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Thread: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

  1. #46
    Middle Class Rut TRF's Avatar
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    Re: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    I don't see what is being accomplished at this point with Reed. We can speculate from AAA numbers or we can actually see how he does in the bigs. Even out of the pen, Reds have suggested that at times.

    I'd just bring him up, stick him in the bullpen, and see if he still has the same tendencies as before. Or if there is genuine improvement.

    Mella should be at AAA, send him out and bring Reed up.
    gonna disagree here. If the Reds see him as a SP, then he needs starts. And he can get maybe 4 more at AAA. So let him. Get the innings in and have an eye on him as a SP in ST next year. He can be in the pen in September, or even get a spot start or 2.
    "There was like a softness to it, a glow to it. I felt... I felt warm."

    -- Joseph Daniel Votto 7/10/2017

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  4. #47
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    Re: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF View Post
    gonna disagree here. If the Reds see him as a SP, then he needs starts. And he can get maybe 4 more at AAA. So let him. Get the innings in and have an eye on him as a SP in ST next year. He can be in the pen in September, or even get a spot start or 2.
    It's a philosophical disagreement, others agree with you, I respect that.

    When a pitcher reaches AAA it should be a relatively brief stay. It's a place to get your feet wet, but it doesn't teach you to get major league hitters out. You need big league exposure for that.

    Stephenson has had 63 AAA outings, Reed 53. These guys need to face big league hitting. Whether it's starting or relief is less important than the level of competition.

    You say he needs innings. But innings against AAA bats is of limited utility. So I'd bring him up. And I would have brought up Stephenson sooner than the Reds did.

  5. #48
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    When a pitcher reaches AAA it should be a relatively brief stay.
    What is this based on, exactly?
    I dont care, Votto said of passing his friend and former teammate. Hes in the past. Bye-bye, Jay.

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  7. #49
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    Re: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    What is this based on, exactly?
    Watching the better pitchers develop. Luis Castillo, for example, didn't spend years at AAA. Not sure he pitched there at all.

    Also reading about scouting and the minor leagues. AAA is not the place to learn to pitch. AA is a much more important stop, or should be.

    I could turn the question around and ask for evidence that Robert Stephenson and Cody Reed -- with a combined 116 AAA outings -- are the norm. I don't think they are, not for successful starters.

    I guess I subscribe to the notion that there is no such thing as a pitching prospect. Once a guy gets to the upper minors, if he's going to start, he should be able to succeed without a gestation period at AAA of three or four years.
    Last edited by Kc61; 08-09-2018 at 04:15 PM.

  8. #50
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Once a guy gets to the upper minors, if he's going to start, he should be able to succeed without a gestation period at AAA of three or four years.
    Sure, but if you've pushed them too much, that can happen. Reed wasn't quite ready for the majors in 2016, a fact that seemed obvious even before his callup and definitely in the first few starts after it, and the Reds are paying the price for their stubbornness in keeping him there ever since. Stephenson is a different case but has the type of arm you simply don't give up on. Look at the early returns on Tyler Glasnow in Tampa.

    To me age is the great divider. And I wasn't sold on that at first, but I am now. The list of guys who are 24 and younger and are thriving as big league starters is slim. You're ready when you're ready, but for most guys who aren't Kershaw/Bumgarner freaks of nature it's later rather than sooner. If it takes a few seasons in AAA, so be it. Corey Kluber made some 50 starts in AAA before he finally stuck in the majors as a 26-year-old.
    I dont care, Votto said of passing his friend and former teammate. Hes in the past. Bye-bye, Jay.

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  10. #51
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    Re: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    Sure, but if you've pushed them too much, that can happen. Reed wasn't quite ready for the majors in 2016, a fact that seemed obvious even before his callup and definitely in the first few starts after it, and the Reds are paying the price for their stubbornness in keeping him there ever since. Stephenson is a different case but has the type of arm you simply don't give up on. Look at the early returns on Tyler Glasnow in Tampa.

    To me age is the great divider. And I wasn't sold on that at first, but I am now. The list of guys who are 24 and younger and are thriving as big league starters is slim. You're ready when you're ready, but for most guys who aren't Kershaw/Bumgarner freaks of nature it's later rather than sooner. If it takes a few seasons in AAA, so be it. Corey Kluber made some 50 starts in AAA before he finally stuck in the majors as a 26-year-old.
    Stephenson and Reed are individual cases, and whatever I might think generally, the Reds know them well and presumably made sensible decisions. So I'm not really in a position to complain too much. As you say, they are still young, and I'm just hoping it works out.

    Still I think it's going to be an uphill climb for either to make the OD 2019 rotation. Just not enough time or success facing MLB hitters this year. I'd be surprised, but I have been before.

    And if they begin 2019 in the bullpen, that's fine with me too, I think Reds need more good arms down there.
    Last edited by Kc61; 08-09-2018 at 05:41 PM.

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  12. #52
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    Re: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    Sure, but if you've pushed them too much, that can happen. Reed wasn't quite ready for the majors in 2016, a fact that seemed obvious even before his callup and definitely in the first few starts after it, and the Reds are paying the price for their stubbornness in keeping him there ever since. Stephenson is a different case but has the type of arm you simply don't give up on. Look at the early returns on Tyler Glasnow in Tampa.

    To me age is the great divider. And I wasn't sold on that at first, but I am now. The list of guys who are 24 and younger and are thriving as big league starters is slim. You're ready when you're ready, but for most guys who aren't Kershaw/Bumgarner freaks of nature it's later rather than sooner. If it takes a few seasons in AAA, so be it. Corey Kluber made some 50 starts in AAA before he finally stuck in the majors as a 26-year-old.
    It really is a fine line in every sport. You want to keep the developing players challenged. They have to be facing some pressure, while they also need to be put into situations where they can be successful. Make it to easy, and they don't develop. Make it too hard and they lose their confidence. Management, the front offices, have to make sure that there's room for advancement when they've earned it, while Managers and Coaches have to know when to pull back on them or to push them and give them the right opportunities.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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  14. #53
    Middle Class Rut TRF's Avatar
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    Re: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

    Pitchers 24 or younger this year.

    RK PLAYER TEAM GP GS IP H R ER BB SO W L SV BLSV WAR WHIP ERA
    1 Luis Severino NYY 24 24 150.1 130 54 52 36 167 15 5 0 0 4.1 1.10 3.11
    2 Jose Berrios MIN 24 24 150.0 122 61 61 42 153 11 8 0 0 3.1 1.09 3.66
    3 Lance McCullers Jr. HOU 22 22 126.0 100 60 55 50 138 10 6 0 0 1.1 1.19 3.93
    4 Reynaldo Lopez CHW 23 23 136.0 124 71 65 59 96 4 9 0 0 1.5 1.35 4.30
    5 Luke Weaver STL 23 23 121.2 127 65 63 43 111 6 10 0 0 0.1 1.40 4.66
    6 German Marquez COL 23 23 128.2 132 72 67 45 139 9 9 0 0 1.9 1.38 4.69
    7 Sal Romano CIN 24 22 122.0 125 70 67 45 87 7 9 0 0 0.2 1.39 4.94
    8 Lucas Giolito CHW 23 23 125.2 118 89 87 71 84 7 9 0 0 -0.8 1.50 6.23

    That's a small list. and not an overly successful list. But pitchers aged 24-26...

    RK PLAYER TEAM GP GS IP H R ER BB SO W L SV BLSV WAR WHIP ERA
    1 Blake Snell TB 21 21 123.0 83 33 31 49 137 12 5 0 0 4.3 1.07 2.27
    2 Aaron Nola PHI 23 23 148.0 107 39 39 40 144 12 3 0 0 7.0 0.99 2.37
    3 Mike Foltynewicz ATL 22 22 124.0 97 47 41 51 145 9 7 0 0 2.1 1.19 2.98
    4 Kyle Freeland COL 23 23 139.0 123 47 47 50 110 10 7 0 0 5.5 1.24 3.04
    5 Luis Severino NYY 24 24 150.1 130 54 52 36 167 15 5 0 0 4.1 1.10 3.11
    6 Sean Newcomb ATL 22 22 125.2 92 47 44 59 116 10 5 0 0 2.2 1.20 3.15
    7 Sean Manaea OAK 24 24 144.0 122 58 56 29 99 10 8 0 0 2.4 1.05 3.50
    8 Jameson Taillon PIT 23 23 134.0 129 55 54 35 119 9 8 0 0 3.1 1.22 3.63
    9 Jose Berrios MIN 24 24 150.0 122 61 61 42 153 11 8 0 0 3.1 1.09 3.66
    10 Marco Gonzales SEA 23 23 137.2 140 60 58 25 121 12 7 0 0 2.3 1.20 3.79
    11 Trevor Williams PIT 22 22 116.0 107 55 50 40 80 9 8 0 0 1.8 1.27 3.88
    12 Lance McCullers Jr. HOU 22 22 126.0 100 60 55 50 138 10 6 0 0 1.1 1.19 3.93
    13 Vince Velasquez PHI 23 22 117.2 99 56 52 45 131 8 9 0 0 2.4 1.22 3.98
    14 Reynaldo Lopez CHW 23 23 136.0 124 71 65 59 96 4 9 0 0 1.5 1.35 4.30
    15 Dylan Bundy BAL 21 21 121.1 117 67 59 37 129 7 10 0 0 1.5 1.27 4.38
    16 Nick Pivetta PHI 24 23 119.2 120 64 60 33 147 7 9 0 0 1.8 1.28 4.51
    17 Jose Urena MIA 22 22 123.2 120 65 64 36 101 3 11 0 0 -0.2 1.26 4.66
    18 Luke Weaver STL 23 23 121.2 127 65 63 43 111 6 10 0 0 0.1 1.40 4.66
    19 Jon Gray COL 21 21 121.2 122 68 64 36 144 9 7 0 0 1.9 1.30 4.73
    20 Luis Castillo CIN 23 23 121.0 122 69 66 39 113 6 9 0 0 0.4 1.33 4.91
    21 Sal Romano CIN 24 22 122.0 125 70 67 45 87 7 9 0 0 0.2 1.39 4.94
    22 Jakob Junis KC 21 21 121.0 127 72 67 37 114 6 11 0 0 0.2 1.36 4.98
    23 Lucas Giolito CHW 23 23 125.2 118 89 87 71 84 7 9 0 0 -0.8 1.50 6.23

    No one on either list shows up as a rookie this year according to ESPN anyway.
    "There was like a softness to it, a glow to it. I felt... I felt warm."

    -- Joseph Daniel Votto 7/10/2017

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  16. #54
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    Re: Anyone notice what Cody Reed is doing?

    In reds zone a pitcher is still young at 30. Too old to sign to a contract at 31.


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