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Thread: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

  1. #1
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    I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    Often times managers use one run strategies to insure they get one run and i usually think it's kind of silly to play for one run when a big inning most often wins you a game, but something has always bothered me and it's this:

    A runner is on 1st and 3rd and there are 2 outs....tie game ....there is a ball hit to short stop in the hole and he's gotta make a good play to get him at 2nd - why does the runner going into to 2nd always slide? Why not run thru the bag much like a player does when when he runs thru first (i know the rules- you can run thru first and not be out), but wouldn't you think there would be one time in the history of major league baseball where a runner would say "if i slide i might be out, but if i run thru the bag i will initially be called safe and THEN be tagged out but not before the runner at home croses the plate". You use an awful of lot of engery to to slow your body down to slide in the bag --best analogy i can think of is running a race --it takes almost as much energy to run down a hill as to run up it because of it's kenetic energy. Run thru the bag and see if you make it --it's a run one strategy and managers do a lot more conservative things than that.....but i have never seen it occur.

    Ok -you can now start making fun of me

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    Daffy Duck RedTeamGo!'s Avatar
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

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    Redsmetz redsmetz's Avatar
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    You say "runner" but mention first and third - so I'm assuming you mean the plural and there are, in fact, two runners on. Therefore, the out at second is a force out, as would, of course, the play at first. Not sure what's hard about getting the out at second when it's a force play.
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    Member cumberlandreds's Avatar
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    Your scenario is a force out. That won't work and never will with a runner on first.
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    I think what he's saying is that if the runner doesn't slide at second (and consequently, doesn't slow down), he might beat the throw and remove the force, allowing the runner at third to score.

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    .377 in 1905 CySeymour's Avatar
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    Actually, I like the idea. If it's pretty definite that the runner at second will be out, hence ending the inning, why not make the defensive team tag him after running through the bag?
    ...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound.

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    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    I doubt you'll save much time by running through the bag but you might have some massive collisions at 2B. Only players like Pete Rose and Ryan Freel might be able to go full speed into 2nd and slow up even a little bit if you see the second baseman standing on the bag

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    For a Level Playing Field RedFanAlways1966's Avatar
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    Not a bad question. The time saved b/c of no-slide probably makes that runner safe at second 2% more if I had to guess. I really doubt it is ever so close that all runners will change the routine. No way will I believe that this occurs often enough (so close at 2nd he would have been safe with no slide) that it changes the mentality in that situation. Probably as much chance of an errant throw to second base as there is that the runner would have been safe w/out a slide. Not to mention the chance of running into the man covering the bag for the force out (bush league some will say, possible interference, etc).
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    I think it's an excellent question that makes sense as clearly the runner would have a better chance of beating the throw if he doesn't slide.

    In a situation where a run was crucial, it might make sense to do this if the runner has a clear path to 2nd.

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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    good lord - i know what a force out is ...

    7th game of world series and the 2nd baseman is stretched out to receive the throw from short or 3rd -the 2nd baseman is not in the way -he's not blocking the bag --the runner from 3rd scored if the runner at 2nd is safe --i'd run thru the bag. there's a reason they do so at first --cause you get there faster.

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    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    good lord - i know what a force out is ...

    7th game of world series and the 2nd baseman is stretched out to receive the throw from short or 3rd -the 2nd baseman is not in the way -he's not blocking the bag --the runner from 3rd scored if the runner at 2nd is safe --i'd run thru the bag. there's a reason they do so at first --cause you get there faster.
    I think they wouldn't slide mainly because it goes against a players instinct to slide on a close play. And it's debatable whether you get there faster or not when you run through the bag. If you do it's only a tenth or a quarter of a second.
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    Member smixsell's Avatar
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    Excellent unconventional thought from the OP IMO.

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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    it's really not debatable at all .....if it was every track runner would slide head first while trying to win a race --standing up and running thru the bag is quicker --there's no debate -now if you want to STOP on the bag --sliding is the way to go --but running thru the bag is faster.

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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    The issue is that if the play is truly that close that running through the bag instead of sliding may result in the runner being safe, then there's enough of a chance that the runner may actually be safe when sliding, in which case a runs scores and the inning continues.

    It's a very interesting idea, and definitely worth further discussion and research.
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    Re: I know i'm gonna face the ridicule, but i gotta ask:)

    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    good lord - i know what a force out is ...

    7th game of world series and the 2nd baseman is stretched out to receive the throw from short or 3rd -the 2nd baseman is not in the way -he's not blocking the bag --the runner from 3rd scored if the runner at 2nd is safe --i'd run thru the bag. there's a reason they do so at first --cause you get there faster.
    In this scenario, another possibility would be that the ball (coming from the SS or 3B) would strike the runner as he's rounding 2nd which would be another positive outcome. Makes sense, but I agree that instincts take over and the slide is a natural reflex to that situation. The runner would have to be ready for this situation and consciously thinking about it to overcome his reflex to slide. Would be a smart thing for the 1B coach to remind the runner in these situations. Couldn't hurt.


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