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Thread: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

  1. #16
    Member Kinsm's Avatar
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    A French billionaire has already pledged 100M$ of his fortune to rebuilding it.

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  4. #17
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    Quote Originally Posted by Kinsm View Post
    A French billionaire has already pledged 100M$ of his fortune to rebuilding it.
    That is so cool. Worth every penny.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

  5. #18
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    Quote Originally Posted by redsfandan View Post
    Because the walls of the cathedral were almost all stone. All the wood is (probably) gone, though. And there was a LOT of wood (around 13000 trees). Some of the wood was, literally, more than a millennia old.

    The rebuild will be one heck of a project. (I'll be really interested in the windows.)
    It's spoken of among wood enthusiasts how "1st Growth" trees (that's what we called it then...we call it "old growth" now) were stronger by many times than "2nd growth" trees. When the U.S.'s trees were first cut down, those beams and supports would stand the test of time. Those made from 2nd growth would not.

    Weatherization of wood had not been invented, yet, not until the 19th Century, because the average child knew more about wood than 99% of carpenters today. Everyone knew which tree, and which part of a tree, and what season of a tree, and more intricasies, such as age of a tree, where it grew, etc., etc., etc and how to cut it and when to cut it (such as on a full moon) before selecting the right wood for the right use. Pick correctly, such as using the same shake as the giant tree that umbrellas itself over the home, and no seasoning was necessary.

    When Notre Dame was built there were still ancient forests to pull 1st growth trees out of and use for its construction.
    Last edited by Powel Crosley; 04-15-2019 at 10:36 PM.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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  7. #19
    Member JaxRed's Avatar
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    Quote Originally Posted by Kinsm View Post
    A French billionaire has already pledged 100M$ of his fortune to rebuilding it.
    He's also married to Salma Hayek..... he's truly a rich man.
    The lowest acceptable payroll amount for ownership to show they are not greedy pigs is 15 million more than they are currently paying. No matter what that currently is.

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  9. #20
    Member Sea Ray's Avatar
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    Actually he's pledged a 100 million Euros. Even more than dollars

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  11. #21
    Viva la Rolen kaldaniels's Avatar
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    Quote Originally Posted by Kingspoint View Post
    It's spoken of among wood enthusiasts how "1st Growth" trees (that's what we called it then...we call it "old growth" now) were stronger by many times than "2nd growth" trees. When the U.S.'s trees were first cut down, those beams and supports would stand the test of time. Those made from 2nd growth would not.

    Weatherization of wood had not been invented, yet, not until the 19th Century, because the average child knew more about wood than 99% of carpenters today. Everyone knew which tree, and which part of a tree, and what season of a tree, and more intricasies, such as age of a tree, where it grew, etc., etc., etc and how to cut it and when to cut it (such as on a full moon) before selecting the right wood for the right use. Pick correctly, such as using the same shake as the giant tree that umbrellas itself over the home, and no seasoning was necessary.

    When Notre Dame was built there were still ancient forests to pull 1st growth trees out of and use for its construction.
    Impress me. Teach me why you cut down a tree on a full moon.

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  13. #22
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    Quote Originally Posted by kaldaniels View Post
    Impress me. Teach me why you cut down a tree on a full moon.
    Here are a couple of moontime references, though not specifically cutting a tree down on a full moon, but I hope they provide enough to describe the moon's cycle in reference to cutting wood:

    First:

    From "Eric Sloane's America" series, a 1954 book on "American Barns & Covered Bridges", pp. 64:

    "There was an early saying that shingles laid in the dark of the moon would never warm (thus expand and crack), and there are still "shinglin' nights" among the mountain folk of the South. Whether it is superstition or science is problematical, but some of the old pine-moss roofs laid in the dark of the moon are still flat and waterproof after a hundred years of weather."


    Second:

    From the same book, pp. 13-14 (no google search, but from a book of mine):

    "It seems strange that with all our modern methods (1954), today's lumber is so very inferior to that used two hundred years ago. Even the best of modern kiln-dried wood cannot equal the keeping quality of wood as "prepared" by the early craftsmen. If you doubt this, try to buy an absolutely straight ruler today; hold any so-called straight-edged new piece of wood up to your eye and you will frequently find a curve that will increase with years. Yet some old houses have pine doors only a half inch thick by twenty-four inches wide that are as straight as the day they were cut, even without bracing. This was no accident, for the early settlers knew their wood. Their wood wisdom began the moment the tree was cut. If cut at the right time, some insisted that lengthy "seasoning" was less important, often unnecessary. An old almanac states, "If you'd have your flatboards lay, hewe them out in March or Maye." During the "old moon of February" the New England woods rang with ax blows, for, according to belief, that was the right time for cutting timber that would stand forever straight and unwarped. It has even been suggested that the word "seasoned" as in "seasoned wood" has reference to wood having been cut during the proper season of the year. We are not in an age of folklore, but be it superstition or science, the results have certainly been interesting: the New England Farmer says, "The moon has potential influence in the various parts of her orbits, that by cutting one tree three hours before the new moon and another of the same kind of tree six hours afterwards, a difference in the soundness of the timber would be noticed." "When the moon is new to full," reads an old almanac proverb, "timber fibers warp and pull." There were rules even for cutting firewood, for an entry for January 6, 1799, in an early Almanac advises, "At this quarter of the moon, cut fire wood to prevent it from snapping and throwing embers beyond the hearth."
    Last edited by Kingspoint; 04-16-2019 at 02:22 AM.
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    From Reuter's:

    "A centuries-old crown of thorns made from reeds and gold and the tunic worn by Saint Louis, a 13th century king of France, were saved, Notre-Dame’s top administrative cleric, Monsignor Patrick Chauvet, said. But firefighters struggled to take down some of the large paintings in time, he said."

    "The mayor of Paris, Anne Hidalgo, said at the scene that some of many artworks that were in the cathedral had been rescued and were being put in safe storage."

    "It was ransacked by rioting Protestant Huguenots in the 16th century, pillaged during the French Revolution of the 1790s and left in a state of semi-neglect. Hugo’s 1831 work led to revived interest in the cathedral and a major – partly botched – restoration that began in 1844. The wood-and-lead spire was built during that restoration, according to the cathedral’s website."
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

  16. #24
    Administrator Boss-Hog's Avatar
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    Let's keep in mind this was not posted in the political sub-forum and any posts of that nature should be limited to that area.

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  18. #25
    We are back! Assembly Hall's Avatar
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    ...and this one belongs to the Reds.

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  20. #26
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire


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  22. #27
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    Apparently the place was falling apart, desperately needed work, nobody wanted to pay for it: https://twitter.com/maggiekb1/status...rc=twsrc%5Etfw

    Government owns the building but the Church is supposed to pay for upkeep.

    http://time.com/4876087/notre-dame-c...-is-crumbling/

    Structural integrity was seriously compromised: https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/...s-is-fixing-it

    The current conditions are the result of decades of neglect and decay, due in part to an awkward arrangement between church and state, making it unclear who bears responsibility for the building's upkeep.

    Now the monument, which welcomes over 12 million visitors each year, needs an urgent structural overhaul that could cost more than $185 million. And with no one in France leading the charge to raise it, the Archdiocese of Paris has turned towards an old ally: the United States.

    “The condition of the cathedral, especially under the effect of pollution in the last decades, has strongly deteriorated,” said Michel Picaud, a Parisian-born engineer and archaeologist who is leading the fundraiser. “We have decided to finance this program of restoration with private funds."
    (Video of issues at the link)

    Lot of parallels to other things happening in the world. Maintenance is always cheaper.
    Turning and turning in the widening gyre
    The falcon cannot hear the falconer;

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  24. #28
    Rally Onion! Chip R's Avatar
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    Quote Originally Posted by Redsfaithful View Post
    Apparently the place was falling apart, desperately needed work, nobody wanted to pay for it: https://twitter.com/maggiekb1/status...rc=twsrc%5Etfw

    Government owns the building but the Church is supposed to pay for upkeep.

    http://time.com/4876087/notre-dame-c...-is-crumbling/

    Structural integrity was seriously compromised: https://news.vice.com/en_us/article/...s-is-fixing-it
    I heard that too. Makes you wonder.
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    I was wrong
    Quote Originally Posted by Raisor View Post
    Chip is right

  25. #29
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    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

  26. #30
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    Re: Notre Dame Cathedral in France is on fire

    So, kaldaniels, your silent response to my answer to why people from earlier centuries believed there were benefits to cutting trees and wood in accordance to the cycles of the Moon leads me to respond with; when you asked, "Why?", were you looking for an explanation or an argument?
    "One problem with people who have no vices is that they're pretty sure to have some annoying virtues."

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