(ROY) Billy vs deGrom

[757690]

Concerning Mike Leake and LMAO moments it's kind of humorous to read you argue it's xFIP and not one of the best defenses in the majors that informs his ERA. Again it's another tell.

FIP and xFIP treat defense the same. So when one is better at predicting a pitcher's ERA, the team's defense has nothing to do with that difference. Double shenanigans on steroids to infinity and beyond and back again.

[jojo]

FIP and xFIP treat defense the same. So when one is better at predicting a pitcher's ERA, the team's defense has nothing to do with that difference. Double shenanigans on steroids to infinity and beyond and back again.

You're not allowed to jump the shark twice. That's not how it works. At this point it's crystal clear that you're arguing just to argue.

[Clacquam]

The higher the Z-Swing%, the better the plate discipline

[Billy Budd]

Messing with a players swing once he's reached the majors is always a bad idea.

Uggh I have read enough. They have been messing with his swing since he has been in the organization. Heck, the cat didn't even become a switch hitter until pro-ball.

Changing a swing in order to become more ground ball oriented is really not all that difficult.

It is really a question of a few things
1.Where you position your hands at the beginning of the swing, then where they go during the launch position, and then where your hands finish at the end of the swing. (essentially you can track your swing path through there. ) In order to level off, your hands should finish lower than your shoulders (on most pitches).

2. He is now constantly being taught to focus on hitting middle to top half of the ball, and I would also guess that they are focusing on top half of the ball opposite field. Now, this is trick, because if you have ever worked on hitting the ball the opposite field (and this is explained in the Science of Hitting) the tendancy for most balls to the opposite field are fly balls. So, to hit line drives and groundballs to the opposite field will take a TREMENDOUS amount of work.

I have faith in Hamilton. I think the kid was probably EXHAUSTED by July, and as he grows older, and learns the game, his game will get better.

[757690]

Uggh I have read enough. They have been messing with his swing since he has been in the organization. Heck, the cat didn't even become a switch hitter until pro-ball.

Changing a swing in order to become more ground ball oriented is really not all that difficult.

It is really a question of a few things
1.Where you position your hands at the beginning of the swing, then where they go during the launch position, and then where your hands finish at the end of the swing. (essentially you can track your swing path through there. ) In order to level off, your hands should finish lower than your shoulders (on most pitches).

2. He is now constantly being taught to focus on hitting middle to top half of the ball, and I would also guess that they are focusing on top half of the ball opposite field. Now, this is trick, because if you have ever worked on hitting the ball the opposite field (and this is explained in the Science of Hitting) the tendancy for most balls to the opposite field are fly balls. So, to hit line drives and groundballs to the opposite field will take a TREMENDOUS amount of work.

I have faith in Hamilton. I think the kid was probably EXHAUSTED by July, and as he grows older, and learns the game, his game will get better.

That's very insightful stuff, thanks. The funny thing is that pretty much everything you wrote backs up my argument that they shouldn't make Hamilton change his swing at this point.

As I said, it's not smart to change a players swing once he's in the bigs. The minors is the time to adjust and develop a players swing. As you said, it's very difficult and takes a lot of time and work. That's great in the minors when results don't matter, but once a player is in the bigs, he can't afford to got though long dry spells as he figures out his new swing.

I agree with your last point, as he grows older and gains experience, his bat should improve some. There's no need to make major adjustments to his swing. Just let it keep developing.

[Billy Budd]

That's very insightful stuff, thanks. The funny thing is that pretty much everything you wrote backs up my argument that they shouldn't make Hamilton change his swing at this point.

As I said, it's not smart to change a players swing once he's in the bigs. The minors is the time to adjust and develop a players swing. As you said, it's very difficult and takes a lot of time and work. That's great in the minors when results don't matter, but once a player is in the bigs, he can't afford to got though long dry spells as he figures out his new swing.

I agree with your last point, as he grows older and gains experience, his bat should improve some. There's no need to make major adjustments to his swing. Just let it keep developing.

I was not saying that at all. He NEEDS to re-work and focus on re-vamping his swing. Players work on and change their swings ALL OF THE TIME. Heck, Sandoval changed his swing MID-SEASON. Ripken.... he changed his swing almost seemingly EVERY year. He is 24 years old. To suggest that he should not workl to change his swing, and settle for the stats he did.... that does NOT MAKE SENSE.

[757690]

I was not saying that at all. He NEEDS to re-work and focus on re-vamping his swing. Players work on and change their swings ALL OF THE TIME. Heck, Sandoval changed his swing MID-SEASON. Ripken.... he changed his swing almost seemingly EVERY year. He is 24 years old. To suggest that he should not workl to change his swing, and settle for the stats he did.... that does NOT MAKE SENSE.

You're conflating working on one's swing with changing it. Every hitter works on their swing and makes adjustments, it's a necessity for staying productive.

But what many are asking Hamilton to do is to change his swing, to alter the fundamentals of his swing, to become a different kind of hitter. It's very rare for a MLB hitter to accomplish this without going through an adjustment phase that hurts the major league team he's playing for.

[jojo]

You're conflating working on one's swing with changing it. Every hitter works on their swing and makes adjustments, it's a necessity for staying productive.

But what many are asking Hamilton to do is to change his swing, to alter the fundamentals of his swing, to become a different kind of hitter. It's very rare for a MLB hitter to accomplish this without going through an adjustment phase that hurts the major league team he's playing for.

You're really being pendantic and overreaching at the same time.

[Big Red Smokey]

deGrom won it, btw