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Thread: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    First, good luck finding someone who'd trade much value for Okafor. That guy seems like the demon seed of Joe Barry Carroll.

    Second, Philly does have the Lakers' 1st round pick next year and Sacto's in 2019.

    Third, still got to figure a Covington or a Saric would need to be in there.
    Saric and Covington are great building blocks for the Sixers and seem to balance out their other centerpieces. But, if it means getting Fultz, and they see him as that much of a difference-maker over Fox, then sure. Boston could use either player.
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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    Saric and Covington are great building blocks for the Sixers and seem to balance out their other centerpieces. But, if it means getting Fultz, and they see him as that much of a difference-maker over Fox, then sure. Boston could use either player.
    Nah. The Sixers shouldn't be giving up Saric, in particular, to move up two slots. Covington is less important but if either is the price along and picks (plural), you either stay put and take either Jackson or Ball OR move down by trying to entice the Kings to move their 5th and 10th slot picks for the Sixers 3rd (and maybe and maybe an early 2nd rounder or two); which leaves you with a huge number of options. Fultz is very good, but he's not a "generational" level talent. Boston wouldn't be open to dealing the top pick if he were.
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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by SteelSD View Post
    Nah. The Sixers shouldn't be giving up Saric, in particular, to move up two slots. Covington is less important but if either is the price along and picks (plural), you either stay put and take either Jackson or Ball OR move down by trying to entice the Kings to move their 5th and 10th slot picks for the Sixers 3rd (and maybe and maybe an early 2nd rounder or two); which leaves you with a huge number of options. Fultz is very good, but he's not a "generational" level talent. Boston wouldn't be open to dealing the top pick if he were.
    Again, this is all speculation at this point, but if the Celtics can trade for Butler with picks acquired from Philly, they likely would be open to dealing the pick.

    My guess is that Okafor and picks go to Boston, with Okafor and another player (Crowder?) from Boston and picks (Brooklyn's '18 and Sacramento's '19) sent to Chicago for Butler.
    That way, Boston can draft Jackson or Tatum at #3, while adding Butler.

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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by Revering4Blue View Post
    Again, this is all speculation at this point, but if the Celtics can trade for Butler with picks acquired from Philly, they likely would be open to dealing the pick.

    My guess is that Okafor and picks go to Boston, with Okafor and another player (Crowder?) from Boston and picks (Brooklyn's '18 and Sacramento's '19) sent to Chicago for Butler.
    That way, Boston can draft Jackson or Tatum at #3, while adding Butler.
    The Okafor hot potato is an interesting idea. It would be great if the Bulls then moved him onto somebody else. Keeping this year's #3 and taking Jackson also would be a nice touch for the Celtics.

    Here's a question, because I can't begin to decipher NBA salary caps, is there any way the Celtics can make that deal and add Blake Griffin?
    Wait until the year after next year.

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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by M2 View Post
    The Okafor hot potato is an interesting idea. It would be great if the Bulls then moved him onto somebody else. Keeping this year's #3 and taking Jackson also would be a nice touch for the Celtics.

    Here's a question, because I can't begin to decipher NBA salary caps, is there any way the Celtics can make that deal and add Blake Griffin?
    I honestly don't know. They could renounce the rights to Non-guaranteed salary, Restricted Free Agents, Unrestricted Free Agents (listed as "Cap Holds") Note: Cap holds Yabousele and Zizic aren't Free Agents, but they could keep them overseas so as not to count against the cap.

    https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2017/06/...n-celtics.html

    Okafor is a Chicago kid and, apparently, the Bulls organization is still high on him. Plus, they only have two bigs under contract after June 30.
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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by Revering4Blue View Post
    Exactly the same roster with a 56 year old Richard Jefferson as their most consistent bench player? Really?

    The proof is in the pudding that whenever LeBron rests, they get killed and that MUST be addressed, as he's logging way too many minutes. How is that addressed without revamping the roster? Simple answer: it doesn't get addressed. Now, I suppose Lue could start Shumpert with Smith accepting a role as 6th man, as well as the youngsters Felder, Osman and Taveras assuming prominent roles. And, they could buy their way into the second round in this deep draft, as well as Lue actually re-acquainting himself with the fact that substantially paid Channing Frye is still a member of the Cavs bench, but they're all too iffy of propositions to take to the bank.

    Forget about defeating the Warriors for a minute, the argument for not revamping is based upon some forgone conclusion that the Celtics, Wizards et al are going to be exactly (or very close) to what they are right now.

    Even if they strike out with Hayward, Boston will improve via attrition (Fultz -- unless Ainge plays with fire by passing on him, Zizic -- rim protection, Yabusele and Nader, for example.) Plus, Ainge could nab another rim-protector (let's be honest, even with IT sidelined, lack of rim-protection was the deciding series factor) with his early second rounder or sign one via free agency.

    Washington, too -- with a bench, weak as it was, still considerably stronger than Cleveland's (damning with faint praise, I know) -- could make the jump, as well. Whomever Irving guards (Wall or Beal) will absolutely torch him. Ignore, Milwaukee at your own risk, too.

    Or, the status quo can resume, along with the hope that each and every team that you play on the road to the Finals --- and, to be fair, the Warriors also benefited greatly from this --- is missing a key player or two and hope that your Eastern Rivals don't improve exponentially either from within and (or) new elements.
    I suppose I shouldn't have used the word exactly, but the core of the team. There are like 30 Richard Jefferson's in the league, guys like him are very replaceable.

    I acknowledged that the East teams could and likely will get better and I maintain that no matter what they do none of them can beat Cleveland in a 7 game series.

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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by Revering4Blue View Post
    Again, this is all speculation at this point, but if the Celtics can trade for Butler with picks acquired from Philly, they likely would be open to dealing the pick.

    My guess is that Okafor and picks go to Boston, with Okafor and another player (Crowder?) from Boston and picks (Brooklyn's '18 and Sacramento's '19) sent to Chicago for Butler.
    That way, Boston can draft Jackson or Tatum at #3, while adding Butler.

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    Would any of this interfere with offering and signing Griffin to a max contract? If so, then the timing just has to occur after Griffin signs.

    Boston is going to be very scary next season as their options are unlimited. Ainge also won't make the same mistake he admitted he made last season...not pulling the trigger on an obviously great offer.

    Tatum seems like an Ainge type of pick.
    Last edited by Kingspoint; 06-17-2017 at 02:21 AM.
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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    OK. I just read M2's post on Griffin. Obviously our minds went right to the question that needed to be asked.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Predicting what the Bulls will do is as difficult as predicting the REDS Starting Five from month to month.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    Would any of this interfere with offering and signing Griffin to a max contract? If so, then the timing just has to occur after Griffin signs.

    Boston is going to be very scary next season.

    Tatum seems like an Ainge type of pick.
    I'm not sure, but internet scuttlebut, FWIW, suggests that the Celtics could trade for Butler and add Hayward. However, this article refutes that:

    https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2017/06/...n-celtics.html
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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by Revering4Blue View Post
    I'm not sure, but internet scuttlebut, FWIW, suggests that the Celtics could trade for Butler and add Hayward. However, this article refutes that:

    https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2017/06/...n-celtics.html
    I'm thinking that they could sign their max free agent first and then trade for Butler. They could send Horford if they had to just to make contracts work.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    It's interesting that the Nuggets and Blazers have the exact same needs....Backup Center, Stretch-4 and Wing Scorer. You could add that the Nuggets need a better PG, but the Blazers only PG is Napier, as Lillard and C.J. leave a lot to be desired as PG's, though Lillard keeps improving (which is why they are better with a playmaker like Turner out there, though Lillard or C.J should be on the bench while Turner is out there...same situation with Smart/Thomas/Bradley because of Defense).
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    There's always a chance that the interest in trading for Butler now from either the Boston or Chicago angle may be overstated. Perhaps Ainge is imterested in drafting Tatum or Jackson at #3, while maintaining a chance of two picks in the Top Ten next year.

    Anyway, I'd target Millsap as a PF instead of Griffin, as Millsap can both stretch the floor and defend, and, well neither are Griffin's forte.
    Last edited by Revering4Blue; 06-17-2017 at 03:09 AM.
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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by Revering4Blue View Post
    I'm not sure, but internet scuttlebut, FWIW, suggests that the Celtics could trade for Butler and add Hayward. However, this article refutes that:

    https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2017/06/...n-celtics.html
    Hoops Hype didn't take into account that the draft picks' salaries don't count against the cap until some time between Free Agency and the start of the season. So, Boston has not $27M, but $33M. They can do a Max contract, then trade for Butler or George, and then maneuver the roster to fit in what they drafted. Ainge will be playing golf every morning in Las Vegas during Summer League. He's a little more relaxed at that point and the max contract should be on the books by then. Will be interesting to see his interviews then. Butler (or George) could be a Celtic by then, too.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: 2017-18 NBA Season..."Closing the gap on the Warriors"

    Quote Originally Posted by BuckeyeRed27 View Post
    I suppose I shouldn't have used the word exactly, but the core of the team. There are like 30 Richard Jefferson's in the league, guys like him are very replaceable.

    I acknowledged that the East teams could and likely will get better and I maintain that no matter what they do none of them can beat Cleveland in a 7 game series.
    Gotcha.

    Granted, it won't be easy, but It is certainly within the realm of possibility to improve the bench without breaking up the core. We'll see.
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