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Thread: Serial

  1. #31
    Member NebraskaRed's Avatar
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    Re: Serial

    Quote Originally Posted by dabvu2498 View Post
    This week's episode was pretty worthless. I kinda wish they'd recorded it all ahead of time, so they wouldn't have to deal with the "distractions" that I'm sure they're getting now... Most of which seem to be leading down giant rabbit holes.
    While it wasn't the best episode by any means, it was a necessary one. They had to acknowledge the huge amount of attention the podcast has received, and the dozens (hundreds?) of people that have contacted her about Adnan. And it answer a pretty big question a lot of people had: Why hasn't he talked more about Jay?


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  3. #32
    MLB Baseball Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: Serial

    Quote Originally Posted by NebraskaRed View Post
    While it wasn't the best episode by any means, it was a necessary one. They had to acknowledge the huge amount of attention the podcast has received, and the dozens (hundreds?) of people that have contacted her about Adnan. And it answer a pretty big question a lot of people had: Why hasn't he talked more about Jay?
    I kind of agree with dab, I wish she had recorded them all ahead of time. Then you don't have to acknowledge the attention. This week almost seemed like she read straight from the reddit sub thread.
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  4. #33
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    Re: Serial

    Quote Originally Posted by Razor Shines View Post
    I kind of agree with dab, I wish she had recorded them all ahead of time. Then you don't have to acknowledge the attention. This week almost seemed like she read straight from the reddit sub thread.
    I see what you're saying, but it is called Serial, and it is meant to be produced once a week as it goes on. Charles Dickens used to serialize his novels, and they were absolutely influenced by the public's reaction to each installment.

  5. #34
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    Re: Serial

    Thing is, none of the reactions she's getting are actually worth anything. Either she can't substantiate them or it's "Adnan has it in him to do murder because he used to steal from the collection plate. But, oh yeah... So did I. And while we're at it, could you not use my real name or voice, please." And an expert that can't actually speak with the subject.

    As great as her story-telling ability is, SK has wasted a lot of time on stuff that doesn't matter a bit and not gone down some avenues that could have produced some answers. (She had some talkative jury members that we barely heard from... If you really want to know why he was found guilty, dig deep into that hole. Because I'm fairly sure there would have been a pay phone somewhere within walking distance of that Best Buy.)
    When all is said and done more is said than done.

  6. #35
    MLB Baseball Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: Serial

    Quote Originally Posted by dabvu2498 View Post
    Thing is, none of the reactions she's getting are actually worth anything. Either she can't substantiate them or it's "Adnan has it in him to do murder because he used to steal from the collection plate. But, oh yeah... So did I. And while we're at it, could you not use my real name or voice, please." And an expert that can't actually speak with the subject.

    As great as her story-telling ability is, SK has wasted a lot of time on stuff that doesn't matter a bit and not gone down some avenues that could have produced some answers. (She had some talkative jury members that we barely heard from... If you really want to know why he was found guilty, dig deep into that hole. Because I'm fairly sure there would have been a pay phone somewhere within walking distance of that Best Buy.)
    The thing that has always stuck with me about the pay phone is what Adnan said about it....which is nothing. He said something along the lines of "they say I killed her and then went into the Best Buy lobby and called Jay...." Maybe it's nothing but using one of the store phones always made more sense to me. If he had used a store phone maybe there would have been an employee that remembered seeing him but also maybe not.
    "I know a lot about the law and various other lawyerings."

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  7. #36
    Member Big Red Smokey's Avatar
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    Re: Serial

    Just listened to the Finale. Not gonna spoil anything but it ended up about as I expected.

  8. #37
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    Re: Serial

    I loved this, from Reddit: "Next time someone wrecks my theory, I'm just going to say 'Big picture, big picture.'"
    When all is said and done more is said than done.

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  10. #38
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    Re: Serial

    I can't stand listening to jurors. So many people are idiots. So are public attorneys as far as I can tell. Reasonable doubt should not be hard to argue, especially in a case like this. I served on an attempted murder trial one summer while in college that ended up being a hung jury because 3 of the jurors couldn't get past reasonable doubt in a case where one guy admitted to shooting the other one*. They thought reasonable doubt meant anything short of video, DNA, or a confession wasn't enough. Then you have a case like this where there are massive amounts of doubt and a guy goes away for the rest of his life. Crazy.

    As for the case at hand, I think that Jay was involved in other shady business and that somebody he knew killed Hae while he was borrowing Adnan's car. The actual killer was a dangerous dude and threatened Jay's life if Jay didn't help him cover it up. Given that it was Adnan's car and Adnan's relationship with Hae, it was a no-brainer. The cops just wanted a conviction and saw Jay as their path to an easy conviction. In any event, I can't believe Adnan was found guilty. Even if you think he's the most likely killer, there's no way that the evidence crossed the line of reasonable doubt.

    [I]*Two drug dealers who lived a few blocks away from each other in north Minneapolis had an ongoing beef. Guy #1 was driving his car down the road past Guy #2's house. Guy #2, sitting on his stoop, thought Guy #1 was driving too slowly and was going to pull a drive-by. So he shot first in "self-defense", firing 3 times and hitting Guy #1 one twice. Guy #1 gets hit in the hand (through the windshield) and in the back (through the back-door). Guy #2 claims that he was just trying to scare him, not kill him. I literally do the math during deliberations showing that Guy #2 took his time to carefully aim as the car slowly drove by (~2 seconds between each shot). Other jurors say that maybe he was just trying to scare him and refuse to convict.
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  12. #39
    MLB Baseball Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: Serial

    Quote Originally Posted by dabvu2498 View Post
    I loved this, from Reddit: "Next time someone wrecks my theory, I'm just going to say 'Big picture, big picture.'"
    Right. I'm sorry, Adnan admits he was with Jay a lot of that day. That Jay knew where the car was needs an explanation if you think Adnan is innocent.
    "I know a lot about the law and various other lawyerings."

    Hitters who avoid outs are the funnest.

  13. #40
    MLB Baseball Razor Shines's Avatar
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    Re: Serial

    As to Rick's post, I agree that I would still have doubt and I don't think that I could find him guilty. At the same I just don't buy a conspiracy and cover up.
    "I know a lot about the law and various other lawyerings."

    Hitters who avoid outs are the funnest.

  14. #41
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    Re: Serial

    I have a hard time questioning a jury based on 12 podcasts. Let's be honest... Koenig and staff spent more man-hours chasing down the allegedly location of a pay-phone than 12 people spent in a jury box.

    Also, Rick, there are tons of great PD's. If you want a media example, watch "Murder on a Sunday Morning." That dude is a lawyer. (Plus it'll give you a nice, tingly feeling about cops and prosecutors.)

    When all is said and done more is said than done.

  15. #42
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    Re: Serial

    Quote Originally Posted by Razor Shines View Post
    Right. I'm sorry, Adnan admits he was with Jay a lot of that day. That Jay knew where the car was needs an explanation if you think Adnan is innocent.
    She "wins" if she gets them to do the DNA tests, though. I wonder how low the bar is for her to achieve that.
    When all is said and done more is said than done.

  16. #43
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    Re: Serial

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    When all is said and done more is said than done.

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  18. #44
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    Re: Serial

    I thought it was a pretty solid wrap up episode. I wonder if anything big in the case happens if they will do an update or something.

    I agree with her assesement that everyone is lying. The story as told is not what happened.

  19. #45
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    Re: Serial

    Quote Originally Posted by RedsManRick View Post
    I can't stand listening to jurors. So many people are idiots. So are public attorneys as far as I can tell. Reasonable doubt should not be hard to argue, especially in a case like this. I served on an attempted murder trial one summer while in college that ended up being a hung jury because 3 of the jurors couldn't get past reasonable doubt in a case where one guy admitted to shooting the other one*. They thought reasonable doubt meant anything short of video, DNA, or a confession wasn't enough. Then you have a case like this where there are massive amounts of doubt and a guy goes away for the rest of his life. Crazy.

    As for the case at hand, I think that Jay was involved in other shady business and that somebody he knew killed Hae while he was borrowing Adnan's car. The actual killer was a dangerous dude and threatened Jay's life if Jay didn't help him cover it up. Given that it was Adnan's car and Adnan's relationship with Hae, it was a no-brainer. The cops just wanted a conviction and saw Jay as their path to an easy conviction. In any event, I can't believe Adnan was found guilty. Even if you think he's the most likely killer, there's no way that the evidence crossed the line of reasonable doubt.

    [I]*Two drug dealers who lived a few blocks away from each other in north Minneapolis had an ongoing beef. Guy #1 was driving his car down the road past Guy #2's house. Guy #2, sitting on his stoop, thought Guy #1 was driving too slowly and was going to pull a drive-by. So he shot first in "self-defense", firing 3 times and hitting Guy #1 one twice. Guy #1 gets hit in the hand (through the windshield) and in the back (through the back-door). Guy #2 claims that he was just trying to scare him, not kill him. I literally do the math during deliberations showing that Guy #2 took his time to carefully aim as the car slowly drove by (~2 seconds between each shot). Other jurors say that maybe he was just trying to scare him and refuse to convict.
    I have sympathy for jurors in this regard -- very few people are excited by jury duty, and the method by which evidence is presented to them in a trial is just horrendously backwards. Thanks to the rules of evidence, jurors are forced to hear cases in disjointed pieces and often don't get the "full" story on a case. It's tough to keep testimony straight for days and days, especially when no transcripts are provided at the end.

    And you're wrong on public attorneys. There are tons of very well respected attorneys who take appointments as "public defenders," and nowadays it's rare to have homicide cases defended by inexperienced/incompetent counsel.
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