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Thread: College Football 2019

  1. #46
    Member adkindo's Avatar
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    It may not happen. Tenn is not a rich state for recruiting, they need to pull from outside of the state to get a lot of their talent. They need the right coach along with the right administration to rebuild that program. They keep missing on hires and its been two decades since they were a national contender.
    never really subscribed to you need to be in a state that produces a lot of high level talent. Alabama is not one of those states either, nor is South Carolina....yet Alabama and Clemson do ok. There are basically 4 states right now producing the overwhelming majority of 4 and 5 Star recruits......Florida, Texas, California and Georgia. No other state is even close so every school is forced to feed off of at least 1 or 2 of those states.

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  3. #47
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by adkindo View Post
    never really subscribed to you need to be in a state that produces a lot of high level talent. Alabama is not one of those states either, nor is South Carolina....yet Alabama and Clemson do ok. There are basically 4 states right now producing the overwhelming majority of 4 and 5 Star recruits......Florida, Texas, California and Georgia. No other state is even close so every school is forced to feed off of at least 1 or 2 of those states.
    Oh, I think its absolutely vital. It may not be confined to a state, but a geographical region is very important to recruiting.

    Ask yourself this, what does Tennessee offer? Its not like they can say, we are going to lock down Tennessee and then build from there, because there just isn't that much talent surrounding. Right now, the talent in Tennessee is being swept up by the likes of Clemson and Alabama. They picture themselves as a program who should be a national power, but hasn't been for two decades.

    I think its a tough place to coach and recruit because it just doesn't have the fertile recruiting grounds that other schools have. While you can say they could be a Clemson or Alabama program, in reality they are far close to that of Illinois.

  4. #48
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Location matters, but coaching matters a lot more. Alabama is good because of Nick Saban. They were in the middle of a what Tennessee is in right now before he showed up. Clemson is good because of Dabo (and the ACC being down). They were mediocre for a long time before Dabo and do we really forget that “Clemsoning” was a verb used basically every season?

    It’s a big reason why Oklahoma and Ohio State handled their coaching changes the way they did. Yes they have some built in advantages, but they are only one bad coaching hire away from not being relevant every year.

  5. #49
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by BuckeyeRed27 View Post
    Location matters, but coaching matters a lot more.
    Exhibit A, B, C, D,.....Z. University of Florida, University of Miami, Florida State University, University of Texas, USC, UCLA. If location was the primary driver of success, these teams would just pass around national championship trophies. Every one of them outside UCLA has demonstrated over the last couple decades that they can be a national championship level program....but poor decisions, coaching hires, and transitions have left all them mostly mediocre or worse in recent years.

    I am not suggesting it is not a benefit for some and a detriment for others, but just one of many advantages and disadvantages schools navigate.

  6. #50
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by adkindo View Post
    Exhibit A, B, C, D,.....Z. University of Florida, University of Miami, Florida State University, University of Texas, USC, UCLA. If location was the primary driver of success, these teams would just pass around national championship trophies. Every one of them outside UCLA has demonstrated over the last couple decades that they can be a national championship level program....but poor decisions, coaching hires, and transitions have left all them mostly mediocre or worse in recent years.

    I am not suggesting it is not a benefit for some and a detriment for others, but just one of many advantages and disadvantages schools navigate.
    Its so much easier to build a championship team if you are in a talent rich area. Yes, those schools above screwed it up mainly because of poor coaching hires. Take Texas for example, there isn't a kid in the entire state of Texas that doesn't understand what the Texas logo means. Tom Herman can get Texas back just by recruiting the state hard. Butch Davis re-built Miami into a power by locking down the city of Miami, not the entire state. I think USC has struggled because of a bad coaching hire(s) but would also say that when LA got a football team, the allure of USC dropped off quite a bit. When Pete Carroll had USC rolling they were LA's pro team, now they are more an afterthought.

    Tennessee may be able to regain some national prominence, but I don't think its as easy as a good coaching hire. Since their National Championship, they have three double digit winning seasons, none of them in the past decade. They haven't finished the season ranked in the top 10 since 2001. They have largely been irrelevant for a decade or more.

  7. #51
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    It may not happen. Tenn is not a rich state for recruiting, they need to pull from outside of the state to get a lot of their talent. They need the right coach along with the right administration to rebuild that program. They keep missing on hires and its been two decades since they were a national contender.
    They can recruit enough talent to beat Georgia State. No excuse for losing that one

  8. #52
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    Oh, I think its absolutely vital. It may not be confined to a state, but a geographical region is very important to recruiting.

    Ask yourself this, what does Tennessee offer? Its not like they can say, we are going to lock down Tennessee and then build from there, because there just isn't that much talent surrounding. Right now, the talent in Tennessee is being swept up by the likes of Clemson and Alabama. They picture themselves as a program who should be a national power, but hasn't been for two decades.

    I think its a tough place to coach and recruit because it just doesn't have the fertile recruiting grounds that other schools have. While you can say they could be a Clemson or Alabama program, in reality they are far close to that of Illinois.
    Tennessee has tons to offer. Beautiful area, great campus, avid fan base, great facilities w/o the pressure of playing for the big boys. They'll get it together. Could happen as soon as tomorrow but I'm not getting my hopes up.

  9. #53
    Waitin til next year bucksfan2's Avatar
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Sea Ray View Post
    Tennessee has tons to offer. Beautiful area, great campus, avid fan base, great facilities w/o the pressure of playing for the big boys. They'll get it together. Could happen as soon as tomorrow but I'm not getting my hopes up.
    Tennessee has some stuff going for them for sure, but I would argue they have more going against them.

    Actually, I think the pressure the fans put on the players at Tennessee is pretty significant. I also think the Phillip Fulmer faction is doing the program no favors. Add to that, the entire Schiano debacle really paints Tennessee in a bad light. Who knows if Schiano would have been successful, but a fan revolt led by the likes of Fulmer and Clay Travis led to the university rescinding the job offer. That isn't how big time universities handle things.

  10. #54
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    Tennessee has some stuff going for them for sure, but I would argue they have more going against them.

    Actually, I think the pressure the fans put on the players at Tennessee is pretty significant. I also think the Phillip Fulmer faction is doing the program no favors. Add to that, the entire Schiano debacle really paints Tennessee in a bad light. Who knows if Schiano would have been successful, but a fan revolt led by the likes of Fulmer and Clay Travis led to the university rescinding the job offer. That isn't how big time universities handle things.
    Notre Dame named a coach once upon a time and rescinded the offer.

    The fact is that proud programs go through this kind of thing. USC, Texas, Oklahoma, etc. The list is long. The question with Tennessee is can they get back to where they once were? But then, one has to ask what exactly were they?
    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

  11. #55
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    Notre Dame named a coach once upon a time and rescinded the offer.

    The fact is that proud programs go through this kind of thing. USC, Texas, Oklahoma, etc. The list is long. The question with Tennessee is can they get back to where they once were? But then, one has to ask what exactly were they?
    Was that George O'Leary? Was it done because of a mob led by the former head coach and a radio shock jock?

    Tennessee views themselves as this blue blood program that has fallen on hard times but will rise back up. IMO they are more like Illinois (look at their history) than they are like USC, Florida, or FSU.

  12. #56
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    Notre Dame named a coach once upon a time and rescinded the offer.

    The fact is that proud programs go through this kind of thing. USC, Texas, Oklahoma, etc. The list is long. The question with Tennessee is can they get back to where they once were? But then, one has to ask what exactly were they?
    George O’Leary literally lied about playing college football on his resume.

    That’s a tad different.
    What would you say.....ya do here?

  13. #57
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    Its so much easier to build a championship team if you are in a talent rich area. Yes, those schools above screwed it up mainly because of poor coaching hires. Take Texas for example, there isn't a kid in the entire state of Texas that doesn't understand what the Texas logo means. Tom Herman can get Texas back just by recruiting the state hard. Butch Davis re-built Miami into a power by locking down the city of Miami, not the entire state. I think USC has struggled because of a bad coaching hire(s) but would also say that when LA got a football team, the allure of USC dropped off quite a bit. When Pete Carroll had USC rolling they were LA's pro team, now they are more an afterthought.

    Tennessee may be able to regain some national prominence, but I don't think its as easy as a good coaching hire. Since their National Championship, they have three double digit winning seasons, none of them in the past decade. They haven't finished the season ranked in the top 10 since 2001. They have largely been irrelevant for a decade or more.
    We could just be talking about two different levels. I am not suggesting they will get to a level of being in the natty conversation annually. I have never viewed that program in that light. Like other Top 25ish programs, they will go in and out of "golden era's" like the Mannning/Martin era....but I would not expect that ever to be the norm for a program like Tennessee. I expect their history, tradition, fan support and most importantly their SEC affiliation to get them back to being an annual Top 25 program.

    I am a WVU fan....and I view our program as a Top 25ish program. That is in most seasons we will be hanging out in the Top 25....in the top half of our conference. Every once in a while, we have a year where we climb a little higher and hang out in the Top 10 and are legitimate conference contenders hoping to catch lightning in a bottle (Major Harris era, Will Grier teams). Then, every few decades we have a "golden era" where we are ranked in the Top #10 and part of the national conversation like the Pat White teams that got as close as humanly possible to a National Championship game, but coming up short....3 BCS Bowls and 1 non BCS New Years day bowl during his 4 years with a 4-0 record in those Bowls.

    That is how I view Tennessee when things are normal. The trick is you have to make the most of the short periods when you are playing above your standard, and not fall off a cliff during any down period.

  14. #58
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by bucksfan2 View Post
    Tennessee has some stuff going for them for sure, but I would argue they have more going against them.

    Actually, I think the pressure the fans put on the players at Tennessee is pretty significant. I also think the Phillip Fulmer faction is doing the program no favors. Add to that, the entire Schiano debacle really paints Tennessee in a bad light. Who knows if Schiano would have been successful, but a fan revolt led by the likes of Fulmer and Clay Travis led to the university rescinding the job offer. That isn't how big time universities handle things.
    I agree, it was a total disaster. There are fans around the country that believe Tennessee may be under the spell of karma for a while for the way they treated Schiano. Then on top of that, they place Fulmer in a position that he is not qualified to hold. I am a Tampa Bay Bucs fan, so my feelings for Schiano are not very positive....but the reason he failed with the Bucs is because he tried to run it like a college program...because that is really the only way he knows how to run a team. I say that to point out that any man that could build quality teams at Rutgers (a 11-2 season, ranked 6th in BCS Poll), has the capabilities to win at Tennessee.

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    Re: College Football 2019

    This Ohio State vs. Cincinnati game tomorrow should be fun. UC is definitely good enough to make it interesting.

  17. #60
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    Re: College Football 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by Assembly Hall View Post
    Notre Dame named a coach once upon a time and rescinded the offer.

    The fact is that proud programs go through this kind of thing. USC, Texas, Oklahoma, etc. The list is long. The question with Tennessee is can they get back to where they once were? But then, one has to ask what exactly were they?
    in the top half of the SEC East (with Georgia, Florida, etc.) is where they should be as a program.....maybe win the SEC East 1 - 3 times a decade....maybe even with the SEC 1 time every 10-12 years on average.

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