He was unreal for you guys last year. I have read around here and most fans without giving much reason except lots of hope think replacing him will be a cake walk.

    How? The guy replacing him in theory Hamilton is super exciting. He has torrid SB potential but he will probably bet on base .100obp less than Choo if not worse. I doubt stealing bases can make up for the huge on-base/power/rbi production he gave as your lead-off hitter.

    The guy is a superstar at this point. I really thought you guys would keep him.

    I am not trolling this board. I know it's only one player. But damn, replacing him with Hamilton is a bit strange for a team that has it's fan base overwhelmingly sure of the playoffs and a world series contender.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    Quote Originally Posted by frivolousz21 View Post
    The Reds had a great RS698 RA589. Anytime it's over 100RD. 109+ for you guys last year was great even though the season didn't end how you would have hoped.


    I hoped the Cards would of paid Choo. I think having him in Center and bat 2nd behind Carpenter would of sealed the deal for the cards for a few years.

    But that didn't happen.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/pl...choosh01.shtml


    He was unreal for you guys last year. I have read around here and most fans without giving much reason except lots of hope think replacing him will be a cake walk.

    How? The guy replacing him in theory Hamilton is super exciting. He has torrid SB potential but he will probably bet on base .100obp less than Choo if not worse. I doubt stealing bases can make up for the huge on-base/power/rbi production he gave as your lead-off hitter.

    The guy is a superstar at this point. I really thought you guys would keep him.

    I am not trolling this board. I know it's only one player. But damn, replacing him with Hamilton is a bit strange for a team that has it's fan base overwhelmingly sure of the playoffs and a world series contender.
    Choo only stole 20 bases last year while being caught stealing 11 times. Yes Hamilton might not get on base as much as Choo did, but when he does, he will more often turn a walk or single into a 'double' or even a 'triple' with stolen bases. So instead of Choo being on base and becoming the front end of a double play, Hamilton and his base stealing ability is going to rattle the pitchers and he can put himself into scoring position without having to sacrifice him over. I guarantee Hamilton being on base is going to help whomever is batting second and Votto immensely because the pitchers will be worrying about Hamilton. Not to mention, every time they throw over to force Hamilton back, they are tiring their arm out even more.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    From some the reports we've been seeing over the off season, it looks like Billy has been working very diligently on his hitting and bunting. It will be hard to replace Choo's OBP and 100+ runs scored, but, if BH can continue to improve, we'll be in good shape. His base stealing threat brings another dynamic into the mix with disrupting a pitcher's timing and, like lewdog mentioned, with his speed resulting in fewer double plays.

    He can't steal first base though, so I hope his hard work over the off season brings big rewards.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    As good as any one player might be lineups are inter-dynamic, one part playing off others. The Reds need Billy to be at least minimally successful getting on base so he can use his speed, but they also have other factors to help offset losing Choo. Upticks to some of the guys who had down years last season, a possible "career year" from several pedestrian candidates (Mes, Frazier, Cozart), more power from Joey, Bruce hitting his prime years. Replacing Choo will be a combination of factors, not any one guy. It won;t be easy, and may not be possible but it's not exactly a lost cause, either.
    No - I am not from State Farm!

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    I'm extremely excited to see the effect Hamilton brings to the defense in Cincinnati. I really think he is going to be able to get to some balls in centerfield that no one in the league can reach. He will not provide the same value as Choo (likely not close to the 5.2 Choo had last season), but I think it is realistic for Billy to put up a WAR in the 2-3 range. Additionally, as long as Ludwick stays healthy, there is no reason to think he won't put up an at least 1 more in WAR than our LF situation from last year.

    That puts the Reds down 1.2-2.2 WAR from last year with the loss of Choo. Add in a few more Cueto starts this year, as well as some of our other injured pitchers coming back. I don't think it's ridiculous to think the Reds put up a higher team WAR in 2014 than the 2013 team. Things have to go right for the Reds to do that, but we don't need anything incredible to happen for this situation to play out.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    Quote Originally Posted by frivolousz21 View Post
    The guy is a superstar at this point. I really thought you guys would keep him.
    I loved him and I know most Reds fans would love to have him back. But the majority of us also realized that he was probably just a one year rental for us. Which is what it was. Simply put, the Reds could not afford him.

    As far as the void...we shall see how Hamilton plays out.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    Seems too me we were the same with or without him. It is more important that Votto, Bruce, Phillips, Frazier, and Ludwick pick up their games for us too be successful.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    Choo will be sorely missed. He had a career year and is responsible for much of that run differential.

    Hamilton brings something special as a replacement. Speed will be exciting when he gets on base. The threat of bunting is real and should add value to his offense.

    I don't see the other regulars stepping up to fill the void. But, if Hamilton can get on base, he'll turn a lot of walks and bunt singles into triples.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    I believe very few on here think replacing Choo will be a cake-walk. He was a monster last year.

    I also believe many on here realize the Reds won more games in 2012 without him then they did with him in 2013.

    The point is, every team is different and while replacing Choo's numbers will be difficult, winning games without him can be accomplished.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsBrick View Post
    I believe very few on here think replacing Choo will be a cake-walk. He was a monster last year.

    I also believe many on here realize the Reds won more games in 2012 without him then they did with him in 2013.

    The point is, every team is different and while replacing Choo's numbers will be difficult, winning games without him can be accomplished.
    We were EXTREMELY lucky in not 1 starting pitcher going down in 2012. That just can't be counted on in this day and age. My biggest concern is that if a pitcher goes down, we have no depth for SP. There are a bunch of question marks offensively, but the depth is what concerns me the most.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteRoseDay View Post
    We were EXTREMELY lucky in not 1 starting pitcher going down in 2012. That just can't be counted on in this day and age. My biggest concern is that if a pitcher goes down, we have no depth for SP. There are a bunch of question marks offensively, but the depth is what concerns me the most.
    And in '13 plenty of injuries in both the starting rotation and 'pen. Also pretty unlucky to lose the starting LFer, for practically the season, on opening day.

    Seems every year things can't be counted on or are unexpected.

    Replacing Choo's numbers from last year will be tough but it won't be the demise of the '14 Reds.

  16. #12
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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteRoseDay View Post
    We were EXTREMELY lucky in not 1 starting pitcher going down in 2012. That just can't be counted on in this day and age. My biggest concern is that if a pitcher goes down, we have no depth for SP. There are a bunch of question marks offensively, but the depth is what concerns me the most.
    SP depth is actually good. Holmberg is a highly touted rookie, Rogers is pushing for a chance, Wang is a veteran with some ability (better than Francis) and it's very conceivable that Stephenson could be ready by mid summer.
    No - I am not from State Farm!

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  18. #13
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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    You don't attempt to replace a player like Choo. The offense will be different than last year - Hamilton has blazing speed, our middle of the order Lf'er will be back, Price will be managing and the bench should be stronger just to name a few.
    Hamilton should lift our defense. Many on this board was highly critical of Choo's defense until he was a huge lift for the offense, then the defense was not nearly as important. I think Hamilton will be a boost in center immediately and having our core defense healthy on opening day will also be a lift.
    I also think our rotation is solid and we have a great advantage with our bullpen.
    We were NL Central champs without Choo, we can do it again - if the Cards (pun intended) fall in the right places.

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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    thanks for the reply's guys. It helps me learn more about the Reds.

    The Reds have a lot of impact player quality talent. But are relatively thin depth wise.

    The good news is that you guys have a few years to "retool" that depth situation while competing for playoff spots.


    I don't think the Cards are as surefire good as many cards fans/media think.

    The 2002, 2004, 2005 teams in STL were surefire loaded clubs. With 2000-2013(save the retool years(07-08) 88-90 win teams give or take things falling in place.

    I think the Reds and Cards are like that right now. With the cards having an advantage because of depth.


    I think your wildcard is Jay Bruce. He has the potential to possibly get down under 150K while walking 75 times and posting a .900OPS+ which would give you two .900OPS+ guys with 65-80 hr between them.

  20. #15
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    Re: How do the Reds replace Choo?

    Why do people continue to use Choo? The question is can Hamilton match the success of Drew Stubbs. IF he can do that the Reds will be fine.


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