Lidle traded

[Barbarossa]

I was looking at the Phillies 40 and came up with (which, turns out, pretty much sounds like what Stewie said)

Eric Junge: 27 year old righthanded pitcher with major league experience. Starter or reliever. Had shoulder surgery last year.

Juan Richardson: 25 year old 3B who had a severe ankle sprain last year. Looks like this guy has some serious power potential.

Franklin Perez: 26 year old righthanded pitcher who missed all of last year with elbow surgery.

I think it would be a coup if O'Brien were able to get 21 year old right handed pitcher Elizardo Ramierz or 23 year old right handed pitcher Keith Bucktrot.

I'm guessing it'll be Franklin Perez. He already has his elbow surgery out of the way. :gac:

[Falls City Beer]

From a team as desperate as the Phillies, we should have at least gotten a AA performer of considerable upside.

[CougarQuest]

Franklin is 0-4 with AAA, 5.29 ERA

[WVRedsFan]

I guess the youth movement is on big time.

I was thinking tonight who I would keep on the Reds if I had my druthers. I came up with Casey, Dunn, Griffey, Kearns, Pena, and Kearns (maybe Freel and Jiminez) on the position player side. As far as pitchers, it took a lot of thought. Wagner, Harang, Claussen, and I got stumped. I'm sure a lot of younger guys in our farm system could come up and give us a 5+ ERA and a real schelacking once in awhile--for a lot less money. I'm not upset. I just wish they had pulled the trigger on Dempster last year and...gosh the list is just too long to type.

I may be stupid, but this team is never, ever going to buy up the stud free agent pitchers. Never. Given the choices, and it may take some time (and time is short for this old guy), youth is the way to go.

[CougarQuest]

Hey maybe we can get Ed Yarnall back

[oregonred]

Because, unless I'm completely misreading a number of posts on this thread, the Phils put in a Waiver Claim on Lidle.

After that, it's either "Work out a deal", "Pull him back", or "Lose him for nothing". Considering the dynamic, I have a difficult time believing that the Reds worked out a more equitable deal than the Phillies (or others) had on the table before the deadline.

This may sound weird, but I think O'Brien won this deal from a talent value/talent perspective. But I think he lost talent versus what he might have been able to have before he was limited to trading with only one team.

Good posts. I would agree with your good insight here other than maybe the Phils were more desperate on Aug 8th than July 31st sensing the Braves pulling away and minus Millwood, the Phils GM isn't very savvy and Lidle finally tossed a decent game again yesterday in Coors Field?? Too bad Lidle didn't toss a gem right before the deadline...

Assuming the Phils are paying Lidle's freight bill the rest of the way?

[KronoRed]

Hey maybe we can get Ed Yarnall back

Get some cash if we sell him to Japan again

[Red Leader]

The PTBN in the deal that sent Cory Lidle to the Phillies could be RHP Elizardo Ramirez, or RHP Keith Bucktrot.

Indications are that the player is a member of the Phillies' 40-man roster, and as such would need to clear waivers before going to Cincinnati. Aug. 10 - 8:16 am et


This is from Rotoworld.com. Since Stewie has pointed out that it can't be Ramirez, my guess is that it is Bucktrot. From what I said earlier, "I will consider O'Brien a below average GM for this team until he acquires a prospect like Claussen in trade," well that might happen right here if Bucktrot is the man.

[Doc. Scott]

Why is Bucktrot so great again? His numbers don't really show it.

He was a 3rd-round pick in 2000 out of an Oklahoma high school. Seems to have had control problems early on, but they seem to have improved. Still, after a good 2003 where he had a 3.33 ERA in High-A and a 2.56 mark in seven AA starts, he's 4-5, 4.46 in 15 AA starts in 2004 with 105 hits allowed in 78.2 innings and only 41 Ks. 30 walks is okay, but that's a really low K ratio, and his previous years weren't hugely better.

http://www.sports-wired.com/players/....asp?Name=EHBB

http://www.baseballamerica.com/cgi-b...layer=bucktrot

I guess he's better than Junge or Perez, but not much.

[Red Leader]

Well, Bucktrot might not be an "outstanding" prospect to acquire by himself, but the idea that O'Brien could acquire him, and 2 Single A players with some upside for a pitcher like Cory Lidle has me feeling a little better about having O'Brien as our GM. I didn't think he was capable of negotiating a trade like this. Glad to see I was wrong.

[Doc. Scott]

I'm not expecting the guy to be on par with Gavin Floyd or whoever, but Stewie was talking up Bucktrot as having some potential. I was wondering where he heard that.

[Stewie]

The PTBN in the deal that sent Cory Lidle to the Phillies could be RHP Elizardo Ramirez, or RHP Keith Bucktrot.

Indications are that the player is a member of the Phillies' 40-man roster, and as such would need to clear waivers before going to Cincinnati. Aug. 10 - 8:16 am et


This is from Rotoworld.com. Since Stewie has pointed out that it can't be Ramirez, my guess is that it is Bucktrot. From what I said earlier, "I will consider O'Brien a below average GM for this team until he acquires a prospect like Claussen in trade," well that might happen right here if Bucktrot is the man.

If it is Bucktrot, I will go insane. Seriously. I mean, nothing would shock me anymore w/the way Ed Wade operates, but if he just "throws in" a prospect as good as Bucktrot, I will lose even more respect for the guy. I wouldn't have traded Bucktrot for Lidle straight up. I'm going to stick by my original belief that it will be Junge. He has pitched in the majors before, and could pitch long relief in the majors now, if not for the injury. My prediction is O'Brien gets Junge and says that he is "major league ready," so he doesn't get heavily criticized for trading Lidle for two guys playing in single-A. He will try to save some face and have a guy who can contribute to the big league club (as soon as he comes back from injury). FWIW, a writer from the Philadelphia Inquirer this morning said that the PTBNL will probably have to clear waivers b/c they are on the 40 man roster. He then said it could be Elizardo Ramirez or Bucktrot, meaning that in reality it will be anyone BUT Bucktrot or Ramirez (who I still don't think is even eligible). Sadly, the media here is horribly inaccurate and is very poor. If it ain't about the Eagles, they just don't know.

[Buckeye33]

Why is Bucktrot so great again? His numbers don't really show it.

He was a 3rd-round pick in 2000 out of an Oklahoma high school. Seems to have had control problems early on, but they seem to have improved. Still, after a good 2003 where he had a 3.33 ERA in High-A and a 2.56 mark in seven AA starts, he's 4-5, 4.46 in 15 AA starts in 2004 with 105 hits allowed in 78.2 innings and only 41 Ks. 30 walks is okay, but that's a really low K ratio, and his previous years weren't hugely better.

http://www.sports-wired.com/players/....asp?Name=EHBB

http://www.baseballamerica.com/cgi-b...layer=bucktrot

I guess he's better than Junge or Perez, but not much.

Well, he's a 23 year old who is in AA ball which is not at all a bad thing. He pitched well last year and hasn't responded the way you might like this season. He isn't a strikeout pitcher, but seems to know how to pitch.

Again I'll bring up the fact that this is Cory Lidel that we got these 3 players for. I consider that they each have at least a fair shot at making it to the bigs, and if just one of them become productive for just 1 full season, they have provided more than Cory Lidle ever did as a Red.

[Red Leader]

Hey, thanks Stewie for your input on this thread. I really appreciate your perspective from Philly on this deal. I also enjoyed your last statement about the Philly media and the Eagles. My wife was in training in Philly this year and we went to visit her there. I read the newspaper both days I was there and I couldn't believe the articles written about the Phillies. They were either inaccurate or incompetent on baseball to write such articles (this was in May when Philly was really struggling)

[CougarQuest]

Here's hoping that Stewie has to get a prescription of Xanax