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Thread: From What I have Heard

  1. #196
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    the way this offense is non existent, if i am a Cueto or Latos i want to go to a hitting team...

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  3. #197
    Just A Couple Johnny's OneManBand's Avatar
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Quote Originally Posted by mrherd05 View Post
    Hearing that the Reds will NOT be making moves for this season. Any move that is made will be made with 2015 in mind.

    Expect to possibly see Simon, and Broxton among the two people that are dealt for prospects.

    With the hopes of signing Latos and Cueto.
    @SeeAllHearAll - Twitter handle??

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  5. #198
    Pitching is the thing WVRedsFan's Avatar
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Oh, Gawd. Mr Thundering Herd is probably right. Here's a thought. Great pitching is wonderful unless you have hackers as hitters who can't score. And a bench that is so void of talent that they couldn't make the 1962 Mets. At least they had Gil Hodges.
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  6. #199
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRedsFan View Post
    Oh, Gawd. Mr Thundering Herd is probably right. Here's a thought. Great pitching is wonderful unless you have hackers as hitters who can't score. And a bench that is so void of talent that they couldn't make the 1962 Mets. At least they had Gil Hodges.
    The Reds pitching staff is tenth best in the NL ranked based upon FIP.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

  7. #200
    Member CrosleyField's Avatar
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    From What I have Heard

    In the long run, much rather have Frazier at 3rd. EE doesn't play 3rd anymore for Toronto either.
    Last edited by CrosleyField; 07-29-2014 at 06:18 AM. Reason: left off a word

  8. #201
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    EE is a craptastic defender and that's with him playing first. Juan Francisco is a better option at third for the Jays...... Edwin is a DH.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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  10. #202
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Quote Originally Posted by gilpdawg View Post
    Summer deals are a dying breed. The days of getting a true impact guy in season are getting scarce. Teams are just too scared to pull the trigger. I bet TB keeps Price. (And given their hot streak and the crappiness of that division, they probably should) I bet the Phillies don't trade any of their veterans. I think it's going to be a dead trade deadline week.
    Well, I guess I should admit that I was wrong about that one.
    numbersinthereds.blogspot.com I actually made a post on 10/17/14. I promise.

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  12. #203
    I don't want to grow up Red Raindog's Avatar
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Quote Originally Posted by gilpdawg View Post
    Well, I guess I should admit that I was wrong about that one.
    buy the next round and all will be forgotten
    The older I get - the better I was

    and yes - I hate the Cardinals (Reds fan since 1958)

  13. #204
    I don't want to grow up Red Raindog's Avatar
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Giving this one a bump -- got to admit the OP was closer to right than wrong --- shrug -- YMMV
    The older I get - the better I was

    and yes - I hate the Cardinals (Reds fan since 1958)

  14. #205
    Member NebraskaRed's Avatar
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Raindog View Post
    Giving this one a bump -- got to admit the OP was closer to right than wrong --- shrug -- YMMV
    OP said that Broxton and Simon would be dealt for prospects. And that the hope was to sign Cueto and Latos. Latos was "dangled".

    So, not really.

  15. #206
    I don't want to grow up Red Raindog's Avatar
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Quote Originally Posted by NebraskaRed View Post
    OP said that Broxton and Simon would be dealt for prospects. And that the hope was to sign Cueto and Latos. Latos was "dangled".

    So, not really.
    actually he hedged that by saying:

    Expect to possibly see Simon, and Broxton among the two people that are dealt for prospects.
    The older I get - the better I was

    and yes - I hate the Cardinals (Reds fan since 1958)

  16. #207
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Raindog View Post
    actually he hedged that by saying:

    Expect to possibly see Simon, and Broxton among the two people that are dealt for prospects.
    Inside sources hedged?
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  17. #208
    I don't want to grow up Red Raindog's Avatar
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    Inside sources hedged?
    you can hedge future interest rates -- why not baseball info?

    The older I get - the better I was

    and yes - I hate the Cardinals (Reds fan since 1958)

  18. #209
    Stat Wanker Hodiernus RedsManRick's Avatar
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    Re: From What I have Heard

    Quote Originally Posted by AtomicDumpling View Post
    That is quite a stretch and a weak attempt to downplay the amazing things Encarnacion has accomplished since the Reds gave up on him. He has clearly been one of the best hitters in the league at a bargain salary for Toronto. Jose Bautista is the reason why Encarnacion is a good hitter? Come on! Encarnacion was already a good young hitter in Cincinnati and his future was very promising. The Reds just simply gave up on him way too early. They failed to develop him properly. They let him get away and he flourishes for another team. It is pretty obvious to everyone outside of Cincinnati that the Reds screwed up. But here we are too stubborn to admit the truth. The "can't play defense" angle has been blown entirely out of proportion as well. Encarnacion had a very inaccurate arm while playing third base and that led to a lot of throwing errors in Cincinnati, but his athleticism isn't poor. He could cover some ground. He had what it takes to play at least an adequate first base or left field in the major leagues but in Toronto they have the luxury of the DH and plenty of good defensive players to cover the positions, so EE is the DH because they can -- not because he can't play anywhere else. The Reds were playing him out of position. In retrospect they should have moved him to left field after the Adam Dunn salary purge and let EE do what he does best -- hit the baseball hard. But Jocketty wanted his former Cardinal third baseman badly and made a big mistake. At the time of the trade it looked like it was a good deal for the Reds. I thought it was a good deal, but I was wrong. In hindsight it was clearly a very bad deal for the Reds. The Reds won the right to drastically overpay a broken down Rolen at the very end of his career. The Blue Jays ended up with an elite hitter at a bargain price. Clear win for the Blue Jays in the end when all is said and done. The Reds gave up on a future star way too early and he went on to greatness with another team. I am man enough to admit we were wrong about Edwin Encarnacion. Might as well admit what is obvious to everyone else around the league. How many seasons with a 140 to 160 OPS+ and wRC+ does a guy have to produce before Reds fans admit they were wrong about Edwin Encarnacion? The stubbornness is getting comical at this point. History is clearly on my side of this discussion so I will just leave it at that.
    Code:
    Years	   Team		AVG	OBP	SLG	wRC+
    2005-09	   Reds		.262	.345	.449	104
    2009-11    Blue Jays	.257	.320	.461	108
    2012-14    Blue Jays	.276	.375	.556	150
    During his 4.5 years with the Reds (2008 PA), EE was a slightly better than league average hitter.

    During his first 2.5 years with the Blue Jays (1070 PA), EE was a slightly better than league average hitter.

    During his last 2.5 years with the Blue Jays (1640 PA), EE has been an MVP caliber hitter.

    It took the Jays more than two full seasons to develop EE in to a monster hitter. Were the Reds "wrong" about EE? Sure, I guess, in the sense that he eventually became a 150 wRC+ hitter. That it took him more than two years to do so as a Jay suggests it wasn't just an issue of the Reds holding him back.

    But the bottom line is this: Had the Reds kept EE and he developed exactly as he has, he would have hit FA before he figured it out. The trade did not cost the Reds the 150 wRC+ version of EE. Even if you think he could have played LF*, your story of the Reds screwing up big time still ignores this reality. Now, if you want to invent a world where EE becomes a 150 wRC+ hitter at age 25 if only the team had developed him better, I won't take that from you. But that's a wholly different argument than the critique of the trade itself -- keeping a player you can't develop simply because he's got more talent in him than he's shown does your team no good.

    (*I think he may have been able to as well, but I know lateral quickness and foot-speed are not the same thing. Teams don't generally DH guys that can play a position capably. And if he's a below average defender in LF...)
    Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

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