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Thread: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

  1. #16
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by Hillsdale87 View Post
    I just have a hard time understanding a player being suspended by the NFL for a significant period of time when he's not convicted of a crime. 1 or 2 games with questionable evidence is one thing, but a suspension of 40% of the season based on evidence that was not even strong enough to bring to trial seems crazy.

    What I don't understand is why the NFL doesn't have a clear process in place for this. The easy thing, and what makes the most sense, is to base suspensions on what the justice system rules, as opposed to the NFL's investigative team, which has proven to be questionable. Also, why would the NFL have a team of investigators looking into criminal matters?!

    If the NFL wants to be tough on domestic violence, great. Make the suspension 1 season if a player is convicted. No suspension if a player is not convicted. That's pretty cut and dry with a clear standard that also levies a very strong penalty.
    We can use the O.J. example of not being convicted of a crime even though everyone believes he's guilty. There are tons of examples of regular people - not just athletes - not being convicted of domestic violence because the charges were dropped - usually by the victim. Doesn't mean they didn't do it. It just means they weren't convicted of it. Let's say someone like Odell Beckham, Jr. got into a fight at a club and was charged with assault. He could "persuade" the victim to drop the charges by writing him a big check. To go to an extreme, there are plenty of examples where someone like an organized crime figure killed or had someone killed or beaten up and the victims and/or witnesses won't come forward for fear of their lives. They weren't convicted but they did it - or had someone do it for them. The NFL could use your example and only punish someone if they were convicted or just not punish anyone for off the field incidents but I'm guessing the general public and their advertisers wouldn't stand for it and would be demanding a suspension for any illegal acts even if the player(s) weren't convicted.

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    I guess he could have suspended Mixon if he wanted, but its not something the NFL wants to fight. Suspending someone for something that happened prior to employment, was punished by both the courts an his college team, that would have been challenged in court, and probably lost by the NFL.

    Rice's suspension set a precedent until the NFL instituted a new policy so it is no longer a precedent. Brown wasn't suspended for longer because his actions happened long before the Rice incident.
    I'm sure Goodell wouldn't suspend anyone for something that happened in college but my point was that he could. He might lose in court but is it a fight worth fighting? Brady fought it because he has tons of money and could hire the best attorneys to contest the charges. Someone like Mixon doesn't have money. Perhaps an attorney would do it pro bono but Mixon would probably realize that it isn't worth fighting.
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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Zeke has gotten himself into a lot of odd and questionable situations in a short amount of time and he is a rising star in the league. The suspension was probably 6 games in order to send a message to Zeke as much as anything else. NFL doesn't want that type of publicity especially when it comes to one of their stars. Hopefully he will take the lesson to heart whether the suspension was entirely justified or not.

  4. #18
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    I'm sure Goodell wouldn't suspend anyone for something that happened in college but my point was that he could. He might lose in court but is it a fight worth fighting? Brady fought it because he has tons of money and could hire the best attorneys to contest the charges. Someone like Mixon doesn't have money. Perhaps an attorney would do it pro bono but Mixon would probably realize that it isn't worth fighting.
    He could, and there would be a lot of money thrown into Mixon's fight. I would imagine the players union would put up a huge fight if a member got suspended for something he did prior to becoming a member. They wouldn't want that precedent set.

    To me it with Zeke it boils down to this. The NFL has a 6 game minimum suspension on anything domestic violence related. They have evidence that shows some form DV committed by Zeke which "allows" them to use this stipulation in the contract. Had the NFL suspended him for two games or one game acknowledging that there was some form of DV that they found, the 6 game minimum suspension would hold no water anymore. This will be appealed and challenged in court, but I think Zeke has a big uphill battle in front of him. He signed a contract with the NFL under the knowledge that they had this policy in place. I have not read the contract but would imagine they do not need a DV conviction in order to suspend a player. I think the NFL is too smart to do that.

  5. #19
    We are back! Assembly Hall's Avatar
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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Chip hit the nail on the head. Listen Zeke has a pattern of bad behavior. Where there is smoke there is fire. Chip alluded to the fact about people being bought off and he is right. If the commish has probable cause, so be it.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    Chip hit the nail on the head. Listen Zeke has a pattern of bad behavior. Where there is smoke there is fire. Chip alluded to the fact about people being bought off and he is right. If the commish has probable cause, so be it.
    A 6 game suspension for smoke?
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    A 6 game suspension for smoke?
    Are you his agent? If so please tell me the contract he signed.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    Are you his agent? If so please tell me the contract he signed.
    That's a strangely unprovoked low brow response....but still its not unnoticed that you refused to actually answer the question.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    That's a strangely unprovoked low brow response....but still its not unnoticed that you refused to actually answer the question.
    I did answer the God Damn question. You just refuse to understand it. You seem to not understand something......just because you don't get arrested doesn't mean you didn't do any wrong. Smoke my ass, he has a history. If you choose to ignore it, so be it. To be honest I have no dog in this fight. I am neither a Buckeye fan or a Cowboy fan. But the commish is the commish and the contracts are the contracts.
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    I did answer the God Damn question. You just refuse to understand it. You seem to not understand something......just because you don't get arrested doesn't mean you didn't do any wrong. Smoke my ass, he has a history. If you choose to ignore it, so be it. To be honest I have no dog in this fight. I am neither a Buckeye fan or a Cowboy fan. But the commish is the commish and the contracts are the contracts.
    And again, it's an open question whether the suspension is justified based upon the facts.

    I get you like to smoke. Which is fine for you. But if you're going to act like you have absolute truth and others aren't intelligent enough to understand your reality, then you probably ought to at least acknowledge that youre actually assuming a whole bunch and for some strange reason also acting like it's inconceivable that someone might ask if a 6 game suspension was actually justified.
    "This isnít stats vs scouts - this is stats and scouts working together, building an organization that blends the best of both worlds. This is the blueprint for how a baseball organization should be run. And, whether the baseball men of the 20th century like it or not, this is where baseball is going."---Dave Cameron, U.S.S. Mariner

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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Whatever happens with Elliott McFadden looks as healthy as I've ever seen him. It's easy to forget how strong he is. 16-20 carries and 4-5 catches will net him close to 100 yards every game Zeke is out. They have no LG and LT is average, but C-RG-RT is elite and they'll ride that advantage with McFadden, Morris and Hillman. Cooper Rush has already passed Kellen Moore on the depth chart Rush looks very poised and polished.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Dallas probably wins the Division again @ 10-6 or 11-5. Intra-Division will decide the outcome. Dallas has a very tough schedule.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    He could, and there would be a lot of money thrown into Mixon's fight. I would imagine the players union would put up a huge fight if a member got suspended for something he did prior to becoming a member. They wouldn't want that precedent set.

    To me it with Zeke it boils down to this. The NFL has a 6 game minimum suspension on anything domestic violence related. They have evidence that shows some form DV committed by Zeke which "allows" them to use this stipulation in the contract. Had the NFL suspended him for two games or one game acknowledging that there was some form of DV that they found, the 6 game minimum suspension would hold no water anymore. This will be appealed and challenged in court, but I think Zeke has a big uphill battle in front of him. He signed a contract with the NFL under the knowledge that they had this policy in place. I have not read the contract but would imagine they do not need a DV conviction in order to suspend a player. I think the NFL is too smart to do that.
    Yeah....Elliott would have to present some kind of evidence contrary to what's already ot there. That would be hard. The six game probably stands.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip R View Post
    To the NFL, facts don't matter. As long as there is suspicion of wrongdoing, there will be discipline.
    Yep. True to a degree. The fact that the legal system decided not to prosecute Eliot does not mean there isn't any evidence. From what I've read, those legal authorities in Columbus, due to "conflicting" testimony/evidence, made the decision not to prosecute because they couldn't prove him guilty without reasonable doubt.

    The NFL's "thresh-hold" is much lower, and they claim they had "photographic and digital evidence" that was substantial and persuasive enough to support a finding that Elliott engaged in physical violence multiple times in July 2016.

    http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/2...nded-six-games

    The NFL identified three incidents that caused injuries to the woman's face, neck, shoulders, arms, hands, wrists, hips and knees over the span of five days and cited photographic evidence of the injuries.

    Peter Harvey, the former attorney general for New Jersey who aided the NFL's investigation, said the league analyzed metadata related to the photographs and was able to determine the photos were taken on the date the woman said the violence occurred.
    Now is that the same "evidence" that those city prosecutors saw, yet decided it wasn't "persuasive" enough to get a conviction? Probably. But to the NFL it was persuasive enough to conclude he violated their personal conduct policy. They also said that Eliot, and his attorneys, did not present any evidence (facts) to refute that evidence other then to offer ""alternative theories" to how she may have sustained the injuries....

    "So while alternative theories are interesting, in my judgment they have to be supported by evidence, and that was lacking in this particular situation," Harvey said.
    IMO, the bottom-line is simply this .... this is another young "star" player that needs to get his act together and GROW UP. There are even those within the Cowboy's organization who have came forward and expressed concern about Eliot's lifestyle and choices he's making.
    Last edited by GAC; 08-15-2017 at 05:14 AM.
    "In my day you had musicians who experimented with drugs. Now it's druggies experimenting with music" - Alfred G Clark (circa 1972)

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  16. #29
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by GAC View Post
    Yep. True to a degree. The fact that the legal system decided not to prosecute Eliot does not mean there isn't any evidence. From what I've read, those legal authorities in Columbus, due to "conflicting" testimony/evidence, made the decision not to prosecute because they couldn't prove him guilty without reasonable doubt.
    I also think it would be difficult to get a conviction on a former tOSU player in Columbus. Not saying it's the only reason that he wasn't charged but I'm sure it factored into the decision.

    [The NFL's "thresh-hold" is much lower, and they claim they had "photographic and digital evidence" that was substantial and persuasive enough to support a finding that Elliott engaged in physical violence multiple times in July 2016.

    http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/2...nded-six-games

    Now is that the same "evidence" that those city prosecutors saw, yet decided it wasn't "persuasive" enough to get a conviction? Probably. But to the NFL it was persuasive enough to conclude he violated their personal conduct policy. They also said that Eliot, and his attorneys, did not present any evidence (facts) to refute that evidence other then to offer ""alternative theories" to how she may have sustained the injuries....

    IMO, the bottom-line is simply this .... this is another young "star" player that needs to get his act together and GROW UP. There are even those within the Cowboy's organization who have came forward and expressed concern about Eliot's lifestyle and choices he's making.
    You're right. However we also need to take into consideration that he's a 22-23 year old man. Some would even call him a kid. You give your average person in their early 20s fame and money and more often than not they are going to do stupid things. I know I did some things in my early 20s that made my parents tell me to "grow up." I imagine you've had some similar moments with your kids. Sometimes it takes the loss of your livelihood to wake you up and make you realize that you better get your act together. Fortunately for Elliot he has teammates that have been through it and hopefully can give him guidance on how to comport yourself as a famous athlete. He's at a crossroads now. He can choose the path where he is someone like Ladanian Tomlinson and be a HOF player or he can be someone like Ray Rice who had a nice career that ended when he decided to hit his girlfriend. The choice is up to him.
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    Potential Lunch Winner Dom Heffner's Avatar
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    Re: Ezekiel Elliot Suspended for Domestic Abuse

    Quote Originally Posted by jojo View Post
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but the facts concerning the allegations with Elliot seem to be in question though. Is this not correct?
    You are not correct. No, you are not.

    "There were over 100 exhibits to the investigation," Harvey said in a conference call with media Friday. "The investigative report exceeded 160 pages. We also reviewed, each of us individually, the submissions by Mr. Elliottís representative. We studied both; we examined very carefully the defense arguments, and we came to the conclusion Ė at least, I reached the conclusion individually Ė that Mr. Elliott engaged in physical force against Ms. Thompson, and that it caused injury."
    Furthermore:

    And while the Columbus prosecutor didnít believe he had enough evidence to pursue a case, the burden of proof for the NFL isnít as stringent as the court system. Still this case and investigation was bigger than ďhe said, she saidĒ.


    "Well it starts with Ďhe said,she saidí, which is why an investigation is conducted," Harvey said. "It became a lot more than Ďhe said,she saidí. For example, itís uncommon for women to take photographs of their injuries the day that they occurred. She did that. She sent those photographs to third parties. The examination of the meta-data in her phone revealed the date and time on which those photographs were taken. They were taken the same day as Ms. Thompson alleged she was injured by Mr. Elliott."

    "Also, there were third parties who observed injuries on her body and in real time, on the same day, she had a conversation with at least one of these persons about the injury and who caused it. In addition to that, the league brought in two medical experts who examined the photographs and offered expert opinions with respect to the timing of the injury. These medical experts corroborated many of the statements that Ms. Thompson made."
    http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/...166812367.html

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