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Thread: Sully to Chi Sox with $$$ For PTBNL

  1. #91
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    Sounds to me like the Reds are trying to make sure they don't have to pay anybody to play in 2004. When Larson did so poorly they had a problem: how to cover third base next year without shelling out any money. Probably Zeile wanted to be paid, so he was not an option.

    So the Reds divert from the "pitching, pitching, pitching" plan to take somebody who may be able to play third and won't require much money.

    On a positive note, at least in the minors, Hummel seems like a hitter who doesn't strike out too much. The Reds could use a few of those. Even if he is not a dynamic power guy.

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  3. #92
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Kc61
    Sounds to me like the Reds are trying to make sure they don't have to pay anybody to play in 2004. When Larson did so poorly they had a problem: how to cover third base next year without shelling out any money. Probably Zeile wanted to be paid, so he was not an option.

    .

    I hope you're not complaining about Zeile not being an option.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  4. #93
    Churlish Johnny Footstool's Avatar
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    Sounds like Danny isn't happy, per ESPN.com:

    Sullivan left a team that is 14 games under .500 and joined a club in the thick of the AL Central race. His departure left several Reds visibly upset -- pitcher Danny Graves was even crying.


    "When I heard what we got for him, I nearly threw up. We've been best friends since 1997, since I've been here. It hurts. I don't know how to think of it right now,'' said Graves, the losing pitcher Thursday night against Arizona.
    "I prefer books and movies where the conflict isn't of the extreme cannibal apocalypse variety I guess." Redsfaithful

  5. #94
    Dunnilicious creek14's Avatar
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    Originally posted by KronoRed
    I say call him up and give him 3rd for the rest of the year.
    So if we call him up now, will the back of his jersey say "PTBNL"?
    Will trade this space for a #1 starter.

  6. #95
    The Lineups stink. KronoRed's Avatar
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    Originally posted by princeton
    absolutely. The best way to make a good bench player is to give him a lot of major league exposure at a young age. And the Reds have an open spot
    You read my mind!
    We need more bench players
    Go Gators!

  7. #96
    Big Red Machine RedsBaron's Avatar
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    Originally posted by Johnny Footstool
    Sounds like Danny isn't happy, per ESPN.com:
    Hey, if Graves, with a 4-14 record, is unhappy, maybe he will ask for his release so he can rejoin his friends. Fine by me.
    "Hey...Dad. Wanna Have A Catch?" Kevin Costner in "Field Of Dreams."

  8. #97
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    instead of the comparisons to Ray Durham, doesn't he sound a bit like Todd Walker?

    Todd was never my favorite player, because he was forced to start. But I always thought that Todd would make a fine bench player.

  9. #98
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    Let's face it... Hummel is what he is. He's a cheap alternative at third base who may or may not have more of a clue than Larson. And that's not a bad thing. The Reds got him for an aging, declining, soon-to-be-free-agent setup man. I love what Sullivan has done, but the Reds can't afford to be sentimental. If you're going to operate on a limited budget, there's no room for "reward for time served" contracts. The last one of those we handed out (Larkin) has been crippling this team for three years.

    Best-case scenario, Hummel turns into Chris Sabo--a .270 guy with 20 HR power who plays hard and does a fine job with the glove. Worst case scenario, he's a total bust. Either way, he's cheap--and if the Reds are going to make mistakes, they MUST be cheap mistakes. The expensive ones (Larkin, Casey, Graves, Griffey) are killing them. The team can afford a few relatively big contracts, but they have to be for the right guys. Otherwise, you're stuck with them and you have to trade away good players when their pay level gets too big. Sound familiar?

    It's time to accept reality. We can moan and complain about Lindner and Allen, but it's not going to change anything. I don't want to hear excuses about budgetsanymore. It is what it is. Work within it and find a way. Does it make it tougher? Sure. Can it be done? Obviously. So accept the situation and build a winner.

    Will Hummel be a part of that? Who knows? But he won't be the reason it doesn't work. He's a disposable part. The big ticket guys (and the front office who made the mistake of giving them those contracts) are the problems IN THE CURRENT REALITY.

    If Hummel gives you .250, 15 HRs and 70 RBIs, plays every day and fields his position, he's fine. AT HIS CURRENT SALARY. If that's what he's giving you as his salary goes up, you part ways and move on to the next disposable part. It's not what we'd all like, but it's reality.

  10. #99
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    Originally posted by REDREAD

    In fact, I'm not convinced it's a good trade either.. Isn't this Hummel guy pretty similiar to the generic replacement level guy that people claim can be picked up for free on the waiver wire?
    I can't wait to hear people complain about the guys' lack of power at 3b.
    Which is exactly what the Reds have done. If a team picks up a player off the waiver wire, the claiming team still has to pay the claimed player the league minimum (with the team that waived said player paying the rest of that year's salary).

    New everyday 3b-man? I'm not sure about that because I'm in the "Branyan for 3B" camp. But at the least, he could be a nice utility player.
    I'm not a hooligan. I'm a Reds supporter.

    Hooray Beer!

  11. #100
    Charlie Brown All-Star IslandRed's Avatar
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    I can understand why the guys aren't happy, but I'm not sure what Graves thought we were going to get. As much as Sullivan's done for this team, he's a free-agent-to-be middle reliever whose best days are likely behind him. We weren't going to get the crown jewels in return, from the Sox or anyone else.

  12. #101
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Originally posted by princeton
    instead of the comparisons to Ray Durham, doesn't he sound a bit like Todd Walker?

    Todd was never my favorite player, because he was forced to start. But I always thought that Todd would make a fine bench player.
    Walker has been an average offensive 2B for his career. Nothing wrong with being average, in the right situations.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  13. #102
    Dunnilicious creek14's Avatar
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    Originally posted by RedsBaron
    Hey, if Graves, with a 4-14 record, is unhappy, maybe he will ask for his release so he can rejoin his friends. Fine by me.
    Oh come on. Do you expect these guys to be emotionless blobs?

    All of this stuff about Sean and Danny reminds me of the kids my mom use to have in 1st grade. They were amazed to find out she went grocery shopping - they didn't realize she was a person, just like them.

    How very funny - for all the ranting that goes on here over this team, it's now unacceptable for the actual players to have opinions too.
    Will trade this space for a #1 starter.

  14. #103
    Where's my chair? REDREAD's Avatar
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    Originally posted by princeton
    instead of the comparisons to Ray Durham, doesn't he sound a bit like Todd Walker?
    Is Hummel "fool's gold"?.. I got a good laugh when you dug up that old quote of yours in that Todd Walker thread a couple days ago..

    But I really don't think a future utility man is that great of a return for Sully. I'm not ready to vomit like Graves, but we got taken here.

    I'd rather play Castro at 3b and keep Sully (and they did have an option on him, so there was no need to negotiate an extension).
    Thank you Walt and Bob for going for it in 2010-2014!

    Nov. 13, 2007: One of the greatest days in Reds history: John Allen gets the boot!

  15. #104
    RaisorZone Raisor's Avatar
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    Originally posted by REDREAD

    I'd rather play Castro at 3b and keep Sully (and they did have an option on him, so there was no need to negotiate an extension).
    Sullivan's contract had already been bought out, last year.

    He's a free agent in 2004.
    "But I do know Joey's sister indirectly (or foster sister) and I have heard stories of Joey being into shopping, designer wear, fancy coffees, and pedicures."

  16. #105
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    Originally posted by Raisor
    Walker has been an average offensive 2B for his career. Nothing wrong with being average, in the right situations.
    actually, there's a lot wrong with being an average offensive 2Bman if you can't defend the position.

    Todd would have to be a tremendous offensive player in order to offset his glove. And, as you say, he's not even above average

    there's more to playing winning baseball than offensive numbers. It may be impossible to quantify-- but that doesn't make it less true.


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