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Thread: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

  1. #16
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post

    I honestly feel defeated most days- no matter what I eat seems to have a drawback.
    It can be overwhelming, but you seem to value "quality of life" over "quantity", so I wouldn't worry about it. Can't see the purpose of choosing quantity over quality. What's the point?

    I don't like running. I don't like gyms. I love the outdoors. I'm not into bicycling. I love meeting people. So, I combine the love of outdoors and meeting people, and that works well for walking and hiking.

    Sometimes I focus too much of my time (in my mind) pre-occupied with needing to "undo" what I did (ate too much or too many bad things).

    Every year I get older, the bigger effect the "bad" things have on me. We went bowling Saturday Night, but I made us a roasted chicken (with no nitrates or nitrites) salad with nuts, garbanzo beans, kidney beans, carrots, broccoli, etc. to eat before we went so we wouldn't gouge on nachos/chicken fingers/etc. I was going to get a Dr. Pepper (my achille's, but I rarely drink more than 4 oz. at a time), but when she ordered a rootbeer float, I followed up with a blackberry milkshake. That milkshake will take days/a week to "undo".

    I'm 20 pounds overweight, so I'm not even close to where I should be. My lungs are in good shape, my heart is good, but I have too much body fat. 5', 10"; 185; 26% (55 years old) I was 24% last week. I weigh myself at the same time every morning. I'd like to be 170; 20% body fat right now. That would be very good health for me. I got down to 172/22 14 months ago, but went up to the low-190's and 26 for the Winter. Too much "volume" and late-night eating.

    It's really pretty simple for me. Get to bed earlier and I avoid the late-night eating while getting a greater percentage of the sleep I need. But, there's just so much I feel I need to get done, I try to get them done at night after everyone goes to bed. I'm the first one up (and am gone before anyone else gets up). I just have to let things go.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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  4. #17
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    I do Paleo mostly, so I guess I'm stupid. Just finished a week of Steak-and-Eggs diet and lost 5 pounds in 4 days.

    I cook with butter and coconut oil, eat lots of beef, eggs, fish, liver, bone broth and gelatin. I sometimes have some collard greens.

    Fish oil has mostly gone rancid by the time you take it. To get your Omega-3's just eat a couple of cans of sardines each week. I eat canned salmon everyday (canned salmon is always wild salmon), canned sardines, anchovies and oysters a few times a week. Avoid stuff canned in one of the terrible industrial seed oils. Oysters are especially loaded with nutrients.

    Saturated fats were demonized so that we'd eat up the all the extra corn and soy that the farmers are paid by the government to grow. (in the form of oils). Men especially should avoid soy at all cost.

    And, really, if your grandparents wouldn't recognized it -- almond milk (what?), low-fat cheese, veggieburgers, etc.. you probably shouldn't it. That stuff's garbage.
    The widow is gathering nettles for her children's dinner; a perfumed seigneur, delicately lounging in the Oeil de Boeuf, hath an alchemy whereby he will extract the third nettle and call it rent. ~ Carlyle

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  6. #18
    Member Beltway's Avatar
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    The problem with nutrition studies and recommendations is that they're based on the idea of an "average" person, but there is no such thing as an "average" person. The only place where there is universal agreement is that processed foods are bad. Outside of that, there's really no way to know until we have individualized nutrition advice based upon on genetics.

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  8. #19
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    Quote Originally Posted by Rojo View Post
    I do Paleo mostly, so I guess I'm stupid. Just finished a week of Steak-and-Eggs diet and lost 5 pounds in 4 days.

    I cook with butter and coconut oil, eat lots of beef, eggs, fish, liver, bone broth and gelatin. I sometimes have some collard greens.

    Fish oil has mostly gone rancid by the time you take it. To get your Omega-3's just eat a couple of cans of sardines each week. I eat canned salmon everyday (canned salmon is always wild salmon), canned sardines, anchovies and oysters a few times a week. Avoid stuff canned in one of the terrible industrial seed oils. Oysters are especially loaded with nutrients.

    Saturated fats were demonized so that we'd eat up the all the extra corn and soy that the farmers are paid by the government to grow. (in the form of oils). Men especially should avoid soy at all cost.

    And, really, if your grandparents wouldn't recognized it -- almond milk (what?), low-fat cheese, veggieburgers, etc.. you probably shouldn't it. That stuff's garbage.
    All that fish just sounds like a lot of mercury....see? lol...
    I'm interested in jobs and you won't create jobs by forcing employers to pay their employees $9/hr- Sea Ray
    I'd say min wage should be about $9/hr - Sea Ray

  9. #20
    Bread Gloves Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    A lot of these diets seem kinda complicated. I've followed the Slow Carb diet for 4 years now, I was 237 when I started. Lost almost 60lbs in 8 months with basically zero workout (was recovering from knee surgery). Over the last 3 years my weight has fluctuated between 175-185 depending on how much time I'm putting in the weight room vs. playing basketball.

    I avoid white carbs 6 days a week. Go crazy on a cheat day once a week. Breakfast and lunch are pretty much the same thing everyday. People who knew me from before congratulate me and what not but it's honestly one of the easiest things I've ever done.

    Last year finally got my dad to do it. He's lost 40lbs and doesn't work out. I would recommend to anyone at least looking into it.

  10. #21
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    Quote Originally Posted by Razor Shines View Post
    Last year finally got my dad to do it. He's lost 40lbs and doesn't work out. I would recommend to anyone at least looking into it.
    Yeah, not being fat is a pretty strong evidence.
    The widow is gathering nettles for her children's dinner; a perfumed seigneur, delicately lounging in the Oeil de Boeuf, hath an alchemy whereby he will extract the third nettle and call it rent. ~ Carlyle

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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post
    All that fish just sounds like a lot of mercury....see? lol...
    Oh, you're just trying to make it difficult. Tuna's the only commonly eaten fish that you have to think twice about. Look at salmon, oysters, sardines and anchovies:


    Mercury levels in commercial fish and shellfish

    Tilefish (Gulf of Mexico) 1.450 n/a n/a Mid-Atlantic tilefish has lower mercury levels
    and is considered safe to eat in moderation.[1] 3.6 35
    Swordfish 0.995 0.539 0.870 4.5 15
    Shark 0.979 0.626 0.811
    Mackerel (king) 0.730 n/a n/a 4.5 14
    Tuna (bigeye) 0.689 0.341 0.560 Fresh/frozen 4.5 11
    Orange roughy 0.571 0.183 0.562 4.3 149
    Marlin * 0.485 0.237 0.390 4.5
    Mackerel (Spanish) 0.454 n/a n/a Gulf of Mexico 4.5 5
    Grouper 0.448 0.278 0.399 All species 4.2
    Tuna 0.391 0.266 0.340 All species, fresh/frozen
    Bluefish 0.368 0.221 0.305 4.5 9
    Sablefish 0.361 0.241 0.265 3.8 114
    Tuna (albacore) 0.358 0.138 0.360 Fresh/frozen 4.3 9
    Patagonian toothfish 0.354 0.299 0.303 AKA "Chilean Seabass" 4.0 50+[20]
    Tuna (yellowfin) 0.354 0.231 0.311 Fresh/frozen 4.3 9
    Tuna (albacore) 0.350 0.128 0.338 Canned 4.3 9
    Croaker white 0.287 0.069 0.280 Pacific 3.4
    Halibut 0.241 0.225 0.188 4.3
    Weakfish 0.235 0.216 0.157 Sea trout 3.8 17[21]
    Scorpionfish 0.233 0.139 0.181
    Mackerel (Spanish) 0.182 n/a n/a South Atlantic 4.5
    Monkfish 0.181 0.075 0.139 4.5 25
    Snapper 0.166 0.244 0.113
    Bass 0.152 0.201 0.084 Striped, black, and black sea 3.9
    Perch 0.150 0.112 0.146 Freshwater 4.0
    Tilefish (Atlantic) 0.144 0.122 0.099 3.6 35
    Tuna (skipjack) 0.144 0.119 0.150 Fresh/frozen 3.8 12
    Buffalofish 0.137 0.094 0.120
    skate 0.137 n/a n/a
    Tuna 0.128 0.135 0.078 All species, canned, light
    Perch (ocean) * 0.121 0.125 0.102
    Cod 0.111 0.152 0.066 3.9 22
    Carp 0.110 0.099 0.134
    Lobster (American) 0.107 0.076 0.086
    Sheephead (California) 0.093 0.059 0.088
    Lobster (spiny) 0.093 0.097 0.062
    Whitefish 0.089 0.084 0.067
    Mackerel (chub) 0.088 n/a n/a Pacific 3.1
    Herring 0.084 0.128 0.048 3.2 21
    Jacksmelt 0.081 0.103 0.050 3.1
    Hake 0.079 0.064 0.067 4.0
    Trout 0.071 0.141 0.025 Freshwater
    Crab 0.065 0.096 0.050 Blue, king and snow crab
    Butterfish 0.058 n/a n/a 3.5
    Flatfish * 0.056 0.045 0.050 Flounder, plaice and sole
    Haddock 0.055 0.033 0.049 Atlantic
    Whiting 0.051 0.030 0.052
    Mackerel (Atlantic) 0.050 n/a n/a
    Croaker (Atlantic) 0.065 0.050 0.061
    Mullet 0.050 0.078 0.014
    Shad (American) 0.039 0.045 0.045
    Crawfish 0.035 0.033 0.012
    Pollock 0.031 0.089 0.003
    Catfish 0.025 0.057 0.005 3.9 24
    Squid 0.023 0.022 0.016
    Salmon * 0.022 0.034 0.015 Fresh/frozen
    Anchovies 0.017 0.015 0.014 3.1
    Sardine 0.013 0.015 0.010 2.7

    Tilapia * 0.013 0.023 0.004
    Oyster 0.012 0.035 n/d
    Clam * 0.009 0.011 0.002
    Salmon * 0.008 0.017 n/d Canned
    Scallop 0.003 0.007 n/d
    Shrimp * 0.001 0.013 0.009 6.5[22]
    The widow is gathering nettles for her children's dinner; a perfumed seigneur, delicately lounging in the Oeil de Boeuf, hath an alchemy whereby he will extract the third nettle and call it rent. ~ Carlyle

  12. #23
    A Little to the Left Redsfaithful's Avatar
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    Hey Rojo, mind PMing me if you have any books or websites to recommend?

    I have tried low carb and can't seem to get through the headaches the first week or so.

    I'm in much better shape right now than I was 6 months ago. Lots of tennis and weight lifting, less running than in my previous weight loss efforts. The lifting really is the key I think, for myself. For whatever reason, my body responds to lifting much more than cardio (this may be true of lots of people I'm sure.) But I'm still a good 30 lbs overweight, and I'm so lazy with my diet. I'm actually ok with how I look and feel for the most part, and expect to like myself even more so long as I continue lifting, but I'd like to be lighter for tennis.

    I really consume too much sugar - if I cut that out alone I'd probably make significant gains. But it's a tough hill to climb for me.
    We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.
    --Oscar Wilde

  13. #24
    5.3 Posts Abv Replacement BluegrassRedleg's Avatar
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    Things definitely seem to be swinging back around to where sugar is considered the biggest enemy. But who knows anymore? The most frustrating part is how it's always changing every 5-10 years. I think the best advice is to just eat anything and everything in moderation and make sure you stay active.
    Rounding third and heading for home...

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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    Quote Originally Posted by Dom Heffner View Post
    All that fish just sounds like a lot of mercury....
    Seriously, though, I would get a mercury check with all of that intake. Most of those products are coming from the China Sea. You have a nice advantage on the East Coast as most of your Oysters come from the Louisiana oyster farms (while your sardines can come from the north Atlantic), but on the West Coast they are harder to get. We can get fresh, wild Steelhead from the local Indians that sell them on the side of the road if you're willing to drive 20 miles East of Portland. It wouldn't hurt though to know your personal mercury level, especially with that quantity of seafood intake. There's no way to avoid the mercury, but you can control your input level. It's very dangerous. Again, the "Paleo" is just a twist on the healthy effects of a Mediterranean diet so copy can be sold/downloaded. There's no such thing as a real paleo diet as the animals from then don't exist today. The concept is fine, but it's just another fad name that will fade with the rest. I'd rather call it what Rojo called it...foods your grandparents would eat.

    As stated above, diets should reflect the individual. Each person will have different mercury levels, thyroid levels, thyroid and liver abilities, age, genetic risks, exercise abilities and habits, etc.
    Last edited by Kingspoint; 06-17-2014 at 10:34 AM.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    Quote Originally Posted by BluegrassRedleg View Post
    Things definitely seem to be swinging back around to where sugar is considered the biggest enemy. But who knows anymore? The most frustrating part is how it's always changing every 5-10 years. I think the best advice is to just eat anything and everything in moderation and make sure you stay active.
    It's not that it's changing, but that more is being discovered on the positive and negative effects of health.

    People knew in Victorian times that calories in/calories out was the basic principle of weight control. That hasn't changed. I didn't need the studies that would come later that processed foods had a negative effect on health long before I entered High School. But, to have the physical knowledge of how cells are effected by every chemical that enters your body is an on-going science.

    A major concern to our health is the fracking going on in every state, Monsanto (Obama appointed former executives to head the U.S. Agricultural Department! ), GMO's (more information needed, while the UGA pays to ban our knowledge of food labeling), and population growth worldwide. All of this has a direct effect on the chemicals that enter your body. Do not trust the government, Democrats or Republicans as a whole, or corporations as a whole to have your health in their best interest. They have the opposite concerns...your health be damned for all they care.
    Last edited by Kingspoint; 06-17-2014 at 12:35 PM.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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  18. #27
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    I highly recommend Why We Get Fat by Gary Taubes.

    http://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Get-Fat.../dp/0307474259

    I lost 20 pounds in about 2 months by cutting out sugar and dialing way back on carbs.
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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    OlafTheBlack Dan's Avatar
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post
    2) How did science get it so wrong?

    There's a moral here too as to what's "settled science". This was "settled" 20-30 yrs ago and now trans fat is being banned in certain places. These articles don't even touch on what some doctors are saying such as Dr Perlmutter says in this book:
    http://www.drperlmutter.com/about/gr...id-perlmutter/
    So what you're saying is that he scientific method worked? A theory was known and accepted until evidence came along that didn't fit with the theory and a new theory was developed that offered a better understanding? Gee, why is that a bad thing?
    Sabermetrics is this: A batter's goal is to extend the inning. Extend enough innings and you're going to score runs. Extend more innings than your opponent and you're going to score more runs than him.

    Forget the rain. It's never an official game until the Reds piss away a run between third base and home plate. - Bluegrass Redleg

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  21. #29
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    ^^Redsfaithful. I started with Primal Blueprint by Mark Sisson. I mostly got into it because of his exercise advice. Per your experience he is dead set against what he calls "chronic cardio". All it does is lower your blood sugar, making you hungry again. He likes weights, a once-or-twice-a-week all out sprints (tennis probably has you covered there) and lots of walking. I walk about 15 miles a week and go to the gym once a week to lift weight (max load, slow) and do my sprints on a stationary bike.

    The difference between Sisson's Primal and Paleo, is that he's ok with dairy. Which is huge for me. I'm a dairy fiend. But he's against wheat, soy, corn and industrial seed oils.

    He's got a pretty good blog, with a forum, here: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/#axzz34v7zNz9G

    What I like about Sisson is that he's not afraid to change his mind.

    As to low carbs, you might try to refine your carbs. Many people find that there bodies handle white rice and potatoes fine. They're called safe-starches.

    On that note the Perfect Health Diet, puts a lof of emphasis on safe starches.
    The widow is gathering nettles for her children's dinner; a perfumed seigneur, delicately lounging in the Oeil de Boeuf, hath an alchemy whereby he will extract the third nettle and call it rent. ~ Carlyle

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  23. #30
    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: Changing Attitudes on Fat in Our Diet

    I really amped up the acrdio- I've always been a big guy due to all my weight lifting, but the problem I was having was that the increased workouts were creating increased appetite and I was just eating too much sugar.

    I get one Tortica de moran cookie on Friday night, the rest of the week is organic veggies, meat, fruit.

    It's been working, though I've hit a little bit of a wall stuck at the same weight for a bit, but it isn't going up, and my pants are falling off me. The weight lifting really makes the scale a dangerous tool to measure success by. I can barely fit into my shirts, just wish I could get rid of the last stubborn 10 pounds or so.
    I'm interested in jobs and you won't create jobs by forcing employers to pay their employees $9/hr- Sea Ray
    I'd say min wage should be about $9/hr - Sea Ray


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