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Thread: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

  1. #61
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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    Being on the 40 man roster is not a reward for playing well. It’s a way to protect your players from going to another team.

    The point is that it took an active action to remove him. And nothing was gained from the Reds perspective by taking that action.

    You still haven’t explained what the Reds gain from taking this action. (WrongVerb provided a possible explanation, and if that is true, then I understand the action. But we don’t know if it’s true at this point.)
    Reds avoided paying $89,000 to a prospect who hasn't progressed. They also opened roster room. That's what they gained.

    Interesting that you haven't showed that Aquino is worth it. You make every argument but fail to prove the most basic point: that Aquino is worthy of a forty man roster spot.

    You need to show that or he is no different than Michael Beltre or Josh Van Meter or many other prospects who weren't put on roster.

    That Reds took "active action" is irrelevant. They have only forty spots and they don't give out points for last year's decision. Either you make it or you don't.
    Last edited by Kc61; 12-04-2018 at 11:35 AM.

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  3. #62
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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Reds avoided paying $89,000 to a prospect who hasn't progressed. They also opened roster room. That's what they gained.

    Interesting that you haven't showed that Aquino is worth it. You make every argument but fail to prove the most basic point: that Aquino is worthy of a forty man roster spot.

    You need to show that or he is no different than Michael Beltre or Josh Van Meter or many other prospects who weren't put on roster.

    That Reds took "active action" is totally irrelevant. They have only forty spots and they don't give out points for last year's decision. Either you make it or you don't.
    Aquino didn't even crack Fangraphs top 33 Reds prospects.
    "Today was the byproduct of us thinking we can come back from anything." - Joey Votto after blowing a 10-1 lead and holding on for the 12-11 win on 8/25/2010.

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Reds avoided paying $89,000 to a prospect who hasn't progressed. They also opened roster room. That's what they gained.

    Interesting that you haven't showed that Aquino is worth it. You make every argument but fail to prove the most basic point: that Aquino is worthy of a forty man roster spot.

    You need to show that or he is no different than Michael Beltre or Josh Van Meter or many other prospects who weren't put on roster.

    That Reds took "active action" is irrelevant. They have only forty spots and they don't give out points for last year's decision. Either you make it or you don't.
    I did point out Aquino’s value. He has an outstanding arm, great power and athleticism. He was good enough for them to promote to the majors last year. LAST YEAR! so at the very least, they see him as good enough to be an MLB bench player right now. That is his value, that the Reds determined themselves.

    And he doesn’t open up room on the 40 man roster. There already was plenty of room. That is the main point. If they were at 40, or even 39, i would understand, with the rule 5 draft coming up. But they don’t need four open spots. Not now. And when they domneee tent spot, that’s when you make the decision, not now, when there is zero urgency. A millions things can happen between now and then that could make change the decision.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by Griffey012 View Post
    Aquino didn't even crack Fangraphs top 33 Reds prospects.
    Ranked 19th by Sickels:

    19) Aristides Aquino, OF, Grade C+: Age 24, signed out of Dominican Republic in 2010, hit .240/.306/.448 with 20 doubles, 20 homers, 35 walks, 112 strikeouts in 404 at-bats in Double-A; big-time power held back by contact/discipline issues although he’s made enough progress closing the holes to merit a C+; even small improvements will go a long way; right field profile with cannon throwing arm; watch closely as he transitions to Triple-A; ETA 2019.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I did point out Aquino’s value. He has an outstanding arm, great power and athleticism. He was good enough for them to promote to the majors last year. LAST YEAR! so at the very least, they see him as good enough to be an MLB bench player right now. That is his value, that the Reds determined themselves.

    And he doesn’t open up room on the 40 man roster. There already was plenty of room. That is the main point. If they were at 40, or even 39, i would understand, with the rule 5 draft coming up. But they don’t need four open spots. Not now. And when they domneee tent spot, that’s when you make the decision, not now, when there is zero urgency. A millions things can happen between now and then that could make change the decision.
    Aquino made the majors because he was on the forty and easily brought up. He didn't make it on merit last year. Just look at his numbers, which you studiously are avoiding.

    Reds decided he hasn't progressed sufficiently. You want to argue with that, fine, there are different opinions on players. All the rest is noise.
    Last edited by Kc61; 12-04-2018 at 12:14 PM.

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by Kc61 View Post
    Aquino made the majors because he was on the forty and easily brought up. He didn't make it on merit last year. Just look at his numbers, which you studiously are avoiding.

    Reds decided he hasn't progressed sufficiently. You want to argue with that, fine, there are different opinions on players. All the rest is noise.
    I literally posted Aquino’s numbers in the post above. With Sickels pointing out that he showed improvement with them.

    But again, it isn’t an issue of what anyone’s opinion of Aquino is. It caused the Reds no harm to keep him on the 40 man roster. It caused them harm to non-tender him. It was dumb. Can’t be more basic and easier to understand than that.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I literally posted Aquino’s numbers in the post above. With Sickels pointing out that he showed improvement with them.

    But again, it isn’t an issue of what anyone’s opinion of Aquino is. It caused the Reds no harm to keep him on the 40 man roster. It caused them harm to non-tender him. It was dumb. Can’t be more basic and easier to understand than that.
    I liken this whole Aquino argument to when I go through my closet and get rid of some old clothes. I always find a shirt or two that are in like new shape, but I just never wear them. It causes me no harm to leave the shirt in my closet, and maybe someday it will enter my normal rotation of attire. But instead, I usually move along, realize I'll never actually wear the shirt, and donate it along with the rest of the items. Theoretically, I didn't have any reason to get rid of the shirt, plenty of room in the closet, and it had the potential to provide me value if I started to wear it, but I also realize that was never going to be the case, so I just move along.

    What is dumb about that?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I did point out Aquino’s value. He has an outstanding arm, great power and athleticism. He was good enough for them to promote to the majors last year. LAST YEAR! so at the very least, they see him as good enough to be an MLB bench player right now. That is his value, that the Reds determined themselves.
    Ughhhh what? He was on the 40 man and played in 1 game. That does not equal Reds think he is an MLB bench player right now.
    "Today was the byproduct of us thinking we can come back from anything." - Joey Votto after blowing a 10-1 lead and holding on for the 12-11 win on 8/25/2010.

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by Griffey012 View Post
    I liken this whole Aquino argument to when I go through my closet and get rid of some old clothes. I always find a shirt or two that are in like new shape, but I just never wear them. It causes me no harm to leave the shirt in my closet, and maybe someday it will enter my normal rotation of attire. But instead, I usually move along, realize I'll never actually wear the shirt, and donate it along with the rest of the items. Theoretically, I didn't have any reason to get rid of the shirt, plenty of room in the closet, and it had the potential to provide me value if I started to wear it, but I also realize that was never going to be the case, so I just move along.

    What is dumb about that?

    - - - Updated - - -



    Ughhhh what? He was on the 40 man and played in 1 game. That does not equal Reds think he is an MLB bench player right now.
    1. Shirts don’t have potential to get better. A better apology is that you have a garden, and every fall, you replace some plants with other plants, because you have limited room, and some plants are no longer of use. You have 40 plots. You get rid of all the plants who are no longer producing, plant all the new plants you want, and you have still have three empty plots. So you kill a young, healthy plant that hasn’t bloossemed yet, because it’s growing slower than expected. That’s dumb. It costs you nothing to keep it for now, and you’ve now lost a plant that could be productive.

    2. If the Reds didn’t think he was good enough to be on an MLB bench, then they made a mistake and hurt the team by bringing him up last year.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
    “You got the pitching, now what?” - Reds fans

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    1. Shirts don’t have potential to get better. A better apology is that you have a garden, and every fall, you replace some plants with other plants, because you have limited room, and some plants are no longer of use. You have 40 plots. You get rid of all the plants who are no longer producing, plant all the new plants you want, and you have still have three empty plots. So you kill a young, healthy plant that hasn’t bloossemed yet, because it’s growing slower than expected. That’s dumb. It costs you nothing to keep it for now, and you’ve now lost a plant that could be productive.
    Sure they do, styles come and go.

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    2. If the Reds didn’t think he was good enough to be on an MLB bench, then they made a mistake and hurt the team by bringing him up last year.
    It was one game the Reds won 11-4. He pinch ran for Scooter, played a little RF, and got 1 late AB. It had about as little impact as you could possibly have in the outcome of a baseball game in a meaningless season. It is about as much of a non-factor in the big picture as non-tendering Aquino is.
    "Today was the byproduct of us thinking we can come back from anything." - Joey Votto after blowing a 10-1 lead and holding on for the 12-11 win on 8/25/2010.

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    For a change, I have read the whole thread.

    I don't see Aquino getting signed before the Rule 5 draft. It COULD happen, sure, but I do not think it will. It was stated that the Reds may have deals in place to re-sign the three players they non-tendered. So it is very likely Aquino is in AAA Louisville next year. The Reds gained 3 40 man roster spots, giving them wiggle room for the aforementioned draft. I believe the Reds will make an offer to a FA SP (Harvey) and needed the room on the 40 for that. It's possible they acquire a SP via trade and may need a 40 man spot for that.

    There is a lot of hand wringing over a guy that in two weeks, might still be with the club, while ignoring the benefits of the freed up 40 man spots.
    There is nothing you keep there is only your reflection.

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by TRF View Post
    For a change, I have read the whole thread.

    I don't see Aquino getting signed before the Rule 5 draft. It COULD happen, sure, but I do not think it will. It was stated that the Reds may have deals in place to re-sign the three players they non-tendered. So it is very likely Aquino is in AAA Louisville next year. The Reds gained 3 40 man roster spots, giving them wiggle room for the aforementioned draft. I believe the Reds will make an offer to a FA SP (Harvey) and needed the room on the 40 for that. It's possible they acquire a SP via trade and may need a 40 man spot for that.

    There is a lot of hand wringing over a guy that in two weeks, might still be with the club, while ignoring the benefits of the freed up 40 man spots.
    Again, there is no benefit gained by non tender f him right now. They don’t need the roster spot now. It would be smarter to wait until they needed to make a move to actually make that move. Zero reason to make it now.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
    “You got the pitching, now what?” - Reds fans

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    I am not sure if this is in the thread but Aquino did go ahead with full participation at RedsFest even after he was non-tendered. I spoke to him briefly and he did not express anything out of the ordinary. Some if not all of the players who were non-tendered were extended offers before they were actually non-tendered. Aquino may have already verbally agreed to an offer before the paperwork was even sent in to non-tender him. As for the timing, I am not sure. They may feel that this is the best time to sneak a guy through waivers, with everyone maxing out their rosters. Lastly on the topic of Aquino, I believe if the Reds ever gave up on his ability to develop as a hitter, that there would be some desire to put him on the mound and see what he could do. I am not suggesting it is on the verge of happening now, but there are people who have noted that he projects as a pitcher.

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by Griffey012 View Post
    Sure they do, styles come and go.



    It was one game the Reds won 11-4. He pinch ran for Scooter, played a little RF, and got 1 late AB. It had about as little impact as you could possibly have in the outcome of a baseball game in a meaningless season. It is about as much of a non-factor in the big picture as non-tendering Aquino is.
    If the shirt you threw away, when you had room for it, could have been worn even once, it was a dumb move.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
    “You got the pitching, now what?” - Reds fans

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    If the shirt you threw away, when you had room for it, could have been worn even once, it was a dumb move.
    If I was a hoarder, then sure.
    "Today was the byproduct of us thinking we can come back from anything." - Joey Votto after blowing a 10-1 lead and holding on for the 12-11 win on 8/25/2010.

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    Re: Aristides Aquino non-tendered

    Quote Originally Posted by Griffey012 View Post
    If I was a hoarder, then sure.
    If you were a hoarder, you wouldn’t have room for it, by definition.
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini
    “You got the pitching, now what?” - Reds fans


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