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Thread: Secret of their success: get a SS

  1. #76
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by LoganBuck View Post
    Can't hitch that wagon to the horse until Senzel is kicking down the door.
    Which is probably September of next year.

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  3. #77
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Rojo pointed out the Astros. I'll raise him a Red Sox.
    The Astros who failed to sign the #1 overall pick? Those guys? Or the Astros who picked Mark Appel #1 overall the year before?

    Or are we talking the Red Sox who drated Rey Fuentes in the 1st round in 2009? Or The Red Sox who drafted and signed literally no one with a positive WAR from 2010, going with three first round picks of Kolbrin Vitek, Bryce Brentz and Anthony Ranaudo? Or maybe you mean the 2011 Red Sox who had four 1st round picks who picked Matt Barnes, Blake Swihart, Henry Owens and Jackie Bradley Jr. Maybe you meant the 2012 Red Sox who drafted Deven Marrero, Brian Johnson and Pat Light in the 1st round? Or maybe it was that 2013 Red Sox draft without a single player to reach the big leagues yet from their first 10 rounds. Their 2014 draft got Sam Travis there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kinsm View Post
    You don't have to have the best pitching staff in baseball to get away with 1 or 2 bad hitters.

    There is only one way to get this team back to being respectable, developing and signing better pitching.
    The 2012 Reds did have the best pitching staff in baseball, though. Which is why they won 97 games with a crappy hitting shortstop. If your offense is going to be mediocre, you need an elite pitching staff. And it's real hard to have a good offense with 2 really bad hitters in your every day lineup.
    Last edited by dougdirt; 11-04-2017 at 10:10 AM.

  4. #78
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Which is probably September of next year.
    How do you figure?

    With the recent similar prospects Bregman and Bryant they came up midway through the year after they were drafted. Senzel is already knocking down the door with a battering ram. If he isn’t up by May something is wrong.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by RedTeamGo! View Post
    How do you figure?

    With the recent similar prospects Bregman and Bryant they came up midway through the year after they were drafted. Senzel is already knocking down the door with a battering ram. If he isn’t up by May something is wrong.
    I was giving a conservative estimate, but May is a possibility too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    The Astros who failed to sign the #1 overall pick? Those guys? Or the Astros who picked Mark Appel #1 overall the year before?

    Or are we talking the Red Sox who drated Rey Fuentes in the 1st round in 2009? Or The Red Sox who drafted and signed literally no one with a positive WAR from 2010, going with three first round picks of Kolbrin Vitek, Bryce Brentz and Anthony Ranaudo? Or maybe you mean the 2011 Red Sox who had four 1st round picks who picked Matt Barnes, Blake Swihart, Henry Owens and Jackie Bradley Jr. Maybe you meant the 2012 Red Sox who drafted Deven Marrero, Brian Johnson and Pat Light in the 1st round? Or maybe it was that 2013 Red Sox draft without a single player to reach the big leagues yet from their first 10 rounds. Their 2014 draft got Sam Travis there.

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    The 2012 Reds did have the best pitching staff in baseball, though. Which is why they won 97 games with a crappy hitting shortstop. If your offense is going to be mediocre, you need an elite pitching staff. And it's real hard to have a good offense with 2 really bad hitters in your every day lineup.
    Yet somehow their system provides them with bats. I'm not saying they have to come from the first rounds.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    The Astros who failed to sign the #1 overall pick? Those guys? Or the Astros who picked Mark Appel #1 overall the year before?

    Or are we talking the Red Sox who drated Rey Fuentes in the 1st round in 2009? Or The Red Sox who drafted and signed literally no one with a positive WAR from 2010, going with three first round picks of Kolbrin Vitek, Bryce Brentz and Anthony Ranaudo? Or maybe you mean the 2011 Red Sox who had four 1st round picks who picked Matt Barnes, Blake Swihart, Henry Owens and Jackie Bradley Jr. Maybe you meant the 2012 Red Sox who drafted Deven Marrero, Brian Johnson and Pat Light in the 1st round? Or maybe it was that 2013 Red Sox draft without a single player to reach the big leagues yet from their first 10 rounds. Their 2014 draft got Sam Travis there.

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    The 2012 Reds did have the best pitching staff in baseball, though. Which is why they won 97 games with a crappy hitting shortstop. If your offense is going to be mediocre, you need an elite pitching staff. And it's real hard to have a good offense with 2 really bad hitters in your every day lineup.
    Yet somehow their system provides them with bats. I'm not saying they have to come from the first rounds.

  6. #80
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post

    Yet somehow their system provides them with bats. I'm not saying they have to come from the first rounds.
    You literally said teams with deep pockets draft can't miss guys all of the time. If they were can't miss, then they'd be first rounders, because, well, everyone would understand that they couldn't miss.

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  8. #81
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    Reds have their young 800+ ops shortstop on the roster, they just play him at third.
    I don't think there's a ton of resistance to this on this board, but like FCB said, it doesn't seem to be a move the organization wants to make.
    Freedom is not worth having if it does not include the freedom to make mistakes. -- Mahatma Gandhi

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  10. #82
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    You literally said teams with deep pockets draft can't miss guys all of the time. If they were can't miss, then they'd be first rounders, because, well, everyone would understand that they couldn't miss.
    Early round =/= can't miss.

    Maybe their scouts see a can't miss bat.

  11. #83
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by Z-Fly View Post
    For the ERA+ number, we should probably factor the DH in Offense and Defense, which would put the Reds further from the Astros pitching than it currently looks.
    I'm pretty sure (almost positive, in fact) ERA+ does take NL/AL factors into account.
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  12. #84
    Sprinkles are for winners dougdirt's Avatar
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    Early round =/= can't miss.

    Maybe their scouts see a can't miss bat.
    The Red Sox have missed a whole heck of a lot of bats, yet you cited them as "I'll RAISE them" to someone else.

    Drafting isn't easy. No one is great at it. The Reds are pretty good at it by comparison to baseball overall. Where Chris Buckley has struggled is drafting a super star. He's generally done quite well at picking big leaguers, which a whole lot of teams can't actually say.

  13. #85
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by dougdirt View Post
    The Red Sox have missed a whole heck of a lot of bats, yet you cited them as "I'll RAISE them" to someone else.

    Drafting isn't easy. No one is great at it. The Reds are pretty good at it by comparison to baseball overall. Where Chris Buckley has struggled is drafting a super star. He's generally done quite well at picking big leaguers, which a whole lot of teams can't actually say.
    Cubs and Yankees, despite massive payrolls, get tons from their minors as well.

    Reds have done better in their last couple of drafts and I'm sure we'll see improvement before too long. I think the Reds have a bigger player development problem than a drafting one.

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  15. #86
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    Re: Secret of their success: get a SS

    Quote Originally Posted by Falls City Beer View Post
    I think the Reds have a bigger player development problem than a drafting one.
    Completely agreed.
    Wanted: Big Red Mechanic

    Robert Stephenson should be cut. That's just unconscious knowledge.


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