Turn Off Ads?
Page 10 of 41 FirstFirst ... 6789101112131420 ... LastLast
Results 136 to 150 of 609

Thread: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

  1. #136
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    42,359

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by CmdrCody View Post
    Bonds was a great hitter before BALCO. The roids just made him a great POWER hitter.
    What does that have to do with anything?

  2. Turn Off Ads?
  3. #137
    Member CmdrCody's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    83

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    What does that have to do with anything?
    Hat does Bonds have to do with Hamilton?
    Reds fan since 1968 win or lose.

  4. #138
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    42,359

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsLvr View Post
    Ha. Ha. The difference between below average runners and above average runners in Scouting is TWO tenths of a second and you're saying ONLY a tenth of a second faster than the fastest runners. That's pretty significant.
    No, I said LESS THAN a tenth of a second. Billy Hamilton has been timed, by me, as fast as 3.64 from the left side to first base on a swing. I have seen more than a handful of guys below 3.74. I have timed guys that most people on this board have never heard of below 3.75. Do you think if there were hitters even in the realm of Barry Bonds at the plate that anyone on this board would have not heard of him? OF course not. That is my point. Barry Bonds hitting ability is so much more rare and unseen than Billy Hamilton's speed it isn't even funny. The two simply aren't comparable. Guys are close to being as fast as Hamilton and there are a few guys in any given year in the game that are close enough to it. There simply aren't guys close to the hitter that Bonds was until you get back to Ted Williams or Babe Ruth.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by CmdrCody View Post
    Hat does Bonds have to do with Hamilton?
    You clearly didn't read the thread. Someone compared the rarity of Hamilton's speed to the hitting ability to Bonds in its rarity. They aren't close.

  5. Likes:

    Always Red (04-21-2014)

  6. #139
    Flash the leather! _Sir_Charles_'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    10,697

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    I agree with Doug on this one. Nobody is saying Billy isn't the fastest guy in the league. But the actual difference between him and several other guys is miniscule. Less than a 1/10 of a second...think about that for a minute or two.

    There's a bunch more to stealing bases than just being fast. Thus far in the bigs, we've seen that he is fast. But we haven't seen good reads of the pitcher, solid secondary leads, excellent jumps...at least not regularly. Quite often it's a bang-bang play or even the ball beating him there by quite a bit. He's got a long way to go before he should be compared to Henderson, Raines, etc. The only time I put him in with that group is when I talk about the effect he has on the pitcher and defense when he's on base. The amount of distraction he is causing. That's on par with those all-time great thieves. But that's mostly just because of his reputation coming into the league...not MLB results.

    He's currently 7 for 9 in SB's. It really should be 6 for 9 or even 5 for 9. With a halfway decent tag, he'd be toast on two of those for sure.
    Last edited by _Sir_Charles_; 04-21-2014 at 12:18 PM.

  7. #140
    breath westofyou's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2000
    Location
    PDX
    Posts
    47,313

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by REDblooded View Post
    I usually side with you, but when scouts say Billy Hamilton has the fastest time they've ever clocked from home to first, it's not fair to say others are close, so it doesn't matter... He's the best ever as far as measurable speed goes, and it's not arguable.
    That was in ST though right?

    Fastest guys in MLB history Back during the "Field Day" era they used to have races around the bases as a show of speed:

    Evar Swanson – 5’9 – CF/RF
    Most Steals in a season: 33

    Once again, a onetime Red. (note a pattern?) Swanson etched his name in the speed annals on 9/15/1929, at a field day held at Redland Field between games of a doubleheader. A $100 prize was offered up if anyone could circle the bases from a standing start in less than 13.8 seconds and beat Lobert’s aforementioned major league record. Among the participants were Swanson and former University of Cincinnati track and baseball star Ethan Allen. Swanson was able to circumnavigate the bases in full uniform in 13.4 seconds for a MLB record. No mention was made of Allen’s finish time. Swanson also played a little pro football and was most likely the first Red to also log time in the NFL.
    Hamilton's inside the park HR was in that neighborhood.


  8. Likes:

    RedFanAlways1966 (04-21-2014)

  9. #141
    Legen...dary reds44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    26,038

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Again, what kind of logic is that? He also could be 8 for 9 when you consider he looked safe on one of his CS.

    He's 20/23 in his major league career stealing bases. That's really good.

    And you know what could make the difference on these bang bang plays? A tenth of a second.
    Quote Originally Posted by Norm Chortleton View Post
    The old Votto is back when he starts cussing himself out between pitches.

  10. Likes:

    alwaysawarrior (04-21-2014),Chuckie (04-21-2014)

  11. #142
    Legen...dary reds44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    26,038

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by junkhead View Post
    Reds' chances of making playoffs aren't looking good now and you still want Hamilton in the leadoff spot?





    http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/200...your-lineup-by
    The Reds chances of making the playoffs are pretty much no different now than they were in Spring Training so I wouldn't say that chances "aren't looking to good," but I absolutely keep running Hamilton out there in the leadoff spot every game. It would be different if the Reds had another high OBP guy to do it, but outside of Votto this is a low OBP team. I'm going to be interested to see what Votto's numbers look like with Hamilton on base compared to when he's not on.
    Quote Originally Posted by Norm Chortleton View Post
    The old Votto is back when he starts cussing himself out between pitches.

  12. Likes:

    REDREAD (04-21-2014)

  13. #143
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    On Assignment: Kansas City
    Posts
    18,960

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    How is he going to learn to hit leadoff, steal bases, etc at the bottom of the order?
    Don't worry about the short term cost of Billy batting leadoff. It's really not that big of a deal.
    It's certainly not going to be the difference in the Reds making or missing the playoffs.
    Now, in the playoffs if he has a 250 OBP for the entire year, then yes.. move him to #8 then.

    If he hits lead off all year and has a 250 OBP Price and Walt should be fired.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  14. #144
    Legen...dary reds44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    26,038

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    If he hits lead off all year and has a 250 OBP Price and Walt should be fired.
    He wouldn't.
    Quote Originally Posted by Norm Chortleton View Post
    The old Votto is back when he starts cussing himself out between pitches.

  15. #145
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    42,359

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    How is he going to learn to hit leadoff, steal bases, etc at the bottom of the order?
    Don't worry about the short term cost of Billy batting leadoff. It's really not that big of a deal.
    It's certainly not going to be the difference in the Reds making or missing the playoffs.
    Now, in the playoffs if he has a 250 OBP for the entire year, then yes.. move him to #8 then.
    It fascinates me that people try and use a different approach in different parts of the lineup.

    Look, I know that it happens. But it shouldn't. Get on base. Hit the ball hard. Those should be your goals no matter where you are batting in the lineup. Period.

  16. Likes:

    Raisor (04-21-2014),wheels (04-21-2014)

  17. #146
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    On Assignment: Kansas City
    Posts
    18,960

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    He wouldn't.
    He wouldn't what?
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  18. #147
    Legen...dary reds44's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    26,038

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Well I don't think he'll have a .250 OBP, but if he did he wouldn't hit leadoff all year.
    Quote Originally Posted by Norm Chortleton View Post
    The old Votto is back when he starts cussing himself out between pitches.

  19. #148
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    279

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    No, I said LESS THAN a tenth of a second. Billy Hamilton has been timed, by me, as fast as 3.64 from the left side to first base on a swing. I have seen more than a handful of guys below 3.74. I have timed guys that most people on this board have never heard of below 3.75. Do you think if there were hitters even in the realm of Barry Bonds at the plate that anyone on this board would have not heard of him? OF course not. That is my point. Barry Bonds hitting ability is so much more rare and unseen than Billy Hamilton's speed it isn't even funny. The two simply aren't comparable. Guys are close to being as fast as Hamilton and there are a few guys in any given year in the game that are close enough to it. There simply aren't guys close to the hitter that Bonds was until you get back to Ted Williams or Babe Ruth.

    - - - Updated - - -



    You clearly didn't read the thread. Someone compared the rarity of Hamilton's speed to the hitting ability to Bonds in its rarity. They aren't close.

    Alright. I understand your point. As for your Bonds argument, although you are correct nobody was even close to Barry Bonds. But he was a hall of fame talent who took a vigorous regimen of anabolic steroids. Hard to say if he would have posted those consecutive years of high OPS+. I think that had Griffey taken roids as a young kid and had 10+ more years of his prime with more power he would have put up similar numbers.

  20. #149
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    On Assignment: Kansas City
    Posts
    18,960

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    Well I don't think he'll have a .250 OBP, but if he did he wouldn't hit leadoff all year.
    I agree he wouldn't be leading off, just saying if he did then off with their heads
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  21. #150
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Cincinnati
    Posts
    11,115

    Re: Karl Ravech destroying Billy Hamilton on the BBTN podcast

    Quote Originally Posted by _Sir_Charles_ View Post
    I agree with Doug on this one. Nobody is saying Billy isn't the fastest guy in the league. But the actual difference between him and several other guys is miniscule. Less than a 1/10 of a second...think about that for a minute or two.

    There's a bunch more to stealing bases than just being fast. Thus far in the bigs, we've seen that he is fast. But we haven't seen good reads of the pitcher, solid secondary leads, excellent jumps...at least not regularly. Quite often it's a bang-bang play or even the ball beating him there by quite a bit. He's got a long way to go before he should be compared to Henderson, Raines, etc. The only time I put him in with that group is when I talk about the effect he has on the pitcher and defense when he's on base. The amount of distraction he is causing. That's on par with those all-time great thieves. But that's mostly just because of his reputation coming into the league...not MLB results.

    He's currently 7 for 9 in SB's. It really should be 6 for 9 or even 5 for 9. With a halfway decent tag, he'd be toast on two of those for sure.
    A 10th of a second is the difference between Olympic Gold Medal's and perhaps nothing. Sprinters, runners, swimmers, etc train their tails off for those minuscule tenth's. You know what a 10th of a second is, the difference between a good and bad tag. Its the difference between taking the ball out cleanly and having to spend a little extra time finding the seems of the baseball. Its the difference between a good break and an average break to cover 1st by the pitcher.

    Take a look at a stolen base and all the components that go into catching Hamilton speeding. A pitcher is more likely to throw a fastball with Hamilton on base in order to save hundredths of a second. How much attention does he pay to make sure that he can shorten Hamilton's lead. Then you need a fast pitch, a quick catch and release by the catcher, a throw on line, and then a quick tag in order to have a chance to nab Hamilton. You know when tenths of a second matter, when the opposing team is worrying about hundredths.


Turn Off Ads?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please.

Thank you, and most importantly, enjoy yourselves!


RedsZone.com is a privately owned website and is not affiliated with the Cincinnati Reds or Major League Baseball


Contact us: Boss | GIK | cumberlandreds | dabvu2498 | Gallen5862 | Plus Plus | RedlegJake | RedsfaninMT | redsfan1995 | The Operator