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Thread: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

  1. #61
    Member STLWizard's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Klu View Post
    While Rolen is mostly loved in Cincinnati, and Pujols and even Molina are grudgingly respected, Edmonds is hated by the fans in Cincinnati. As mentioned, his short tour with the Reds didn't go well, and he blamed the Reds medical staff for his body breaking down. There was also a lot of bad blood from the Brandon Phillips/Yadier Molina brawl, when a lot of people here thought he was supporting the wrong team, and didn't have his current teammates' backs.
    Totally understand. If the roles were reversed I’d feel the same way. I didn’t realize it was like that.
    To me it’s little things like that that make the game fun. The little parts of rivalries. And the Reds / Cards have a good rivalry that goes back further than my 30 years.

    I know you guys probably don’t like Yadi either but I’ve heard him say he enjoys playing in Cincinnati.

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  3. #62
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Servo View Post
    Pretty much this.

    The problem is that Jocketty had no real backup plan after things started to fall apart in 2014. The attempt at "going for it" in 2015 seems really misguided, and was the kind of thing that the people involved really should have known better than to do. They were the ones who knew better than anybody due to their conversations with his representation that Cueto was not going to re-sign, holding onto him only hurt the team in the long run.

    If I had a particular criticism of Jocketty from 2010-2013, where I think he mostly did good work, it's that I think he (or ownership) got too attached to their core guys. And I don't even mean in the big contract sense but just in not being aggressive and looking to genuinely upgrade the team as much as possible even if it meant shipping out someone they really liked.
    I'll always think of Walt as the guy who thought a pitching coach could take the Reds to a pennant. No experience at all and horrible. The deal with Homer and firing Dusty seals it (not a big Dusty fan, but the replacement was simply horrible). Of course, we did the same thing last year, but Bell seems to at least have some baseball knowledge.
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  4. #63
    Knowledge Is Good Big Klu's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by STLWizard View Post
    Totally understand. If the roles were reversed I’d feel the same way. I didn’t realize it was like that.
    To me it’s little things like that that make the game fun. The little parts of rivalries. And the Reds / Cards have a good rivalry that goes back further than my 30 years.

    I know you guys probably don’t like Yadi either but I’ve heard him say he enjoys playing in Cincinnati.
    I think most Reds fans have made peace with Molina. I wouldn't say there is great affection for him, but there is respect. (He earned some points this weekend with his sincere concern for Tucker Barnhart when Barnhart got hit in the head with the pitch.)
    Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.

  5. #64
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Klu View Post
    While Rolen is mostly loved in Cincinnati, and Pujols and even Molina are grudgingly respected, Edmonds is hated by the fans in Cincinnati. As mentioned, his short tour with the Reds didn't go well, and he blamed the Reds medical staff for his body breaking down. There was also a lot of bad blood from the Brandon Phillips/Yadier Molina brawl, when a lot of people here thought he was supporting the wrong team, and didn't have his current teammates' backs.
    Klu, I don't remember anything Edmonds did during the Great Brawl of 2010. Can you expand on what the did to make people think he took the wrong side of that fight? Not doubting you, just don't remember and am intrigued.

  6. #65
    Backup First Baseman OGB's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by JFLegal View Post
    no, trading 6+ years of didi for one year of choo was not a good deal. it was a very bad one.
    Keep in mind that in 2013 the Reds had 5 years of control of Zack Cozart, who while not a world beater, was mostly as good or better than Didi from 2015-17.
    2013-14 they were both mediocre to bad, but Didi only appeared in 180 games total for the Dbacks those two years.
    Also, Didi being more productive in 2013 doesn't matter because having Choo was what made that team a WS threat, a slight upgrade at SS and no Choo would've done nothing.
    Last edited by OGB; 08-19-2019 at 05:44 PM.
    (Referring to Jack Hannahan signing with a Korean team)
    Since there are no teams on the moon, I guess South Korea's far enough from Cincinnati to satisfy me.
    -RichRed

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  8. #66
    Backup First Baseman OGB's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Another thing worth keeping in mind, when the Reds traded Grandal, they had both him and Mesaroco, and Mes was pretty unanimously considered at least a slightly better prospect if I remember correctly.
    Keeping Grandal would've turned out better, but at the time of the trade, including Mes would've been surrendering more prospect capital.
    (Referring to Jack Hannahan signing with a Korean team)
    Since there are no teams on the moon, I guess South Korea's far enough from Cincinnati to satisfy me.
    -RichRed

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  10. #67
    Backup First Baseman OGB's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by STLWizard View Post
    Ahhh, I love Eddy!! I think heíd be a great manager. He knows so much about the game. If you donít mind me asking why do you think heíd be a bad coach?
    I know he's a dbag from a personal encounter with him.

    He also stayed at the Westin hotel after the Reds acquired him and my friend valeted his car over a dozen times and Edmonds never tipped once.
    (Referring to Jack Hannahan signing with a Korean team)
    Since there are no teams on the moon, I guess South Korea's far enough from Cincinnati to satisfy me.
    -RichRed

  11. #68
    Knowledge Is Good Big Klu's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by foster15 View Post
    Klu, I don't remember anything Edmonds did during the Great Brawl of 2010. Can you expand on what the did to make people think he took the wrong side of that fight? Not doubting you, just don't remember and am intrigued.
    He didn't get involved at all. He just sort of stood around. He seemed to be more interested in making sure his Cardinals buddies were all well and good. Later, he made some vague comments that were less than supportive of Phillips. It just seemed like he didn't have his new teammates' backs.
    Eric Stratton, Rush Chairman. Damn glad to meet ya.

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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Klu View Post
    He didn't get involved at all. He just sort of stood around. He seemed to be more interested in making sure his Cardinals buddies were all well and good. Later, he made some vague comments that were less than supportive of Phillips. It just seemed like he didn't have his new teammates' backs.
    He also smack talked his former Reds teammates after the season and said he went to the Reds as a “favor to Walt” and basically acted like he did the Reds a solid solely via his presence with such a lowly organization. Because God knows he set the world on fire with his .207 average and getting hurt during a home tun trot.

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  15. #70
    Goober GAC's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    All I can say is that I got to watch two of the finest defensive SS's of my generation in Concepcion and Ozzie!

    "In my day you had musicians who experimented with drugs. Now it's druggies experimenting with music" - Alfred G Clark (circa 1972)

  16. #71
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by JFLegal View Post
    no, trading 6+ years of didi for one year of choo was not a good deal. it was a very bad one.
    Disagree, it was a great trade. Choo made the Reds a world series contender.
    Having Didi around during the tanking years (and this year) would not have made a difference.
    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

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  18. #72
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    Disagree, it was a great trade. Choo made the Reds a world series contender.
    Having Didi around during the tanking years (and this year) would not have made a difference.
    the 2013 reds were not a world series contender.

    and if they were, hopefully the general manager would have done something once the starting left fielder went down with a serious injury.

  19. #73
    Goober GAC's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by JFLegal View Post
    the 2013 reds were not a world series contender.
    They went 90-72 in '13. Tough division that year too, with three teams making the post-season. IMO, if you make the post-season you're a contender. Maybe not a serious one, but stranger things have happened once one makes it. You never know.

    I'd maybe understand your argument better, concerning Didi, but what did the Reds miss out on? Have you looked at Didi's numbers over the next three years after the trade? They were terrible. He didn't start putting it together until the '16 season where he showed some pop (20 Hrs). So the Reds were suppose to endure approximately 4 years of that till the light came on? Don't know too many teams that would do that. AZ didn't.

    I don't understand why some are so enamored with this guy, as if the Reds really screwed up on this one, with a career line (seven seasons) of ... .267 .316 .431 .747


    and if they were, hopefully the general manager would have done something once the starting left fielder went down with a serious injury.
    I don't understand why you keep harping on this my friend? Like it was some sort of cardinal sin (pun intended). Any time a starter goes down it hurts. It's really easy to say "He should have done something!". You make it sound so easy for a GM to find a replacement for a starter once they go down. The whole reason Ludwick was on our team was because we were somewhat lean in the OF department to begin with. Our farm system's only OF talent at that time was a young kid named Billy Hamilton (LOL). And when one goes down at the early stages of the season, like Ludwick did, that makes it even harder when it comes to finding a trade of quality to replace Ludwick. Market ain't too active.

    But you also have to consider the fact that this owner upped the payroll pretty substantially during those years we were in that play-off window. And that includes signing Ludwick. What was the financial cost? But whose to say the Reds wouldn't have paid it if someone were available? I just don't think there was at that time.
    Last edited by GAC; 08-22-2019 at 07:29 AM.
    "In my day you had musicians who experimented with drugs. Now it's druggies experimenting with music" - Alfred G Clark (circa 1972)

  20. #74
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by foster15 View Post
    In my lifetime, twice the Reds snatched up their GM from the Cardinals. One time it worked and one time it didn't. Walt is the latter.
    If making the playoffs 4 times is "not working out", I hope all our GMs "don't work out"
    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  21. #75
    Member americanoutlaw1's Avatar
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    Re: How do Reds fans feel about Walt Jocketty?

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREAD View Post
    If making the playoffs 4 times is "not working out", I hope all our GMs "don't work out"
    It was two playoffs and a play-in game.


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