Sad, but true and that is why this is a good deal IMO. Paul Wilson cannot be your best SP to start the year.Originally Posted by CougarQuest
Sad, but true and that is why this is a good deal IMO. Paul Wilson cannot be your best SP to start the year.
I like the trade more if we get some cash, but something tells me no. Anyways, its ok, as a first step, but some sort of male intuition (no, not that kind) tells me that there is more to come from the desk of O'Brien.
So, not quite two thumbs down, not quite two thumbs up, but:thumbdown
ROTATION
Ramon Ortiz
Paul Wilson
Aaron Harang
Luke Hudson
Brandon Claussen
Josh Hancock takes over the Van Poppel role.
BULLPEN
Graves
R.Wagner
Acevedo
Valentine
Riedling?
Mercker?
Weathers?
Burba?
Norton?
LOUISVILLE
Coffey
Bong
Belisle
Shakelford
Good point, but I think there are other reasons the Reds could not sign Clement.
We aren't gonna see Clement in a Reds uni next year, Wheels, as much as you and I and just about everyone on this board wanted to. I think this is a decent move for the Reds, nothing earth shattering. Hopefully Ortiz will get a huge boost of confidence by going from the 7th or 8th best pitcher on a club to being the 2nd or 3rd best pitcher on a club.
To start with.
Though figuring out the Reds staff on Memorial Day is the real trick.
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
Did anyone noticed how well he pitched against the Yankees last year...and in years prior to that?
He seems to be able to get his game up when he has to....now it is of matter of doing it consistently ...so he does not have to worry about going to the pen.
Of course they aren't going to get Clement, but my point is they should be spending more wisely.
I'm not so sure about a confidence boost, either. Remember he was just traded from a pennant contender to a cellar dweller for a minor league player.
Maybe he'll be the next Jose Guillen (but a pitcher), but he could also become the next Ruben Sierra as well.
It's an iffy deal, but it's all we've got right now and at least we won't see Josh Hancock start twenty or more games.
How about Skully's later on to discuss this in a more innebriated state?
"Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?" ~ Jim Bouton
DanO - zero value over replacement GM.Okay so besides losing Moseley, they've in effect signed two free agent pitchers worth nearly or more than seven million...And Matt Clement wanted eight million?
Let's face it folks, these kiss-your-sister trades are why Allen hired him.
Allen didn't hire him, he wanted Krivisky.
And this isn't a kiss your sister trade. You REALLY think you would want to spend 5 million on Ortiz?
Just looked this up. In Ortiz's career year, 2002, he posted a 3.77 ERA. Outside of that season he hasn't been lower than 4.36 (2001).
Traditional thinking would be that he did something right in 2002 that he might be able to repeat. Wrong. He did have a higher than normal 6.7 K/9, which surely helped that ERA, but the real reason his ERA was so low was a .241 BABIP, good for fourth in MLB ERA qualifiers that season behind Derek Lowe, Damian Moss and Tim Wakefield (note the two career years there).
Simply put, the guy had some hit luck one season and looked better than he really is because of it. Unless he gets it again, he's an inconsequential-to-bad pitcher.
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
Another Cory Lidle?
This smacks of last offseason.
"Baseball players are smarter than football players. How often do you see a baseball team penalized for too many men on the field?" ~ Jim Bouton
But there is always the possilibity he does 2002 all over again in the National League no less thinks Dan O'brien. DanO is a tool loving Fascist in the game of baseball, not a SABRE driven GM. He probably loves Ramon (baby Pedro) tools and thinks he can rebound in the pitching friendly National league.
I think Lance is a bit off on his math. In 1976 they drew 2.6M - and they were just counting butts in the seats then, not tickets sold like they do now. So that was probably more along the lines of 3M. In 1990 they drew 2.4M. The economy of baseball was as different to the economy of baseball today as apples is to bricks. Free agency didn't begin until after that season. If people believe that the Reds are drawing just fine and shouldn't have to start non tendering players like D'Lo then they shouldn't say that Lindner should open up his wallet and spend more on the team. If that's the case the Reds should be making tens of millions of dollars and they should be spending as much as the Cubs, Cards and Astros are.
But that wouldn't be because of his ability. It would be the result of luck. Any mediocre pitcher the Reds throw out there is just as likely to experience thesame level of luck, and for a lot less (see Haynes, Jimmy circa 2002).
Grape works as a soda. Sort of as a gum. I wonder why it doesn't work as a pie. Grape pie? There's no grape pie. - Larry David
That's the thing, Ortiz didn't do anything to make 2002 happen. He just happened to have stricken ball find fielders at an abnormally high rate. He could pitch another 30 years and never get within 30 points of being that lucky again.
If DanO thinks he sees tools, tools that will make 2002 a repeatable thing, then he's chasing a mirage.
I'm not a system player. I am a system.
Posting Permissions
|
Board Moderators may, at their discretion and judgment, delete and/or edit any messages that violate any of the following guidelines: 1. Explicit references to alleged illegal or unlawful acts. 2. Graphic sexual descriptions. 3. Racial or ethnic slurs. 4. Use of edgy language (including masked profanity). 5. Direct personal attacks, flames, fights, trolling, baiting, name-calling, general nuisance, excessive player criticism or anything along those lines. 6. Posting spam. 7. Each person may have only one user account. It is fine to be critical here - that's what this board is for. But let's not beat a subject or a player to death, please. |
