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Thread: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

  1. #91
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Quote Originally Posted by 757690 View Post
    I think it’s no coincidence that the Reds played their best baseball when Homer was not on the 25 man roster, and not starting every fifth day. And when he came back, the losing started again.
    I do. I think Homer and his performance had absolutely no effect on the other four days. I think arguing that he does suggests a mentality that doesn't really exist.

    I'm not some baseball player expert, but I've talked with some players before. The stuff they care about doesn't match the fan attitudes. I've heard guys rave about Reds legend Tim Melville, what a great teammate he was and how they'd go to war with him any day. That he sucks doesn't really factor in. A guy not playing well, even over an extended period, doesn't make him toxic or loathed. How he treats his teammates is what matters, and if Homer were even a fraction as bad of an influence as some Reds fans insist he was then you have to figure SOMEONE on the Reds these last few years would have spoken out even if just subtly about it.
    “I don’t care,” Votto said of passing his friend and former teammate. “He’s in the past. Bye-bye, Jay.”

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  4. #92
    Member 757690's Avatar
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    I do. I think Homer and his performance had absolutely no effect on the other four days. I think arguing that he does suggests a mentality that doesn't really exist.

    I'm not some baseball player expert, but I've talked with some players before. The stuff they care about doesn't match the fan attitudes. I've heard guys rave about Reds legend Tim Melville, what a great teammate he was and how they'd go to war with him any day. That he sucks doesn't really factor in. A guy not playing well, even over an extended period, doesn't make him toxic or loathed. How he treats his teammates is what matters, and if Homer were even a fraction as bad of an influence as some Reds fans insist he was then you have to figure SOMEONE on the Reds these last few years would have spoken out even if just subtly about it.
    Tim Melville got two starts with the Reds. If he had gotten 20 a season for two seasons in a row, and I’m guessing players would have a different attitude going into his starts.

    What is getting overlooked is how many starts Bailey got after it was clear he was toast. It has to be historic. Can anyone find a starter who got 44 starts while constantly sporting an ERA north of 6?
    “We’re going to get the pitching.” -Bob Castellini

  5. #93
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    I am guessing the Reds have moved on from the Sonny Gray front for the time being...and if they haven't they should. I know it is likely posturing by Cashman, but still.

    https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/...he-season.html
    "Today was the byproduct of us thinking we can come back from anything." - Joey Votto after blowing a 10-1 lead and holding on for the 12-11 win on 8/25/2010.

  6. #94
    Member Wonderful Monds's Avatar
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Quote Originally Posted by Griffey012 View Post
    I am guessing the Reds have moved on from the Sonny Gray front for the time being...and if they haven't they should. I know it is likely posturing by Cashman, but still.

    https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2019/...he-season.html
    I’d be feeling kinda weird about all this if I were Sonny Gray.
    Quote Originally Posted by reds44 View Post
    Ghosts, you gotta lay off the weaponized hallucinogens, my man.

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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    There is nothing like walking into a workplace where you know you aren't wanted.

    Deep down I'm sure he'd love to tell Cashman to go f himself.

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  10. #96
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Quote Originally Posted by Kinsm View Post
    There is nothing like walking into a workplace where you know you aren't wanted.

    Deep down I'm sure he'd love to tell Cashman to go f himself.
    I wouldn't have to dig that deep if I were him...

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  12. #97
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Quote Originally Posted by Wonderful Monds View Post
    I’d be feeling kinda weird about all this if I were Sonny Gray.
    Was thinking the same thing.

    When Cashman talks to the media he basically comes across as saying "Look the guy is garbage and we need to trade him. On the other hand, I'm going to hold out for top dollar in a return and if that means bringing Sonny back next year to prove a point I can do that.".


    I honestly can't remember another time where a team was so blatant and obvious about wanting to jettison someone from their roster. The fact that he's trying to play hardball with potential trade partners is even more hilarious.
    Quote Originally Posted by BCubb2003 View Post
    Don't worry. I'd say the game threads are about league average.
    "[Price] said he and the GM have become “somewhat in lockstep” with how they view the best way forward for the team, including how to handle promotions and playing young players while also trying to win games."

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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Quote Originally Posted by The Operator View Post
    Was thinking the same thing.

    When Cashman talks to the media he basically comes across as saying "Look the guy is garbage and we need to trade him. On the other hand, I'm going to hold out for top dollar in a return and if that means bringing Sonny back next year to prove a point I can do that.".


    I honestly can't remember another time where a team was so blatant and obvious about wanting to jettison someone from their roster. The fact that he's trying to play hardball with potential trade partners is even more hilarious.
    I'd offer them Scooter and Vlad if the return is Gray & Frazier because I like Frazier that much. Scooter and Gray are each rentals that fill holes while Vlad and Frazier are prospects that have decent ceilings. I might even expand it a bit and add Long if the Yanks counter with one of their young arms that might help in the pen. If they want a prospect higher than Guttierez? Pound Sand.

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  16. #99
    Member Tom Servo's Avatar
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Jon Morosi
    @jonmorosi

    #Reds are not seriously engaged in Sonny Gray trade talks at the moment, source says, and as @blogredmachine indicated here. A signing of Dallas Keuchel is more likely, although far from probable. Cincinnati wants to add a starter with multiple years of control; Gray is not that.
    “I don’t care,” Votto said of passing his friend and former teammate. “He’s in the past. Bye-bye, Jay.”

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    Making A Pass By GABP OhioRiverBarge's Avatar
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Heyman:

    “Reds still among teams with interest in Sonny Gray. He has close connection with Reds pitching coach Derek Johnson. Yankees believed interested in multiple pitching prospects -- good ones in the category of Santillan, Gutierrez and Mella. upper level guys with a chance.”

    This rumor is clearly leaked from the Yankees side. If true, this might explain why reds are reportedly fading on Gray. That’s a ridiculous asking price if it’s including Santillan.
    "In our sundown perambulations of late through the outer parts of Brooklyn, we have observed several parties of youngsters playing 'base,' a certain game of ball. We wish such sights were more common among us...The game of ball is glorious..." -Walt Whitman, 1846

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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    It's not a top three guy, at least, and I think there's a bit of a gap between Santillan and Mella.
    “[Reading] is the sole means by which we slip, involuntarily, often helplessly, into another's skin, another's voice, another's soul" -- Joyce Carol Oates

    “We’re all stories, in the end. Just make it a good one, eh?” — The Doctor (Matt Smith)

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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Quote Originally Posted by marcshoe View Post
    It's not a top three guy, at least, and I think there's a bit of a gap between Santillan and Mella.
    If they'd take Mella straight up for him, I think Gray would already be a Red.

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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Quote Originally Posted by Old school 1983 View Post
    If they'd take Mella straight up for him, I think Gray would already be a Red.
    I’d do Mella plus their choice of Stephenson/Romano
    Go BLUE!!!

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  25. #104
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Quote Originally Posted by Old school 1983 View Post
    If they'd take Mella straight up for him, I think Gray would already be a Red.
    Well sure, the article says "multiple". But still, I'd say that Gray has a better shot of being successful in the future than any of those three, and my guess is that no more than one of them will become a dependable starter. This is the kind of choice you have to make. There's a tendency to think that suggestions you hear from the media are unrealistic, but I don't see it here.
    “[Reading] is the sole means by which we slip, involuntarily, often helplessly, into another's skin, another's voice, another's soul" -- Joyce Carol Oates

    “We’re all stories, in the end. Just make it a good one, eh?” — The Doctor (Matt Smith)

  26. #105
    Making A Pass By GABP OhioRiverBarge's Avatar
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    Re: Reds are still trying to deal for Sonny Gray

    Wood
    Castillo
    Gray
    Roark
    Disco/Mahle

    If the chips fall right, that could be a dangerous rotation. No aces in that hand, but they all got faces. Whatever that means.
    "In our sundown perambulations of late through the outer parts of Brooklyn, we have observed several parties of youngsters playing 'base,' a certain game of ball. We wish such sights were more common among us...The game of ball is glorious..." -Walt Whitman, 1846


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