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Thread: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

  1. #151
    THAT'S A FACT JACK!! GAC's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Sunrise doesn't last all morning
    A cloudburst doesn't last all day
    Seems my love is up and has left you with no warning
    It's not always going to be this grey

    All things must pass
    All things must pass away

    Sunset doesn't last all evening
    A mind can blow those clouds away
    After all this, my love is up and must be leaving
    It's not always going to be this grey

    All things must pass
    All things must pass away
    All things must pass
    None of life's strings can last
    So, I must be on my way
    And face another day

    Now the darkness only stays the night-time
    In the morning it will fade away
    Daylight is good at arriving at the right time
    It's not always going to be this grey

    All things must pass
    All things must pass away
    All things must pass
    All things must pass away
    Last edited by GAC; 10-13-2004 at 08:15 AM.
    "panic" only comes from having real expectations

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  3. #152
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Quote Originally Posted by kheidg-
    Does anyone actually think that Barry will go elsewhere to sign? Would any team make him their #1 short stop?
    1) Maybe - I have a hard time seeing someone else offer anything but a minor league deal
    2) No

  4. #153
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Quote Originally Posted by WVRedsFan
    That is my hope also. I won't argue that Larkin is the superior of every infielder we have when he is healthy. I won't argue that keeping Juan Castro and giving the boot to Larkin (for essentially the same money) is way stupid. Almost criminal.

    I will say that sometimes you have to understand that when it's time to go, you need to do it when you are on top. My father retired young and when asked why, he always said, "because I'm still productive. I don't want anyone talking behind my back on how that old fart is losing it."

    I wish so much that this FO had the ability to manage public relations with the general public and the players, but they do not. The ideal thing would have been to give Larkin some position with the Reds, but instead, they chose to not communicate with him, so Barry communicated for them. There should have been a way to have ended this thing without the bloodshed. These guys are so clueless it defies explanation.

    But I hope Barry does the right thing and hangs it up, but I doubt there is any chance in that happening. He's been wounded by this organization. He has something to prove.
    Even the press couldn't find where the Reds dropped the ball on this one. Not sure what they did wrong. The World Series hasn't even started and they already made a decision and let him know their intentions. They said that contract talks would occur in the offseason, this is the offseason. Give him a front office position? When he is still going to pursue playing? Not sure what more the Reds could do.

    Let's review. They sign him up for one more year after he said he wanted to play more one year, the Reds (Linder says uncle after Reik sits on him after Barry sits on him) buckled. They set up a party for him, he eventually says ok, but then "thanks, but no thanks." Fine, they cancel the party. The handwriting is on the wall late in the year. We're out of the race, Lopez is finally showing promise (Daugherty calls him a suspect? Does he go to games? Did he see him play the last half of the season? Anyway, I digress), and they want to see what Machado has to offer. So Larkin gets his panties in a bunch because they want to see the young guys on a regular basis AND COMMUNICATE THAT TO HIM. He didn't like what he heard, so he stuck his bottom lip out and started talking.

    Yea, I can certainly see where the Reds screwed Barry on this one And I can certainly see why folks would expect him to accept that role more gracefully next season. Sort of like expecting John Kerry to keep his "plan."

  5. #154
    I thought you'd be bigger OldXOhio's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Perhaps Lark and Junior would look good together in Tampa Bay teal.
    Originally Posted by nate
    Chapman can be downright pornographic at times.

  6. #155
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    I remember the debacle in St. Louis when the Birds brought in a replacement for Oz(it was Clayton) and then Ozzie decides he doesn't want to retire. Clayton ended up being the bad guy and ended up getting run out of town and the Cards ended up playing an over-the-hill Smith.

    If the Reds are committed to playing Lopez at SS next year then there is no reason to keep larkin around. Because whenever Lopez would struggle out would go the call to put Larkin in there. It is not fair to a young player to have them constantly looking over their shoulder and that is exactly what would be going on if Larkin was on the bench. I think they decided it was time to move forward and no looking back.

  7. #156
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Here it is point blank...they made an agreement with Larkin last year that this would be his final year and they scheduled a day for him. It was his choice to cancel it, not the Reds'. The Reds made it clear last year that this year would be it. It's time to move on. Larkin would have never accepted a utility role here...and the Reds can't have their shortstop hopefully play 100 games. It's time....I don't feel the least bit sorry for Barry Larkin. I enjoyed watching him play, but the Reds paid him about 10-15 million more over his last multi-year deal than anyone in baseball would have paid him. Larkin had his chance here to go out with fan fare, but he chose to go another direction. Good luck to him, but it's time to move on...I agree with the Reds' decision.

    Amem brother. Larkin had the choice of going out in style with a Barry Larkin day or go out kicking and screaming. He choose kicking and screaming.

    Bottom line is the last three years Larkin pretty much was washed up as a player. Injuries were counted on more frequently each year. His defensive range was very limited. And even though he could still swing the bat, you couldn't count on him playing everyday because of the injuries.

    Like someone said, this reminds me of the Ozzie Smith situtation with the Cardinals when it was time to pass the torch to Royce Clayton. Some players just don't know when it is time to go.
    If you think small, you'll go nowhere in life.

  8. #157
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Quote Originally Posted by traderumor
    Even the press couldn't find where the Reds dropped the ball on this one. Not sure what they did wrong. The World Series hasn't even started and they already made a decision and let him know their intentions. They said that contract talks would occur in the offseason, this is the offseason. Give him a front office position? When he is still going to pursue playing? Not sure what more the Reds could do.

    Let's review. They sign him up for one more year after he said he wanted to play more one year, the Reds (Linder says uncle after Reik sits on him after Barry sits on him) buckled. They set up a party for him, he eventually says ok, but then "thanks, but no thanks." Fine, they cancel the party. The handwriting is on the wall late in the year. We're out of the race, Lopez is finally showing promise (Daugherty calls him a suspect? Does he go to games? Did he see him play the last half of the season? Anyway, I digress), and they want to see what Machado has to offer. So Larkin gets his panties in a bunch because they want to see the young guys on a regular basis AND COMMUNICATE THAT TO HIM. He didn't like what he heard, so he stuck his bottom lip out and started talking.

    Yea, I can certainly see where the Reds screwed Barry on this one And I can certainly see why folks would expect him to accept that role more gracefully next season. Sort of like expecting John Kerry to keep his "plan."
    Couldn't have said it much better myself....the Reds did nothing wrong here. Larkin really just got upset because this is the first time he hasn't been able to play on the fans to get the organization to buckle. He shouldn't say a word edgewise....what he should do is give a team that would have given him 27 million over 3 years when he got it. Then, give him one more year when he wanted. Now he gets mad because he wants another year. It is the Reds' right to do what they want to do...they don't owe him anything.

  9. #158
    Be the ball Roy Tucker's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Yeah, I think the Reds made the right decision. Barry pretty well painted himself into a corner.

    My only quibble is that the Reds owed it to Barry to bring him in 100 Main St., sit him down, have a cup of coffee, and tell him the news. A phone call after 19 years seems a little cold and impersonal.

    If Barry would have been seen taking balls at 2B and 3B or in the OF and preparing for the super-sub role, then I think he'd have a leg to stand on.

    But I think Barry in his heart of hearts still thinks he should be the starting SS and the other guys ought to be playing 2b, 3b, and OF.

    If Lopez/Machado would have struggled, Barry would have piped up and said "I can play". And sulked if he didn't.

    The Reds need to move on at SS and quit using Barry as a security blanket. Too disruptive.

    Pay attention to the open sky

  10. #159
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85
    absurd.

    What will cause them to want to stay - winning
    What will cause them to want to leave - continued losing
    1. They aren't going to be a winning organization any time soon
    2. Have you ever worked at a "successful" organization that made it very unpleasant to work there? It's not fun, believe me.
    3. This FO has a long history of not even trying to win. Remember this summer, how the players were dreading a potential fire sale. They all were assuming any salary that could be moved would be. How do you think that would motivate them.
    4. The team knows that even if they are in first or second place at the deadline, they are getting no help, but their rivals are.

    What exactly makes this franchise any better than Pittsburg or Milwaukee?
    Look objectively. There's no difference. If you were a player, would you want to go to Milwaukee (or Cincy?)
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  11. #160
    smells of rich mahogany deltachi8's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    I have no problem with this decision in my head, my heart, yes, but that is what it is. I do think the Reds knew this was the way they were going to go and could have/should have let Barry know in September. OK, sticking to the policy of no negotiations/comments on FAs until after the season, but sometimes, a 19 year vet deserves a little more consideraion.

    As a baseball decision, it was time to make it. As long as Castro does NOT come back, I have no problmes with moving to the future.

    Thank You, Barry for memories and being a part of my favorite Red's team of all time.
    Nothing to see here. Please disperse.

  12. #161
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    So the Reds letting larkin go will cause other Reds to want to leave?

    Has anyone ever left a job because a co-worker left the company?

  13. #162
    smells of rich mahogany deltachi8's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Quote Originally Posted by flyer85
    So the Reds letting larkin go will cause other Reds to want to leave?

    Has anyone ever left a job because a co-worker left the company?
    Yes, i have seen that happen. However, i dont think that will be the case here. Players will leave for more $$ elsewhere, Barry Larkin or not.
    Nothing to see here. Please disperse.

  14. #163
    He has the Evil Eye! flyer85's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    If the Reds actually made a serious playoff run next year the fact that Larkin isn't around would be completely forgotten.

  15. #164
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    Winning cures alot of problems.
    If you think small, you'll go nowhere in life.

  16. #165
    Unsolicited Opinions traderumor's Avatar
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    Re: AP is reporting that Larkin is not coming back...

    If you were a player, would you want to go to Milwaukee (or Cincy?)
    Why not? As long as the check clears, I am playing major league baseball and making a good dime doing it . I'm a "gamer" (whatever that means), so I would be convinced that I was good enough to turn this thing around, that I would be a key part of doing that. If I'm a pitcher, I look at the young bats in the middle of the lineup and salivate. I would ask management what they intend to do to improve my infield defense if I'm a pitcher, though. Then, I put on my uniform every day, work my butt off to perform at the top of my ability, and let the coaches coach, the umpires umpire, the executives manage, the broadcasters broadcast, and the sportswriters write about my exploits on the field and keep my opinions about the business side of things to myself. Find a few of those guys, especially ones that can pitch, and you have yourself an exciting young team with a high ceiling.

    BTW, I think way too much is made of "why would anyone want to play here?" in case you were wondering. While there are certainly improvements that could be made for the players' work environment, much of the grumping you hear from Reds are matters that are none of their business, like who is playing on their team, who gets traded, etc. But then, once you have a few losing seasons, everyone and their brother, including the players, think they could do a better job of running a big league franchise.


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