Movember Awareness

[Patrick Bateman]

Nothing wrong with anecdotal so long as it's identified as such. Most stories we tell here on RZ are anecdotal and that's fine. You make a great point that people like Jenny McCarthy's stories are anecdotal and that was why I brought it up as an analogy to this OP. I agree facts and scientific studies are ideal and that's why I included post #28

You have to understand though, the comp isn't really fair, at all. Jenny is saying things that have basically been nullified by the entire medical community, and has no credibility or knowledge to suggest otherwise.

I'm literally just sharing the diagnosis I received from 4 independently trained medical professionals.

Its a bad, and unfair comp, bordering on negligence, in a thread that is meant to be addressing openness and healthy discussion about mental health awareness.

[Sea Ray]

So now you think it (anxiety) may be a cause? I mean I guess you specifically never said “I don’t think it is a cause” but you kept hammering the point that the medical folks said it was not a cause. Maybe I’m missing something.

Yes, you are missing something. At the top of this page I stated my personal opinion:

Personally I think stress contributes to all sorts of conditions because I feel that it weakens the immune system.

It's already been established that alopecia is a problem with the immune system so of course it'll be included in my statement. Catch up, drop the attitude that you're looking for a fight and then join in.

[kaldaniels]

Yes, you are missing something. At the top of this page I stated my personal opinion:



It's already been established that alopecia is a problem with the immune system so of course it'll be included in my statement. Catch up, drop the attitude that you're looking for a fight and then join in.

That quote did not say you believe stress to be a cause of alopecia. “All sorts of” is vague and does not include alopecia. At best you left it up to wide interpretation. If anyone else thought you were referring to alopecia I’d be interested to know.

[Sea Ray]

You have to understand though, the comp isn't really fair, at all. Jenny is saying things that have basically been nullified by the entire medical community, and has no credibility or knowledge to suggest otherwise.

I'm literally just sharing the diagnosis I received from 4 independently trained medical professionals.

Its a bad, and unfair comp, bordering on negligence, in a thread that is meant to be addressing openness and healthy discussion about mental health awareness.

What you stated above is not accurate. The "entire medical community" is not in agreement on immunizations or much of anything for that matter. There are all sorts of doctors, holistic in particular, who believe in a causal relationship.

If you think anything I've referred to here is bad or unfair then take it up with the sources I gave at the beginning who flat out said that nerves/anxiety do NOT cause alopecia. They could have stayed silent on it but instead they took a definite stand. Those are mainstream sources.

[Sea Ray]

That quote did not say you believe stress to be a cause of alopecia. “All sorts of” is vague and does not include alopecia. At best you left it up to wide interpretation. If anyone else thought you were referring to alopecia I’d be interested to know.

If you didn't realize that alopecia is an immune system disorder, consider yourself now educated.

Can I clear anything else up for you?

[kaldaniels]

If you didn't realize that alopecia is an immune system disorder, consider yourself now educated.

Can I clear anything else up for you?

Again you didn’t say stress can cause “all” autoimmune disorders. You cagily said it can cause “all sorts of” them. Sorry but that doesn’t count as saying you believe it caused alopecia.

[Dom Heffner]

Nothing wrong with anecdotal so long as it's identified as such. Most stories we tell here on RZ are anecdotal and that's fine. You make a great point that people like Jenny McCarthy's stories are anecdotal and that was why I brought it up as an analogy to this OP. I agree facts and scientific studies are ideal and that's why I included post #28

Great read on why anecdotal evidence is not good.

On the one side are scientists who have been unable to find any causal link between the symptoms of autism and the vaccine preservative thimerosal, which in the body breaks down into ethylmercury, the culprit du jour for autism’s cause. On the other side are parents who noticed that shortly after having their children vaccinated autistic symptoms began to appear. These anecdotal associations are so powerful that they cause people to ignore contrary evidence: ethylmercury is expelled from the body quickly (unlike its chemical cousin methylmercury) and therefore cannot accumulate in the brain long enough to cause damage. And in any case, autism continues to be diagnosed in children born after thimerosal was removed from most vaccines in 1999; today trace amounts exist in only a few.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...tific-results/

[Sea Ray]

Again you didn’t say stress can cause “all” autoimmune disorders. You cagily said it can cause “all sorts of” them. Sorry but that doesn’t count as saying you believe it caused alopecia.

I'm not going to argue with you. I've now stated in no uncertain terms that I include alopecia in that. I apologize for any confusion you might have had.

Is there anything else I can clear up for you?

[BernieCarbo]

The "entire medical community" is not in agreement on immunizations.

Between your defense of ethnic slurs and the few wacko doctors and parents who don't advocate for immunizations, you are up there with some of the oddest people I have interacted with, and that's saying a lot.

[Larry Schuler]

Some people wear the troll mask.

Others grind it into a fine powder, sprinkle it into their morning smoothie, and absorb it into their bones.

[Sea Ray]

Between your defense of ethnic slurs and the few wacko doctors and parents who don't advocate for immunizations, you are up there with some of the oddest people I have interacted with, and that's saying a lot.

First of all can you keep the personal stuff to yourself? Secondly I have not defended wacko doctors as you put it. I've merely stated that "they" exist. This is a thread about a new disorder/disease to most of us and we're trying to learn more about it. I've brought several sources of information to the thread and you've done nothing but attack personally. I'm not going to respond in kind, although I have all kinds of material to work with. Frankly, my life isn't that lacking that I have time for you. Therefore, I'm putting you on ignore for awhile. Good bye.

As for this thread, I'll gladly discuss alopecia or other medical stuff. Those of you who wish to engage in personal attacks will also be ignored.

[Patrick Bateman]

What you stated above is not accurate. The "entire medical community" is not in agreement on immunizations or much of anything for that matter. There are all sorts of doctors, holistic in particular, who believe in a causal relationship.

From everything I have read, the holistic doctors that have chosen to believe this are doing it against scientific evidence. It would suggest they are choosing to go against what science is telling them. I don't see that as a valid counter point.

If you think anything I've referred to here is bad or unfair then take it up with the sources I gave at the beginning who flat out said that nerves/anxiety do NOT cause alopecia. They could have stayed silent on it but instead they took a definite stand. Those are mainstream sources.

I'm not going to take it up with the sources, because I don't really give a lot of valid to some rando articles found via google. I can find other ones just as easily that say the direct opposite. I dont know what the sources are or the validity of them. Im comfortable with what 4 independent doctors from different schools, training backgrounds, etc. are telling me based on the scientific evidence that is taught through their curriculum, and the verifiable sources they have access to. It just seems like a much more credible to me than the limitations of the research I am able to do using the confines of a search engine with unverifiable material.

[Dom Heffner]

First of all can you keep the personal stuff to yourself? Secondly I have not defended wacko doctors as you put it. I've merely stated that "they" exist. This is a thread about a new disorder/disease to most of us and we're trying to learn more about it. I've brought several sources of information to the thread and you've done nothing but attack personally. I'm not going to respond in kind, although I have all kinds of material to work with. Frankly, my life isn't that lacking that I have time for you. Therefore, I'm putting you on ignore for awhile. Good bye.

As for this thread, I'll gladly discuss alopecia or other medical stuff. Those of you who wish to engage in personal attacks will also be ignored.

It is a little weird to see you take a very far left position.

And that is where this stuff comes from. Little taken aback to be honest.

[Sea Ray]

From everything I have read, the holistic doctors that have chosen to believe this are doing it against scientific evidence. It would suggest they are choosing to go against what science is telling them. I don't see that as a valid counter point.



I'm not going to take it up with the sources, because I don't really give a lot of valid to some rando articles found via google. I can find other ones just as easily that say the direct opposite. I dont know what the sources are or the validity of them. Im comfortable with what 4 independent doctors from different schools, training backgrounds, etc. are telling me based on the scientific evidence that is taught through their curriculum, and the verifiable sources they have access to. It just seems like a much more credible to me than the limitations of the research I am able to do using the confines of a search engine with unverifiable material.

I think the American Academy of Dermatology is more than just some random article on Google. In fact I'd say it'd be hard to find a more trusted source on alopecia

The American Academy of Dermatology (AAD) is one of the largest organizations of dermatologists in the world. It was founded in 1938 and represents 19,000 dermatologists in the United States, Canada, and around the world. The academy grants fellowships and associate memberships, as well as fellowships for nonresidents of the United States or Canada.[2] Since 1979, the AAD also publishes a monthly medical journal, the Journal of the American Academy of Dermatology.[3]

To become a Fellow of the American Academy of Dermatology (FAAD), a physician must be a resident of the United States of America or Canada and certified by the American Board of Dermatology or in dermatology by the Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons of Canada.[4][5]

To become an associate member, a physician must have three years of experience in practice or as a teacher or graduate student of dermatology and must have had training that qualifies for examination by the American Board of Dermatology or the Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons of Canada.[4]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americ...of_Dermatology

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It is a little weird to see you take a very far left position.

And that is where this stuff comes from. Little taken aback to be honest.

Maybe I do have a left wing position. What exactly are you referring to?

[BernieCarbo]

First of all can you keep the personal stuff to yourself?

It has nothing to do with personal stuff. I don't know you, and probably never will. I'm speaking to your viewpoints on ethnic slurs and giving credibility to parents who harm their children and the public. You were the one to take the stand, and now you own it.