To be fair, that will happen about the same number of times that the pitcher will bobble the throw, like you mentioned earlier. Probably fewer.
Harper broke a rule. We can debate how useful or how stupid the rule is, but if you break a rule, you need to be held accountable.
"I prefer books and movies where the conflict isn't of the extreme cannibal apocalypse variety I guess." Redsfaithful
What else is he going to do, write down a list of Doug approved situations when it's OK to dogg it then pin it up on the locker room wall for reference? Screw that. Make 'em hustle every play and you don't have to worry about it.
jimbo (04-21-2014)
Disagree. If you're a guy that hustles on every play, fielders know that because it comes through on the scouting reports. That might cause a shortstop to rush a throw from a backhanded groundball because he knows the guy is going full speed down the line. It may well mean a few more errors over the course of a season. If a whole team does it, that can add up through the season.
If you give fielders more reason to rush making a play, there will be more errors. Jogging down the line is an invitation for them to make a better play.
"No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda
BluegrassRedleg (04-21-2014),jimbo (04-21-2014)
I would start with not pulling your best hitter because he didn't bust it down to first base on a tapper to the stinking pitcher like it was a big deal. Sure, he literally jogged like a 60-year-old man with a hip replacement on it. If he did that on a weak grounder to shortstop, yeah, maybe you get upset about that. There is a chance of at least making something happen there. But to the pitcher? Nah.
It's a judgment call. Everything isn't created equally. I think Williams had the wrong reaction here. If you know how to get in touch with him and want to put him in touch with me, we can work on the Doug approved situations. Just let me know.
RadfordVA (04-21-2014)
I' think you're in error here. Myself, and the many who have responded, are not upset or infuriated over the manager's call. It was just a situation that arose and I wanted to get people's feel on it. As I initially said - there are valid arguments to both sides of the discussion. And that was my only intent ... to initiate discussion, and not draw sides where we go after either Williams or Harper.
I also really respect Harper's actions/response to it too. Very professional. We all know that some players, due to ego, wouldn't have been so gracious, and would have thrown a fit.
"In my day you had musicians who experimented with drugs. Now it's druggies experimenting with music" - Alfred G Clark (circa 1972)
You, and dubc47834, are right with this. And that point evaded me. He was punished, not so much for not hustling down the line, but he didn't finish the play.
I have no problem at all with Williams jerking him. That's similar to a parent setting boundaries (rules) and the kid crosses it. To not act sends the wrong message to that kid (as well as the other siblings) ... "Hey! If he can get away with it, then I can too". You then lose control.
Making an "example" of Harper - who had no problem with it - will very well send a message to the rest of the team that our manager means what he says irregardless of who you are, and what your stature is on this team.
The more I think about it, it's no different then a player hitting a lazy, routine fly ball to the OF, slinging the bat down and casually trotting down the line waiting for seems to be a sure out. Sure, it's just as wrong (I guess). But it occurs daily in games and isn't going to change anytime soon. To change it would mean a heck of a lot of benchings! LOL
Last edited by GAC; 04-21-2014 at 04:47 AM.
"In my day you had musicians who experimented with drugs. Now it's druggies experimenting with music" - Alfred G Clark (circa 1972)
dubc47834 (04-21-2014)
I like hustle as much as the next guy, but if I seen that play without knowing what happened, I would not have thought twice about it. Didn't jump out to me as extraordinary at all.
markymark69 (04-22-2014)
I think williams did the right thing. If you make a "rule" in spring training you have to do something if someone breaks it and it shouldnīt matter who the guy is.
Do I think it is clever to run 100% every time you hit a pop-up etc.? no of course not but the guys get paid millions and donīt have to run that much during a game => itīs not going to hurt to run to first...
"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
markymark69 (04-22-2014)
So, instead of pulling Harper from the game for that lack of hustle, how would people have felt if he chewed Harper out (embarrassed him) in front of his teammates? Not taking it into the tunnel or manager's office but right there for everyone to see.
Our planet is a lonely speck in the great enveloping cosmic dark. In our obscurity, in all this vastness, there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves. -- Carl Sagan (Pale Blue Dot)
markymark69 (04-22-2014)
I think that is a way of dealing with what happened, I just dont feel it is the right way to deal with it. Public embarrassment like that to me is rarely the right way to handle anything. Pulling him from the game to me was the right thing to do because it sends the message that if you dont want to play hard or the right way then you're not going to play period. I don't think it is lazy managing as another poster said. Could he have pulled Harper down in the tunnel and gave him a good lashing with no one around, sure, but knowing what type player Williams was, I don't think he would do that. Harper has handled this pretty good and I'm sure he took a hit to his ego. I doubt he will do it again any time soon. In my opinion Williams handled it the way I would have, were there other options, yeah, and they could be right also, as long as Williams gets his point across. In this instance I think he did!!!
Its all about knowing your players and they they respond to certain things.
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