Yu Darvish clears waivers? Seriously?

[swaisuc]

Just curious, what does the acquisition of Darvish look like in the eyes of those disappointed that Walt didn't make a claim?

In other words, what does the calculus you're using look like?

It's a crazy long shot, but I guess I will take a stab.

95% they pull him back and don't even take calls because Darvish is their horse and on a crazy cheap contract.
3% they ask for a big minor league return and we pass
1% they let him go. It's stupid, but the Rangers are an absolute dumpster fire out of nowhere. It's possible they're trying to get out from money any way they can.
1% they ask for a mid-level prospect to start gutting their terrible team and we make a deal

With all that said, I'm not THAT surprised Walt wouldn't claim him. I'm way more surprised people in contention right now or people less stacked in pitching 2015-2016 didn't claim him.

[jojo]

It's a crazy long shot, but I guess I will take a stab.

95% they pull him back and don't even take calls because Darvish is their horse and on a crazy cheap contract.
3% they ask for a big minor league return and we pass
1% they let him go. It's stupid, but the Rangers are an absolute dumpster fire out of nowhere. It's possible they're trying to get out from money any way they can.
1% they ask for a mid-level prospect to start gutting their terrible team and we make a deal

With all that said, I'm not THAT surprised Walt wouldn't claim him. I'm way more surprised people in contention right now or people less stacked in pitching 2015-2016 didn't claim him.

If he is healthy, he would cost a lot and it would be complicated. There is zero chance the Rangers would give away something they could trade for a lot.

[kpresidente]

I guess we have different thresholds of what we consider "needlessly complicating our lives". Maybe I underestimate just how lazy people are.

This is how it might have gone down:

Walt (or any GM) sees Darvish is waived. Knowing the Rangers aren't letting him go for nothing, he calls up Jon Daniels:


Walt: Jon, I see you waived Darvish. What are you looking for, here?
Daniels: Your top 6 prospects.
Walt: No, thanks.


And so, knowing what the Rangers are asking, nobody puts out a claim. That doesn't mean nobody was interested, though.

[swaisuc]

If he is healthy, he would cost a lot and it would be complicated. There is zero chance the Rangers would give away something they could trade for a lot.

You're bouncing back and forth between saying their is risk of getting "stuck" with the contract and saying that there is no point in even discussing him because his trade value is obviously so high. That doesn't seem odd to you?

[REDREAD]

If he is healthy, he would cost a lot and it would be complicated. There is zero chance the Rangers would give away something they could trade for a lot.

Then why did the Rangers put him on waivers in the first place?
I know, it's common practice to put just about everyone on revocable waivers this time of year.

I can even see the argument that the Reds might not be a good fit.

But if I was a contender needing pitching, I would've claimed him and called the Rangers up and asked what theyw wanted to make the deal. Sure, a 0% chance the Rangers let him go for nothing.
But why let Darvish clear waivers and be available to other contenders (as apparently is the case now).

We can make the argument that it's a waste of time to claim him, the Rangers would just pull him back.. Yet the Rangers wasted time exposing him to waivers too.

I can buy the "Gentleman's agreement" type thing.. especially for a team like the Reds. Walt doesn't know if the Rangers are talking to another team about Darvish and he doesn't want to foul up their deal .. Maybe that was the case for all 29 GMs.. no one wanted to step on someone else's deal.

[TRF]

Actually, as much as it made sense for the Giants to throw in a claim, The Cubs make even more sense. They have the pieces to get a deal done and keep Soler, Baez and Alcantara. They'd have a nice trio of pitchers in Darvish, Arriteta and Hendricks.

Would make the NL Central awfully scary.

[jojo]

You're bouncing back and forth between saying their is risk of getting "stuck" with the contract and saying that there is no point in even discussing him because his trade value is obviously so high. That doesn't seem odd to you?

No. He is on the DL and there was no reason to claim him just to block somebody else. It's folly to suggest the Rangers would simply give him away unless there was tremendous risk in keeping him because of a health issue. If he is healthy, he'd be expensive and complicated to trade for in a arbitrarily short time frame and most certainly there is no way the Rangers would give him away.

What is odd given that simple, straightforward calculus would be someone suggesting 29 GMs were either lazy or less intelligent than the random internet poster for not claiming Yu.

[jojo]

Then why did the Rangers put him on waivers in the first place?

Because its a way to gauge trade value and possible gain insight into the upcoming free agent market. Knowledge is power and this powerful knowledge is free.

But if I was a contender needing pitching, I would've claimed him and called the Rangers up and asked what theyw wanted to make the deal. Sure, a 0% chance the Rangers let him go for nothing.
But why let Darvish clear waivers and be available to other contenders (as apparently is the case now).

Because its very unlikely a blockbuster would get worked out in the timeline afforded by waivers. It would be almost impossible to scout players.

We can make the argument that it's a waste of time to claim him, the Rangers would just pull him back.. Yet the Rangers wasted time exposing him to waivers too.

No they didn't. Now the Rngers could in theory talk to 29 GMs without arbitrary deadlines.

I can buy the "Gentleman's agreement" type thing.. especially for a team like the Reds. Walt doesn't k,now if the Rangers are talking to another team about Darvish and he doesn't want to foul up their deal .. Maybe that was the case for all 29 GMs.. no one wanted to step on someone else's deal.

People step on other people's deals all of the time. I think people are oversimplifying how complicated a deal involving a star player can be. If he's hurt, it's easy....stick Walt with him. If he's a commodity, why would you force yourself to take the best deal you could get within 48 hours?

[IslandRed]

The "gentleman's agreement" is closest to the truth, for what it's worth. Pretty much any player anyone would want goes on waivers in August. A GM that goes willy-nilly in putting in claims is going to find it very difficult to do business in the future -- not to mention impossible to ever get one of his guys through August waivers again.

Claims are still put in sometimes to block players from moving, but they're rifle shots (a specific player who is available and a likely trade target of a rival), not shotgun blasts.

[klw]

The "gentleman's agreement" is closest to the truth, for what it's worth. Pretty much any player anyone would want goes on waivers in August. A GM that goes willy-nilly in putting in claims is going to find it very difficult to do business in the future -- not to mention impossible to ever get one of his guys through August waivers again.

Claims are still put in sometimes to block players from moving, but they're rifle shots (a specific player who is available and a likely trade target of a rival), not shotgun blasts.

Wait there are Gentlemen's Agreements in Baseball?????? Next thing you will ell me there are unwritten rules to how the game is played.

An example of a GM's Gentlemen's Agreement was the GM's don't claim a player being released when it is done for them to sign in Japan. This was violated by Boston back in 03 in the Kevin Millar saga.
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/01/16/sp...-may-work.html

So the Boston Red Sox didn't get Bartolo Colón and they didn't get José Contreras. They didn't even get Edgardo Alfonzo or Jeff Kent. But they may wind up getting Kevin Millar, and if they do, they will have executed one of the cleverest initiatives of the off-season.
Then again, it may be one of the most underhanded in the eyes of other clubs.

With a move that went against the established gentlemen's agreement in such matters, the Red Sox intercepted Millar on his way from the Florida Marlins to Japan. They claimed Millar on waivers on Tuesday and will try to extricate him from a Japanese contract he signed.

Millar, a 31-year-old outfielder-first baseman, batted .306, hit 16 home runs and drove in 57 runs last season. Because he earned $1.05 million last season, the Marlins did not want to deal with salary arbitration with him. About half a dozen teams tried to trade for Millar, but the Marlins had another idea. They sold him to the Chunichi Dragons for $1.2 million, then signed outfielder Todd Hollandsworth for $1.5 million.

http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/news/ar...=.jsp&c_id=bos

This complex and confusing matter began in January, when the Marlins gave Millar his unconditional release so he could sign with the Dragons.
Millar then had a change of heart about going to Japan.
Citing family pressure from his wife and father to remain in the United States because of a possible war with Iraq, Millar told a Chunichi official that he didn't want to be out of the U.S. this year.
The Red Sox, as was their right, claimed Millar off waivers on Jan. 14. For five days, they had negotiating rights with Millar. Though Millar ultimately rejected Boston's claim, the Sox were able to express their interest to Millar.